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    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    @phileasf            Or maybe, just as Zoe controls the UNIT forces in Invasion at one point (when calculating how to destroy the Cyberships), the situation requires her to take control? Maybe the soldiers are trainees and she is in full Mary Poppins mode?

    SatsumaJoe @satsumajoe

    There’s a few shots and scenes which suggest, to me, a very emotional ‘converted’ Doctor (with tech very similar to the Gunslinger’s tattoo, as suggested on episode thread) and that two Doctors theory. If not that, facing himself for something?

    Speculation but thought to put it here from views on trailers etc.

    HTPBDET @htpbdet


    I have been sent a spoilerific photo from Silver Nightmare press stuff – i have it as a jpeg but no idea how to post it here?


    Anonymous @

    @htpbdet    think you need to upload it somewhere and link to it….

    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    @fulcanelli          Thanks. Upload it to where? Sorry – am not good with technical stuff and my nephews are not here…

    SatsumaJoe @satsumajoe

    @htpbdet Flickr or ImageShack?

    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    Okay – Spoilers: do not look if you dont want to know something about Nightmare in Silver
    From inside the BBC…

    ardaraith @ardaraith



    this is random rubbish so my response will actually show-up below the activity thread preview window.  Hopefully.  fingers crossed.

    @htpbdet – That pic, and another showing the dual persona, are beguiling.  They could really stir the ‘bad Doctor’ fish into a feeding frenzy.

    Lula @lula



    SPOILERS  (If you don’t read Blogtor, that is.)


    Blogtor Who and other Who sites/Twitterers (is that a word? It is now!) are reporting that the final 4-5 minutes of The Name of the Doctor have not been made available for media screening.  Along with Moffat saying, “We’ve only just finished filming the final scene of the finale,” in a very recent interview, I’m inclined to believe we may be seeing John Hurt and/or David Tennant sooner than the 50th anniversary special.  Just my gut feeling and of course I could be wrong, but there you go.

    I’m kind of loving all the panic I’ve seen on Twitter/Facebook/Tumblr over the “reveal” of the Doctor’s name.  Does anyone here really think that’s going to be an issue?  I’m going with the theory that his name is used to unlock something…no idea what.  River will be the one saying it and we won’t hear it.  This theory is what keeps me warm at night.

    (And I didn’t know Warwick Davis was in Nightmare in Silver, so now I am all manner of excited.)

    SatsumaJoe @satsumajoe





    @ardaraith Didn’t know about that preview business! Spanner moment. But yes, that’s one of the pics I meant. Proper intriguing.

    Polaris @polaris

    Perhaps the 50th will involve Three doctors. Ten, Eleven and the newly regenerated Twelve from the end of The Name of The Doctor!

    As an aside, as I saw in The Snowmen, TCH had a dirty TARDIS again, the Doctor commented on it this time!

    Zaphod @zaphod



    Spoiler discussion…………..




    I read that about the previews earlier but never made that connect. I am all kinds of excited at that thought.


    Anonymous @

    @htpbdet (and others)

    spoilerery spoilers McSpoilerson




    that pic and a whole rafter of others available here


    However, while that particular pic does invite lots of speculation in a certain direction, I’m wondering if it is in fact Moffatt pulling the collective Fish chain. And considering the title, whether it is in fact some kind of dream/nightmare sequence…

    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    @jimthefish       Yep – he is pulling the Fish chain…for sure. Some sort of dream or other reality or higher consciousness – perhaps part of the fight for conversion of the Doctor to full Cyber-mode?

    Now that is an interesting question – if the Cybermen started to cyberise the Doctor, at what point would his body consider a regeneration was necessary?

    Zaphod @zaphod

    hERE BE Spoilers…



    It says so in the link..


    Just saw this, I think some version of Polaris’ speculation above is going to be true.




    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    @zaphod.       More likely I think that it will be 1, 10 and 11 – with always the possibility of 12 at the end…

    CraigNixon @craignixon

    As for NiS- I think they’ve nicked an idea from the Borg.

    Picard got taken to be a SpokesBorg for them in S3/S4(?), and I think they’ve geneswipe the Doctor and clone a CyberLord.


    Timeloop @timeloop

    As by request of Whisht I will post something about “next time” here instead of in NiS.

    Did you hear River telling someone “he cant go there, you know he cant” Why does she know that? Some assumed she would learn his name there. Who is she telling this to?

    And right in the beginning the Doctor tells Clara “there is one place you must never go”  and Clara laters says “You just said there is one place you must never go” ….? Is that a hint for him instructing her? When he is gone? How could she get through time and space without him?

    What is his duty??

    The strax attacks the vastra?????

    And that is definitily the Doctors hand over Rivers grave. What is going on? The last “next tim” was so impossibly missleading – I am not sure what to make of it.

    Anonymous @

    @timeloop – I usually don’t watch the ‘next time’ or any other kind of trailer, but since people were discussing them in the NiS thread, I decided, what the heck.

    River was talking to Clara at that point, I believe.

    dislikesswimmingalone @dislikesswimmingalone

    Spoiler Alert
    Gossip Alert

    Please respect the other members of this forum who do not wish to read spoilers or gossip by only discussing this post in the spoilers section.

    Just found the following which may or may not contain truths about future revelations, it’s an interesting idea…

    Timeloop @timeloop

    is it okay to discuss the trailer in here?

    ardaraith @ardaraith

    Where is the trailer?

    ardaraith @ardaraith

    Never mind. I found the trailer on the BBC website, and yea…wow.  Toss my theorising out the window.  Still excited about the finale, though!! (looks around sheepishly before boldly saying…:squee:)  Now, to bed.  Why, oh why am I still up at 2am!

    HTPBDET @htpbdet

    @timeloop       Whatever it is , it will not be River’s Grave. If that was the Doctor’s hand on it then its a trap or a door – surely?

    I can’t see what everyone is so excited about in the trailers – none of them seem to me to say anything.

    Strax attacking Vastra is interesting – sounds like  time unravelling somehow – maybe because the GI is obliterating the Doctor’s memory through its possession of the TARDIS?

    And is it just me or is River looking ghostly…Clara doesn’t believe in Ghosts…

    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave

    @htpbdet. I’m with you–I do not see any explanations or major reveals in the trailers.

    River: I would not have said “ghostly”; more “incorporeal” for me. As such, reminded me a bit of when images of the previous companions appeared last season, making him feel guilty. Could she be speaking from inside CAL, somehow? (Her clothes seem a little too ethereal for the fiesty River, but not for the CAL River).

    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave




    OK. Actually, this is spoilersh speculation, or speculation based on a couple of things in the trailers.


    At one point Clara says “I was born to save the Doctor”. And at another River appears, in an incorporeal form, to say to Clara, “Whatever you are thnking of doing…don’t”.

    Let’s assume that those two statements happen in reverse order–ie, Clara says–to someone–“I was born to save the Doctor” at the end of the episode, after River has spoken to her–and revealed to her that…Clara was born to save the Doctor. How does River know? (especially, if I am right and she is speaking from within CAL somehow).

    Well, remember that she was uploaded in CAL after all her adventures with the 11th. Remember back to River holding the Doctor’s hand over the cot. Do we know how long a timelord pregnancy lasts? Could it last for years? Could River have been pregnant when the 10th uploaded her into CAL? Was that a baby bump I saw on River in the trailer? (OK, the last one is a bit insane…)

    Therefore…yes, I am afraid it is the blenkinsop theory…could Clara be the child of River who was (somehow) born in CAL?

    How do I go on to explain all her manifestations? I don’t. I have no idea!

    End of spoilerish speculation…For now.

    Lula @lula

    Slightly spoiler musings below!



    BBC America has been airing classic Who episodes each month (as part of their “Doctors Revisited” specials–one Doctor per month), and I’ve now seen offerings from Doctors 1-4.  Watched a bit of “An Unearthly Child” last night and something caught my interest.

    Early on in the episode, the Doctor is in his junkyard when he notices a painting that seems to confuse him.  The audience never sees the subject of that painting, only his befuddlement.  Matt Smith was asked by Jonathan Ross to give a spoiler for the 50th Anniversary episode, to which he replied, “Paintings.”

    Putting aside all the speculation thus far about paintings (they’ll be 3-D, that’s why they filmed in the National Portrait Gallery, etc.), might Moffat harken back to this solitary moment from the very first episode of Doctor Who?  It may be nothing, sure.  But given that we’ve never seen said painting, nor do we know the reason behind his confusion, it would be an easy plot hole to fill with the current Doctor’s storyline.  (And, okay, a lovely way to honor the very first broadcast of Doctor Who.  I know, I know, I’m awfully sentimental.)

    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave

    @lula. Great idea about the painting! Will have to go back and re-watch “An Unearthly Child”.

    You are spoilt by BBC America (and I don’t mean it in the “spoiler” sense!) with the re-runs, the shows dedicated to each Doctor, etc.  I envy you.

    HTPBDET @htpbdet


    What a fascinating idea about the painting – I rather hope you are right. It would be a nice circle.

    But, alas, I think you have rather more confidence in SM than I do.


    Hmmm…..River is incorporeal in CAL, could she really be pregnant and have a child in there?

    I don’t buy that I am afraid.

    As to the “I was born” business….well, seems typically SM timey-wimey to me. Clara is just stating a fact – she, the Impossible Girl, was born, as the Impossible Girl, to save the Dr. So, Clara then makes it happen. She does something – something which it seems River says is unwise – as Clara which births the Impossible Girl.

    I am no doubt wrong…but I am thinking it is going to be a simple, and probably unsatisfactory, resolution – with no name.


    This is probably misdirection, but there is a story from the Production Office (allegedly according to one of the tabloids in the UK) that the loss of memory motif is important – for the Anniversary Special.

    The Doctor has forgotten a chunk of himself – the Ninth incarnation. John Hurt plays that part – the 9th Doctor. The paintings are because there is some gallery of paintings of all the Drs ( all good clean new merchandise ) which includes Hurt as 9, Ecclestone as 10, Tennant as 11 and Smith as 12.

    Which puts us at the “no more than 12 regenerations point” so gets SM a chance to change everything…

    Actually, I quite like it as an idea. Almost hope it is right.

    OsakaHatter @osakahatter




    @htpbdet – Would also bring us into Valeyard terrority? I’ve always suspected SM wants to tie up canon to clear the decks so to speak, although my entire evidence for this is the TARDIS becoming less predictable again, so I’m not sure what prompted this.  But this suspicion is largely why I’ve been expecting the removal of the timelock at some point (and trying to see signs of it in every mystery), the 12 regenerations/13 docs thing to be addressed (which SM has been questioned on in the past) and the valeyard to be met or refuted.  So I suppose this idea of a new 9th Doc would be a way to bring forward the resolution of them in time for the anniversary.  Can’t help but think though that if that is the case, resolving those will end up leaving SMs own threads hanging.  And I wanna know why the TARDIS blew up in S5 dagnamit!

    As has been pointed out in the NiS thread though, there seemed to be a pause in the flash of previous Doc faces between 10 and 11, the others flowed quite quickly.  So I’d suspect that if (and it’s a big if) John Hurt is playing a version of the Doctor, it’s something to do with the 10-11 regeneration rather than an 8-9 retcon.  Would also help explain why the 10-11 regeneration caused the TARDIS to take such a hammering.

    Timeloop @timeloop





    No return after this point.

    I do not think that is what the trailer revealed. at 0:23 You can clearly see that they are inside the TARDIS. A TARDIS that is aged. Has not been used for months if not years. A TARDIS of a different timeline maybe. One where the Doctor came alone to the Fields of Tranzalore. Rose looked into the Tardis and became kind of a God (for a short time) Clara steped into the heart of time, making her impossible and allowing the TARDIS to “produce” her whenever needed. She makes a sacrifice to keep the doctor alive. (Has she seen a world without the doctor? Why would she? Is she in love as said in he said she said?) In he said she said the Doctor quotes “I will always know what she means” – Danger for his life. He knows she will only be there if he would have died otherwise. He might even have seen her in the liberary if it were not for River?

    Another important point. The way River adresses Clara. Like old friends. Like she talked to the Doctor in the liberary? Very soft. And as if she knew Clara would not listen. She (Clara) looked so commited to what she was doing? Funny also – River would not interfere. I very much hope this is a River pre Liberary.

    Clara “I was born to safe the Doctor.” Sounds like she realises  it herself right then and there. (She heard what would be and acts to enable the (better – her) future. Like reading it in a book and having no choice at all. )

    The Doctor saying she is absolutely perfect for him. Too perfect. Never really focusing in herself then, is she? Never too scared to act, never caught up in her own reation (Would you not have freaked out when awaking in Crimson horror? Did she even ask for an explanation?) Prime priority is and has always been the Doctor? Why?

    Your thoughts on that?

    Timeloop @timeloop

    Where was the limitation of regenerations mentioned? I’d like a peek.


    If what I said above it true – why did the TARDIS not like her? Because she stepped into time? Why didnt she choose the Doctor as an Interface? Is the only constant thing for Clara Clara?

    Zaphod @zaphod



    @osakahatter We did see 10 (Tennant) quite explicitly become 11 (Smith) at the end of End of Time. The only one we haven’t ‘seen’ regenerate is McGann to Eccleston.

    Anonymous @







    After watching the Trailer for the next ep a coupla times, and pausing between :22 and :24, I don’t think River looks so very incorporeal or ethereal.  But either that is hideously bad costuming, or a terrible camera angle, but River certainly looks a bit thick around the middle.

    I assume it will be bad costuming + bad camera angle, though.

    However, the Doctor has a line (in the Next Time clip): ‘I’m about to cross my own time line (garble garble) and she doesn’t like it!’  Might be ‘the Tardis’ not ‘she’ but I can’t be arsed to watch it again.  Anyway, if he’s crossing his own timeline then simply everything is up for grabs with bonkers theorising.  Yay!  🙂

    OsakaHatter @osakahatter








    @zaphod – Yep, the 8-9 regeneration does leave more wiggle room for twists because it’s not been seen off screen.  However, the speculation (and it was just that) I was referring to was whether more happened with the 10-11 regeneration than we saw, largely because of the fires breaking out on the TARDIS and various themes of mirroring, duplicates etc since.  For what it’s worth, I’d be amazed if John Hurt turns out to be an actual Doctor.  I’d guess either some aspect of his psyche (particularly given we’ve already seen scenes inside his head in the latest ep), or some kind of Doctor-that-might-have-been.

    Lula @lula

    Just making sure everyone has heard the news–many Americans received their Blu-Ray copy of 7b yesterday, so The Name of the Doctor has been viewed, is being viewed, and will likely be fully spoiled by Saturday.  I learned the news via Tumblr, seeing a tremendous spoiler before I could exit the site and install Tumblr Savior, to protect me from any further ruination!

    Be wary of Facebook, Twitter, Tumblr, etc., for the rest of the week.  To be fair, it seems only a few as*holes are ruining it for everyone–most are just bragging that they’ve viewed it a full week early, adding, “Don’t worry, no spoilers from me!”  But there are a couple of people posting full-episode recaps, as well as uploading torrents of the actual episode.  Rude.

    Also, a friend in Louth told me (via Facebook) that according to an email she received yesterday, her Blu-Ray will be delivered from Amazon UK on Friday, the 17th.  So the US folks who ordered from BBC America got theirs a week early, and it looks like Amazon UK customers will receive theirs a day early.

    What a mess!

    Anonymous @

    @lula – what was anyone in BBC Distribution thinking?!?

    Or, is this a deliberate plot-point — and what went out on the pre-ordered sales discs had a sneaky pre-filmed alternate ending?  Wouldn’t that just be fantastic?!  🙂

    For me, that would be the highest heights of The Moff.  ‘Ya wantcher Docter Who early?  Suck on this!’

    Sadly, I don’t think in today’s world of supra-global-marketing, a stunt like that woud be sanctioned by any suit.  But the thought of it still makes me smile.

    Lula @lula

    @Shazzbot— word on the street (and by street I mean Twitter) is complete silence from BBC America.  They don’t ship directly from their headquarters, obviously, so this is a problem with their distributor.  But someone’s got to take the blame, so all the tweet screaming I’ve seen has been directed at BBC America.

    I just read one non-spoilery Tumblr post from someone who has seen the episode.  (He posted photos of the DVDs as proof.)  It all sounds legitimate to me, so I doubt there’s a dupe ending on the discs that shipped early.

    However, Tumblr is grumbling with hate towards Gallifrey Base (which I’d never heard of until today–and I’m glad, because that place sounds more frightening than The Guardian’s Who comment section!) because someone there has–apparently–posted a spoiler-filled summary of the episode.  I reckon if any of you are inclined, head there for your spoiler fulfillment.

    Timeloop @timeloop

    @lula What a bomb! MUST RESIST…. It’s going to be a long week.

    The question standing is how could they have let that happen?

    Anonymous @

    @lula – just chanced a landing at Gallifrey Base, and it requires a login.  So not very spoilery at all (thank goodness!) unless one takes all the steps to register, which means one is a very committed spoiler-phile.

    Lots of our community are violently allergic to spoilers – and I count myself amongst that crew! – so I thank you for showing where we must not go in the coming week!

    Craig @craig

    @lula and @Shazzbot Gallifrey Base has a bit of a reputation for being all about spoilers. From what I hear they actually send people out with cameras to video scenes being shot on location and post them on the site. Used to annoy the Hell out of Russell T Davies. THAT is how they’re the biggest Doctor Who forum on the net. We’re trying to be a bit different 😉

    Timeloop @timeloop

    @Shazzbot Thanks for that! Less nagging tamptation that way (well- there are still other ways.. X_x). How did you end up there if you are allergic to them? 😉 In fact – how come you are in here? =D  [just joking – please don’t be offended ^^”]

    @craig That is and interesting job. Did they get paid for it?


    [I am an emoticon-addict xD~ Please tell me if you find it annoying ]

    Anonymous @

    @timeloop – I’m here because this is the comfiest sofa I’ve ever come across.  I’m here because I used to read the Guardian and followed the links to this site.  I’m here because this community forms the most enthusiastic,  knowledgeable, warm, and welcoming site I’ve seen.

    And just as a side-note, everyone here loves Doctor Who, in all its incarnations, with all its companions, with its wealth of stories and its mirror of of social change in Britain throughout its 50 years of being broadcast; and everyone loves discussing every aspect of the programmes (even some which are not actually in the programmes 🙂  ); and, commenters here are unabashed in telling personal stories of their lives which directly coincide with this most remarkable television programme.

    And to directly answer your question, I only got as far on Gallifrey Base to discover they required a login, at which point I jumped back into my own personal Tardis to return to this site.  😉

    Timeloop @timeloop

    @Shazzbot I just meant the Spoiler section, as you said you were avoiding them 😉

    “mirror of social change in Britain throughout its 50 years” Well, I guess you must have been there to fully feel that. As I am born 1990 in Germany – I can not relate to that as much as you do. But I am thankful for the living encyclopedia of DW knowledge and the welcoming community.

    Anonymous @

    Aha @timeloop – you’ve caught me out!  Drat-dang-nammit.  I was indeed avoiding this thread before; but events have become very timey-wimey recently and there’s been a total lock-down on all spoilers on this site, so this thread is safe to come to.  (I assume – {glares at anyone daring to post a spoiler} )

    Are you still in Germany?  Your English is colloquial and amazing.  I’m always in awe of people with multiple languages.

    Lula @lula

    @craig @Shazzbot  A friend explained Gallifrey Base to me in depth–and I’m far better  off hanging out here, so thank you for always making me feel welcome.

    In other news, one of the American Doctor Who sites (that I lurk on, never comment) spent the past few days having a massive meltdown over Matt Smith’s shaved* head.  It’s like people don’t understand the whole idea of getting into a role, or commitment to character, because it’s been wail after wail of, “That’s it, he’s regenerating, WHY ELSE WOULD HE HAVE SHORN HIS FLOPPY LOCKS?”  Bless.  But all of this is to say, I do believe I’ve found the superior Who forum, so again–thank you!

    *If you haven’t yet seen, please enjoy: http://www.justjared.com/2013/05/11/matt-smith-shirtless-shaved-head-for-ryan-gosling-movie/

    For the record, this is the very first time I have ever read a tabloid post about Matt Smith.  Well–an American tabloid, that is.  The man is on track for worldwide domination.

    thedoctordude @thedoctordude

    Spoiler discussion…

    Just a thought about the trailer “spoiler” about Clara “being created for the doctor”. If Moffet doesn’t mind us knowing that she was created for the doctor, there is probably more to her then that. Maybe it is partly who she is, but not her true, full identity. Most likely something else will be the big reveal about her…or maybe that line won’t even turn out to be true and just be a misdirection…

    Bobbingbird @bobbingbird

    @lula and others

    This is not a spoiler but is about spoilers

    Doctor Who Tv has closed all comments until 18 May. Confirmed that the final ep has been sent out. Moffatt will be furious.

    What a fiasco. The best thing is for the Beeb to show it ASAP before it’s too late.

    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave

    Emerging from behind the sofa (nervously and only momentarily) I am relieved to see that the spoiler of the next episode remains far away from this site.

    @bobbingbird. I started to have a strange conspiratorial feeling (and I am responding to your comments on the other page regarding s7 as much as to your post above) that the leak might actually have been planned by the BBC suits, as a way of capturing an even larger audience than it would have otherwise. There has, after all, been a huge amount of publicity generated through the mainstream press. And studios are quite likely to go ballistic and call in the lawyers in response to events like this. But the response by the BBC has been very softly, softly.

    Posters have commented on the reference at the end of “Nightmare” to “see you next Wednesday”. If the Beeb does decide to fast-track the screening to…say…Wednesday, well…

    No, I am being too conspiratorial. Or am I…?

     <nervously returns behind sofa>

    Bobbingbird @bobbingbird


    I’m all for a good conspiracy theory, me. It would be interesting if, say, the dvds were due for arrival on Thursday, wouldn’t it? Let’s just hope that if the Beeb does show it on Wednesday, the ABC will follow on the Thursday, otherwise it’s download time. I just wouldn’t cope with this board in fevered discussion while the colonies wait until Sunday.

    I for one will try to avoid the plot. I like a good teaser, but out and out spoilers would ruin it completely (he said with fingers a twitching).

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