General Open Thread – TV Shows (2)
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Craig 6 years, 5 months ago.
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16 June 2015 at 11:09 #40677
Anonymous @
as I was…as you were…..I. Love. It.
Really, Farscape is terrific. By the 2nd episode I was won over. I’m all about John now.
17 June 2015 at 06:21 #40681Thank you for linking those articles: very informative and…well….utterly nuts when you actually watch his stuff.
At the end of Serenity -but mainly Firefly the series, Boy Ilion confirmed that he “possibly” preferred “Firefly to Buffy and Angel due to the commitment of the cast and the renegade carry-on mixing Western with Sci-Fi and beyond.”
I said: “be a film critic”.
I note also this morning (after watching another deadening season of 24 with Jack Bauer) that he said “buffy changed my life’.
Truer words
17 June 2015 at 07:57 #40682@purofilion
What the hell is this place John whatshisname is in? (forty frickin bucks for a season and they can’t throw in subtitles?)
I see you’ve taken the Beans option for meals then? 🙂 I did laugh when I read your comment, because I think most people would say the same thing.
It’s funny because the creators tried to make the Pilot quite a shock to the system with few concessions up front. Basically they wanted the viewer to experience a similar kind of culture shock to John as he lurches from one first contact situation to another, with no-one in any particular hurry to welcome a bloke from “Erf” to the Universe. It’s quite a risky approach in a way, and I’ve often wondered if people have actually been put off from the first viewing.
I think you may have watched a couple more episodes, and you’ll probably have guessed they are going out of their way to reinforce the fact that John is the real “alien” in this setup (the second episode is a nice little play on ET). He’s completely out of his depth, and this first season introduces us to species, characters and concepts that will play out in the future. Like all first series, it occasionally struggles for tone at times, as it tries to find its own voice.
Feel free to comment on episodes as they come up. I won’t be back until Friday morning I think, but catching up on your thoughts is something to look forward to, and I’ll put some thought into a season 1 blog.
Happy viewing!
17 June 2015 at 08:27 #40683@phaseshift actually, in the end (after 4 episodes now) I really love it.
I suppose my thoughts were this:
I loved Firefly because it introduced us to a place made up almost exclusively of ‘earth peoples’ spread out all over the known universe. We had instant compassion with a Doctor saving his sister, a priest showing faith, a country and western mechanic, and a kick ass chick in tight pants calling her ‘man’ husband’. Then there’s Mal, totally in love with his
carspaceship. With each of these we could relate. The languages, the Reavers and the all the other new concepts were easily assimilated. I loved the people and their compassion; as an ensemble they had an immediate on-screen connection. I wasn’t always a big fan of Star Wars. I surely appreciated the crazy muppetry, but from a ‘wow, that’s clever angle’ rather than a love for the weird, manufactured aliens themselves. Certainly when I started viewing Farscape what with a blue empath, a floating farting turtle and a sebaceous (sic) brunette, I thought: this is farrkin’ off!! Where in the world am I?And you’re right. This was all new and I understood the point they were making -certainly in the episode where he explains “first contact” like ET (and other similar movies) this was clearly shown. And by the reference to Yoda’s Island, I was trilling my head off. Also: Mary Mara: whoo-hoo!
The hilarious asides were brilliant and I do like a director/writer who expects us to keep up. I don’t know who first said this but it was explained that a really good sci-fi writer doesn’t have to use words which we absolutely know and she/he doesn’t need to define them either in the hope/wish that we come to understand, roughly, what they mean. I know Margaret Atwood was a believer in this -but then so was Shakespeare.
I also imagine meeting a group of space travellers who manage to discover the secret of Wormhole travel (I’d call them Wombles). I’d put my hand and ask them a series of questions:
1. where does your poo and wee go? (everyone in the Q&A would roll their eyes)
2. What do you eat and how do you keep it interesting? Do you eat together? Is there a kitchen?
3. Do you sleep in beds or have you bred sleep out of human conditioning altogether?
With Firefly, one of the first episodes shows Mal relieving himself (Qu 1 answered) and he’s in his own bunk/room with bits of paper and routine stuff scattered about -clothes, mementos and iPad- type communicators (Qu 3 answered and a whole lot of other ‘normal’ human attributes still exist).
For me, these things are still important. They’re probably not important to NASA or to those who are ‘into’ space science. I guess I like the homely things -that which makes the Tardis interesting: bunks or cabins? Food or some other word for nutrition? Books or computers or a combo? Serenity had a congregation area. It had a stove, tins of food and in the ‘lounge’ Jayne played his guitar and Kaylee made eyes at Simon while Book meditated or talked with River. Nobody was blue (although River was an Empath and she saw “hands of blue”), some people liked Hawaiian shirts and d’ladies still wore lipstick. I haven’t seen this in Farscape yet -and that’s OK. I’m as freaked out as Cochrane is, which is the point. But it’s a sharp one.
So Episode 5, here we come. Geronimo…
17 June 2015 at 09:43 #40689@purofilion — yeah, I think one big point of Firefly that even in the future, people are still people. It’s no more obvious than in the primary motivation of most of the crew — find a job, get money, keep living. Compare that to the Star Trek series where humans have moved beyond money and commerce and ‘live to better themselves and the rest of humanity’. It’s a fine aspiration and one that I definitely think we should be aspiring towards but in terms of drama, it does tend to distance the viewer slightly.
Sounds like Boy-lion is a true Browncoat.
Netflix UK have removed Farscape, the swine, so I’m maybe going to be a bit behind in the series blogs but will be reading with interest.. If it’s still on the US site I may be able to ZenMate it and watch it on my laptop.
17 June 2015 at 10:08 #40690I blagged on and you said “people are still people in F’fly.” (cue song: …”are the luckiest people in the world…”)
Boy-oh-boy, Ilion does go on, doesn’t she!
17 June 2015 at 12:53 #40691@purofilion
Baked beans for dinner? I have one word for you – ‘pre-owned’. I buy my DVDs from CEX – who, by the way, have stores in Australia. Seasons 1 & 2 were only £8 each!
I have to say that Farscape initially left me cold. When it originally aired, I only watched the 1st episode of Season 1 and quickly dismissed it as being ‘Muppets in Space’.
Although I caught a few episodes here and there I’d pretty much given up on it after ‘That Old Black Magic’ but, after much insistence from friends, I tuned in for ‘A Human Reaction’ and from that point on I was hooked. There’re still a few duff episodes in the remainder of the Season but I found the episodes from ‘Nerve’ onwards to be real edge of the seat viewing.
There’s an episode in Season 2 (‘Home On The Remains’) which highlights the sometimes absurd rating system of the British Board of Film Classification. The BBC showed the episode uncut at 6pm in the evening. Number of complaints? Zero, ziltch, nada. The BBFC, however, deemed it necessary to give the DVD release an 18 certificate unless a particular scene was cut (the makers refused to make the cut). I won’t say why at the moment but after you’ve seen it, try and guess the reason why the BBFC had such a problem with it.
18 June 2015 at 23:08 #40710Hi there
I’m new to this and have to admit to never watching an episode of Dr Who – sorry 😉
I do a sci fi podcast and want to do an intro episode to Dr Who. What’s THE episode to start with?
Many thanks!
19 June 2015 at 00:27 #40711@mattsmith1983 – you’re into SF, do a podcast and have never watched Doctor Who?
Definitely a problem you need to solve.
Broadly, you have two options. One is to start with the grand original, first ever, 13th November 1963 Black & White episode. It’s called An Unearthly Child and is about two teachers worried about one of their pupils. They go to her home to investigate and discover that home is an old police box and her Grandfather is frankly weird. Oh, and he calls himself ‘Doctor’. Just ‘Doctor’. Doctor Who? 😉
After the exciting first episode the story wanders off for three episodes of slightly dull adventures-with-cavepeople (it was the only script that was ready). Then, in the next story, we meet the Daleks. The rest was, as they say, history. [And if you want a drama-doc about the history, it’s called An Adventure in Time and Space and is very good.]
The alternative is to skip two generations and start with the very first episode after the long hiatus: Rose. Russell T Davies knew that anyone under 17 might never have seen Doctor Who, so he basically reintroduces and re-explains the entire concept.
Warning: Doctor Who is strangely addictive. Some people never do get it. Others watch an episode or two and suddenly find themselves compelled to watch every episode since Rose. In extreme cases the compulsion can extend to watching every episode ever and obsessing over the possible re-discovery of The Celestial Toymaker. You have been warned. 😀
19 June 2015 at 02:32 #40712thank you for that. I have found that after the initial ‘shock’ of the first episode (Muppets in Space, indeed!) that I’ve warmed to the extremely confused John Cochrane.
I’ve got the first 3 seasons but the 4th is apparently only on BluRay which means your pre-owned suggestion is a good one. And Netflix sounds right too. Problem is, I really enjoy the subtitles. In many shows -Fire Fly being one, there was a lot missed without titles. . I think S2 or 3 of Buffy lacked s’titles too and so I was forever rewinding in an effort to understand the subtleties of the writers.
19 June 2015 at 04:16 #40713@janetteb @jimthefish and any interested parties -possibly @mudlark and @bluesqueakpip
The Aus production The Killing Season about PM’s Rudd ‘dismissal’ (3 1 hour parts) is quite good as a political summary of our landscape in 2010.
I have a few reservations. Macklin and Conroy don’t exactly explain why they feel they had no idea about being kept in the dark, even in cabinet, which smacks of a gentle cover-up or happy ignorance. The reporter doesn’t particularly press them about it.
And on another pressing note, is the doco with Terrence Stamp (I used to think he reminded me of Delgado) called ‘Between a Frock and a Hard Place’ about the making and reception of ‘Priscilla, Queen of the Desert.’ It’s fantastic. One of my top 10 films for all sorts of reasons.
(@FatManInABox congrats about the official exam pass. I’ve been struggling with my own landscape gardener who has no idea that chilli plants need sun and you can’t over-water herbs. They need friable soil. “What’s friable?” Said in the most aussie-blokey tone possible! Like Kenny the loo cleaner -if you remember him from several years ago? Or possibly Jayne from F’fly as these dudes are ‘buffed up’. You can’t have too many tatts or too much muscle if you’re a gardener).
19 June 2015 at 04:45 #40716@Purofilion Will have to look for The killing season. Thanks for the heads up.
Cheers
Janette
19 June 2015 at 05:09 #40717@Purofilion
I’ve warmed to the extremely confused John Cochrane.
Yes, poor confused Johnnie, one minute he’s a top Defence Lawyer, the next he’s being accused of murdering a villainous Captain’s brother 😆 I think you mean John Crichton 🙂
Looks like you definitely need the subtitles, as do I. My hearing isn’t great at the best of times (and I suffer from Tinnitus) so when it comes to technobabble I’m like “Reverse the what of the what now?” 😕
but the 4th is apparently only on BluRay
??? All seasons, including The Peacekeeper Wars are available as DVD releases. Blue Ray discs didn’t appear until 2006, three years after Farscape was unexpectedly cancelled. If the complete Season 4 isn’t available on DVD in Australia then you may have to opt for the individual releases. Technically, they weren’t individual but rather 5 box-sets with each box containing 2 discs – and still no subtitles – Grrr.
19 June 2015 at 05:36 #40718what a twit am I. Yes Crichton!
grr; OK, at the local JB-Hi-Fi the check- out chick said it was all re-marketed last year. Hence the phenomenal price for each set. As for BluRay it appears to be the case on her ‘computer’ which could easily mean: “I have no flippin’ clue.” Unlike a few people there, she never has much of an idea about what she sells. When it was collected, they couldn’t find where she’d hidden it. Hrrrr.
5 Box sets with each containing 2 discs? That is awfully weird.
Still, onwards.
– Thank you for that (mutters John Crichton, Crichton…I believe I’m mixing him up with Michael Crichton of ER fame and therefore thinking it can’t be Crichton at all!! That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it)
19 June 2015 at 05:39 #40719love the flowers by the way: absolutely dashing and shows off the sapphire blue. Would that be sapphire? Or a Royal blue? My colour recognition is slightly better than my telly hearing…But not by much.
19 June 2015 at 05:54 #40721@Purofilion
Box sets with each containing 2 discs? That is awfully weird.
And expensive! They originally retailed at £25 per box so for the 4 seasons and The Peacekeeper Wars, you’d have paid £525 😯
Would that be sapphire? Or a Royal blue?
Purple! 🙂
19 June 2015 at 06:00 #40722@fatmaninabox oh whoa! that would’ve been $1000! Holy Mackerel.
Funnily enough The Peacekeeper Wars were the cheapest. I believe, though, that someone ..eerm..-not me- added a bit of Dirty Harry and Dixon of Dock Green to the tab. No wonder I was surprised. The bag was big and there was obviously something taken out of it. Sneaky. But I’m on top of my game because I know the difference between Cochrane and Crichton <*\*>
It will take awhile.
19 June 2015 at 06:36 #40724@bluesqueakpip Kind of you to give that warning — Doctor Who *is* strangely addictive. Kind of like watching that recent internet clip of an octopus toting a couple of halves of coconut shells along the sea-bed and then starting what looks as if it will be a rather long process of constructing a shelter or hide-out for itself out of them. You can’t stop looking.
A bit like that . . . or maybe not? I’m on a panel with some colleagues in Boston next month, the title of which is “Guilty Pleasures”, meaning bad influences that secretly helped shape our SF/F/H fandom or writing (or, in one case, becoming a distinguished editor in the field). If we get around to *good* influences, I’ll certainly have to name DW. Though I suppose if I chose carefully, I could claim DW as a bad influence as well, along with EC comics and bodice-rippers . . . and Hammer horror films, of course. But it’s not always easy to tell the good influences from the bad, is it?
19 June 2015 at 07:30 #40727Okay, I’m in! I found Farscape on my Netflix and decided based on the conversation here to give it a go (with no need to resort to baked beans). @purofilion, I agree about the subtitles: when I’m watching current DW with iTunes, I often resort to them to make sure I haven’t missed anything of the Doctor and Clara’s Speedy Gonzales dialogue.
I’ve watched the first two and found them good fun, once I adjusted to the Starwarsian feel of the universe. And the opening theme took a lot of forgiveness! There is a very last century feel to the show, definitely from the Star Wars/Star Trek field of sci fi. Relatively little angst so far, and the style of action and humour is very straight up, rather than the faster paced, more stylish, cutting sort of thing we tend to get nowadays. Very retro. I still can’t remember any of the character names beyond Crichton, and I keep thinking of the tough alien with tentacles for hair as Worf. 🙂 And Puro, based on episode two, we do know how they brush their teeth!
19 June 2015 at 07:58 #40728Oh the theme!! Oh my stars 🙂
You get this quite nice deep percussion and this momentum driven bounding sound…and then “what the hell?” as this “wah wah, wah wahh-ing” starts off. We listen to it purely to get a laugh.
I like the show so far. It doesn’t seem to take itself too seriously?
Now, did you see Buffy at all? Or, not your thing?
– and yes on QT (wrong thread) Greek basil has small leaves but has an aniseed fragrance? Not bad. I like it. Of course, I had to buy it myself and get the ARSE’d guy to plant it for me (whilst peeking from behind the blinds) –
I’ve only seen 5 eps of F’scape so far-mouthful, that is.
You might like Firefly then -I thought it was absolutely the best and ended up in floods of tears at the end of the series. It had that much impact.
Buffy, though, “changed Boy Ilion’s Life” (he says). He finds many shows “awful”as they lack the requisite layers, the subtle dialogue and the animated characters who are so different to the repetitive and static ones on many current programmes.
Oh yes! The teeth brushing. Of course it’s why they all have such irradiated white ones too.
I have trouble recalling any of their names. I have Blue Lady. The turtle. The pilot and Lurk. I swear that’s as far as I’ve gotten.
19 June 2015 at 08:02 #40729Oh and the cute Sebacious Glandy one -Claudia Black. Ha! I remember the actor’s name so that must count?
19 June 2015 at 08:07 #40730Nope, it aint purple. Not on my computer. Or was that “purpla” ?
On some show, an alien said “turquoise” and then “purplah” I think. I have no idea where that came from. I could have totally made that up.
I know! It was on Angel and therefore ‘Conan’ who was Cordelia’s ‘knight’ from the planet of ‘yickyick’ -can’t even remember his name (or the world) now. That’s what you get for speed watching.
19 June 2015 at 08:10 #40731hell? Is it purple? Seriously? I’ve had lager but that wouldn’t be it. Gawd. Optometrist…
19 June 2015 at 09:10 #40732Having just watched some drivel called Scot and Bailey, they mentioned a Luxor which reminds me that the guy with the head that looks like turnips and other root vegetables in Farscape, is called a ‘Luxor’ I think.
19 June 2015 at 10:20 #40733Thanks for this, very helpful – I’ll get on it.
I know, for shame right. We’re wanting to do an episode soon on Dr Who where we talk about fandom within Dr Who and how it seems to really draw such contrasting views amongst people.
We are at @thesmithsignal on twitter if you fancy listening in on our Dr Who episode. Any questions welcome too!
Cheers guys, here’s hoping I become a massive fan!
19 June 2015 at 22:34 #40738@purofilion No, I haven’t gotten to Buffy yet. I went through a spell of several months during which there was relatively little opportunity for viewing. But reading the recent conversation here about Farscape and Firefly inspired me to check Netflix for them, and lo and behold, there they both were. I had actually thought that I would try Firefly before Buffy, as a doorway into Whedonworld, because the plot sounds a little more my thing. (I’ve never really engaged with the undead/vampire/supernatural storylines.) I will, however, eventually give Buffy a go, as it is available to me on Netflix and so I should at least try it!
19 June 2015 at 22:46 #40739Hey @mattsmith1983 – to be honest a reviewer/ podcaster going through the “touchstones of Sci-fi” is probably an interesting approach.
“This week, we have our first contact with [Dr Who/ Dune/ Watchmen/ More than Human/ Bradbury etc etc etc]
At the very least its either a “this week the whole podcast is about…” or a small segment to fill a gap “first encounter – Dune. Its beloved but a bit stodgy. The mince pies of Sci fi?”
or whatever
(i only say this as I only recently heard Back in Black for the first time and thought “I can’t think why I haven’t bothered to hear this before. Hey ho. I’d love to hear other people’s first thoughts on something that I know well”)have fun!
19 June 2015 at 22:58 #40740@purofilion et al
I’ll admit that when i saw the first Farscape, like @fatmaninabox I thought “aww no, another Henson thing/ muppets in space”.
I saw a few episodes here and there and enjoyed, but enjoyed mainly as there was nothing better to do/ watch in those minutes.Now I think I should give it another chance.
BTW a few weeks ago I bought (after spotting and on the advice of the esteemed company here) a box set of Fringe.
Best way to buy for me is at a charity shop (Oxfam in Angel London is getting a lot of my CD custom!). That way, even if its shite I feel good!
;¬)I’ve not seen an episode of it yet. Probably I’ll binge on Game of Thrones first (I’m avoiding spoilers) and then dive in when the weather pulls in. So there’s a box set that will stare at me for months!
;¬)
20 June 2015 at 11:23 #40742I think after you’ve seen the Amazing Mona (oops sorry, that’s from a recent Sue Grafton novel) – Firefly, you may wish to try Buffy. I felt F’fly was incredibly polished. The characters were stunningly put together and each had a distinct set of abilities. With Buffy there were some duff episodes but even these had some tremendous lines. And that clinched it for me: my Buffy List of Quotes -10 pages in the first 3 seasons alone. And not one of them had anything to do with vampires.
I think @pedant mentioned that it was the people, the ideas, the interactions and the intense connections together with incredible performances by Anthony Steward Head, Alison Hannigan (sic) and Sarah M. Gellar. The dude playing Xander (Nick Brendon) was also amazing and with very little training from what I’ve gleaned on the ‘net. His comedic timing was utterly perfect for such a young guy & every bit as good as Nathan Fillion the cap’n and star of Firefly.
The thing with Buffy is that the Boy won’t watch crap TV anymore: “Buffy changed my life. It showed me what good writing really means. It doesn’t have to curse to be funny, it doesn’t have to have sexy gals to attract viewers and it doesn’t need a male lead to be successful.”
Hand to heart, maybe give it a go when you’re in the right space. There are weird episodes in the first season but the 5th season was when the whole shebang became true to itself.
And no, I don’t have a huge crush on Whedon. It aint planet-sized but it could well be the size of a tiny moon egg.
@whisht I’ve seen some trailers on the ‘net of Fringe. It looks good. <*\*>
20 June 2015 at 13:29 #40743still veering towards checking my pocket watch with the eps of Farscape.
I’m at ep 6 where the crew finds themselves drugged by the Magic Turnip and dancing to The Grateful Dead -some of those lines were outrageously funny but by and large it is a bit ‘dated’. On the episode cover, there’s no names at all -so I’m checking Google to recognise that the ep which finally hooked you is a farscape way off yet. But till then I can ogle Crichton. He’s good eye candy.
@arbutus I can see I said the same thing in two diff posts -must be tired, I suppose. Apologies.
20 June 2015 at 14:00 #40744@whisht My eldest and youngest are watching Fringe as I type. I am resisting to temptation to go in and join them. I do like having a good supply of things to watch.
A friend of mine does a podcast on Sci Fi. Recently she interviewed Matt Smith. She has talked to Anna Torv of Fringe I think.
Cheers
Janette
20 June 2015 at 14:02 #40745@purofilion
You know, I’ve never watched Farscape with subtitles, and I think I may have missed a trick there. The dialogue bubbles along in many places, and it is easy to miss things.
I think I can re-assure you that all the questions on your list will be answered, and in the case of bodily effluvia perhaps in a “too much information” kind of way. One of the things about this first series is that we know the score to a certain extent. We have a disparate group of people who don’t initially have much in common, but in that fine tradition are going to have to learn to bond together. At the start they are hiding aspects of their pasts from everyone else and live isolated lives in this enormous ship. This gradually starts to change and we get to see the group becoming more social.
The Yoda reference from I ET is lovely, and marks the start of John becoming the king of pop culture references to Sci-Fi. I think one of the strengths of the character is that, to all intents and purposes he’s a nerd who is a bit buff and looks good in tight leather trousers. This should be his dream come true (meeting other life forms), but it descends into a nightmare.
@fatmaninabox is quite right about the early releases. Early adopter syndrome I guess as when DVDs first came out they could be expensive. In fact, I think we forget that if you collected say, Star Trek TNG on video, you’d buy a tape with two episodes on for £9.99 – £11.99, That would be 12 or 13 tapes per season, so it’s not that much more than was conventional at the time. The one thing I’ll praise about those releases though is the nature of the special features that they came with. One-on-one interviews with the cast, features on the Jim Henson workshop and a wealth of material. Many of the features were specially prepared for the DVDs and it was one of the first shows to take that approach. Many of these features don’t feature on the later box sets (there wouldn’t be room) but have made it onto Youtube etc.
Hey! Another watcher! You can certainly trace many aspects of the character setups to other shows (D’Argo initially being a bit Klingon for instance) but it then subverts the characters in different directions.
I’m sure you both recognise Ben Browder from appearing in Doctor Who series 7 (Isaac in A Town called Mercy). Zhaan (the Blue Empath) is played by Virginia Hey who gave a head turning (for teenage boys as I was) performance as the blonde warrior woman in Mad Max 2 (the Road Warrior).
Who do we reckon would win in a “tongue off” between D’Argo and Madame Vastra? 😀
21 June 2015 at 00:22 #40748Thinking of the song “Would I lie to you honey?”
I can’t. Just can’t. Ben Browder was in Dr Who? Wot? I’ve seen Mad Max 2 and didn’t recognise Virginia Hey. Blimey.
My powers of observation are never to be messed with.
Yeah, right.
I think Vastra would win. You know, in the ‘thing’. Oh, gross.
21 June 2015 at 03:22 #40749I watched the excerpt above, thank you, and face palmed immediately thinking “how did I not know?” (MadMax2)
I then watched a magnificent amount of panels on Farscape including some very funny “Crichtonisms” from Browder himself who has such amazing charisma in these interviews -similar, I think, to James Marsters.
I can understand just how shocking the collapse of this series was. I mentioned this show to a night nurse the other evening who assumed, perhaps, I’d watched the whole show before ***and @arbutus, if you’re reading this, STOP NOW****** (sorry to tag you but I know you’ll occasionally read what I’ve written so I wanted to give a fair warning)
and this woman said “gee, pity that he and the chick die in the end during a To Be Continued cliff hanger of a cliff hanger and then it was cancelled.”
Whoa, the cow!! Anyhow, so I’ve been a bit spoiled but I understand that the Peacekeeper Wars (which I also snagged) may well continue that story -somehow. How you return from actual death is tricky but I’m sure it can be manoeuvred.
What has astounded me is the issue of its cancellation. It had an amazing and distinguished fan base which drew upon that love to demand the show continue. What stuns me is how, during this period, I never knew of the show. Meanwhile, telly in Aus is cost cutting everywhere but we still have the occasional poor mini-series and the endless ‘Neighbours’ and Gold Coast beach programmes which, by the by, convinced my brother-in-law to cash in his life savings and live in either Perth or Brisbane. Anyway, after less than 2 months and realising that life wasn’t ‘Home and Away’, he dragged the 4 kids back to Essex to literally start again. The economy was failing (2002) and had he toughed it out here, he could have had a marvellous life but it was never going to be surfing or chish ‘n’ fips every day.
So we had tremendous opportunities to develop Oz telly with Farscape (from what I’ve read thus far) and yet no-one at all -and I was in the drama/music world – ever mentioned the show. Everyone watched re-runs of Star Trek and Doctor Who.
What really caused the cancellation? @fatmaninabox you might shed light on this, if you can. I’ve attempted to read a bit here and there about it, but I’m not certain. Was it that Sy Fy (the American channel) simply ran out of money or did their polling suggest that it wasn’t a feasible situation any longer due to a complicated lack of interest from their Australian partners?
Such things always fascinate me when you consider the absolute faff that seems to line the airways from here to the States? I’ve got nothing against Game of Thrones but the cash chucked at this over-blown show must be magnificent. So this continues on (and I know it’s a different era and HBO clearly has billions 😉 ) and yet in the past, Firefly and Farscape get canned. It’s a puzzle!
Kindest, purforfillion
21 June 2015 at 04:05 #40750@Purofilion
The cancellation was mainly due to the increase in production costs however, the SciFi Channel (as it was called then) also stated that while Farscape was their highest rated show, the viewing figures simply weren’t high enough to warrant spending on a fifth season.
If you want to risk a few minor spoilers, there is (providing you’ve got the same special features as the UK release) a featurette regarding the cancellation on the last disc in which David Kemper reads a TV critics response to news of the cancellation to the cast & crew and boy, is the critic angry!
As to the lack of Australian viewers, this was possibly down to it being shown at some ridiculously late hour as Channel 9 ( ? ) didn’t know what the heck to do with it 😕
Farscape’s definitely worth look and while most of the episodes in Season 1 are a bit hit & miss, the last half-dozen are where the rollercoaster ride starts.
21 June 2015 at 09:49 #40751@fatmaninabox thank you for that info.
I had no real viewing interest in Ch 9 at the time but I suspect the series was considered goofball enough to show at a late hour and perhaps viewers thought, as you originally did, that it was Space Muppets, so they tuned out, and never returned.
I saw the final wrap speech written by Matt Roush (I believe) on youtube along with some mini-sodes. It was a very moving speech and read by Kemper with a degree of apt poignancy. I’m not sure if the mini-sodes on the internet are actual mini-sodes in the Doctor Who framework .
One witnesses Crichton marooned on an island with a Jeremiah-like beard & accompanied by the Turtle (as I fondly refer to him). The Turtle is considered a God, typically revealed as a false prophet which causes Aeryn to storm the planet with the wrath of interstellar gods. But I’ll wait & see whether it appears in a standalone.
@jimthefish and anyone (@Ichabod)
Another annoying and off-this-topic question is: have you seen a series set in Birmingham called Peaky Blinders? It was given to me so pls don’t think I have extraordinarily bad taste (though I’ve been watching Gordon Ramsey lately and that’s so sophisticated I need to wash my garments every time I complete an ep!).
Blinders does have Helen McGrory, a fav of time since Anna Karenina and starred in a law show opposite the great Phil Davis back in the ’90s which also co-starred a very young Rupert Penry-Jones.
Kindest, purforfillion
21 June 2015 at 10:23 #40753@purofilion — I suspect it all comes down to numbers in the end. Neither Firefly nor I assume Farscape got high enough viewing figures (meaning that advertisers are reluctant to spend vast sums to advertise during these shows) and therefore that the suits can justify cancellation in favour of something more lucrative.
Genre TV has an added problem in that it still has a ‘for kids’ vibe to it, which is by no means as pronounced as it was, but of which the vestiges are still there. This means that a great many executives are reluctant to take a chance on it and are happier to let it die. As I mentioned on the Firefly blog, shows like this required nurturing and become hits by slow build-up and persistence. And that requires little things like not screwing with the order of episodes and making sure that viewers know where to find the show week on week.
Don’t forget that a lot of genre TV is a lot more expensive than, say, a detective show because it requires a higher VFX/SFX budgets, greater times in post and so on. Shows that went on to become ground-breakers like Buffy and the X-Files benefited, I suspect, from being set in ‘the present’, keeping costs down a little.
Game of Thrones is a little different. It’s been a bona fide hit for a start. And the HBO model is a little different. It’s not scrabbling around for advertisers and because of its subscription model it gets paid whatever happens. And this gives it a little more freedom creatively.
Theoretically the BBC has precisely the same freedom but I think it has weakened its dramatic output over the past decade or so by operating under what seems like a commercial mindset. Thus more non-commercial, more experimental drama of the kind that it used to make often just don’t get made anymore because commissioning editors are thinking in commercial terms that shouldn’t necessarily apply to them.
However, there are also signs that new paradigms are emerging. Netflix and Amazon — and others — are changing the way shows are funded and made, based on consumers’ evolving relationships with continuing drama (from the rise of the box set through to streaming video we are just watching stuff differently now). The example of Ripper Street is a good case in point of the difference between the old and new models. I think it’s likely that if Firefly and Farscape were shows of today that they both would have been saved by one of the streaming services.
21 June 2015 at 10:30 #40754@purofilion — Watched a bit of the first season of Peaky Blinders but just couldn’t get on with it at all. Nicely made, good performances and an OK script but seemed to me to be a prime example of what I was talking about above RE. the Beeb. Seemed commercially and suit-driven rather than out of a creative impetus. Someone sitting down and saying ‘we want our own Boardwalk Empire’ and this is what they came up with. Although I think I might resent it slightly because I believe it’s what knackered Ripper Street at the Beeb, as they feared the shows might look too similar, despite RS to my mind being the quirkier, more interesting, less cynically opportunistic of the two.
I’ve been enjoying the current documentary series How To Be a Bohemian on the Beeb though. Victoria Cohen can be a bit insufferably smug (and rather conservative) in her commentary but it’s still a fun little series so far.
21 June 2015 at 18:44 #40759Thanks, all, for throwing some light on what the heck happened to “Farscape”, which we watched avidly until all the torture scenes got to me and I walked away (some eps had a definite Mel Gibson vibe to them in that respect). Next thing I knew, I couldn’t check back to see if things had changed because — Farscape wasn’t there any more!
21 June 2015 at 22:01 #40761sheesh – so that was season 5 of Game of Thrones.
No spoilers from me, but its dour stuff, with the pieces moved a bit around the board.
To my mind, that’s all this season was. But I’m not really a great ‘reader’ of episodes or series and this is just my “phew” off the back of a two-day marathon of 10 episodes. But it did still feel like “learning to govern” and “learning to be hurt” (neither being mutually exclusive).
I’m also not a great fan of ‘zombies’, so I think I might find declining rewards from GoT.
FWIW the tits&arse aspect for this season was far more obviously gratuitous. Completely no need for it and interesting that all the major actors didn’t flash too much (so all the T&A was left to extras). When the main characters did do nudity, you could argue it was actually powerful.
Anyway, now just got to cleanse my palette so I can watch Strange and Norrell for this week. I’m still a bit ‘punchy’ from GoT (lots of big-battle fighting and death this season).
22 June 2015 at 01:27 #40762@whisht for all the talk of Norrell we don’t have it in Oz. @janetteb has it -but that’s on Foxtel or cable TV or some other ‘thing’.
I recall you mentioning GoT before and I thought you hadn’t seen any of it?
A 5th Season? Didn’t even know there was one! The 4th really turned me sour, actually, so I’m going to be saving me pennies and if it’s on Netflix (which I aim to sort) then I can see it then. I find the violence prurient in the extreme so the 4 seasons I have I might actually sell!! No idea how to do that, but I shall check the internet where all will be revealed. ManInABox spoke of ways to purchase the pre-owned stuff which, whilst not in inner Sydney or in Brisbane at all, can possibly be done on line.
@jimthefish I wasn’t aware there were torture scenes in Farscape? But I guess that I can FF & mute it for the Boy if necessary.
22 June 2015 at 09:47 #40764@purofilion — RE. Torture in Farscape, I wouldn’t know as I’ve only seen a couple of episodes really. And it’s been removed from Netflix UK so I shan’t be catching up on it anytime soon unless I can get hold of some boxsets quickly.
RE. Game of Thrones. I must admit that by the end of s4 I was getting pretty bored of it all. So much so that haven’t even bothered to watch more than a couple of episodes of s5. I’m not massively keen on the fantasy genre in general anyway and I increasingly find it just a grind to get through an episode and this season sounds as if it were very much treading water anyway.
22 June 2015 at 09:53 #40765Okay, I’ve caught two episodes of Strange & Norrell, and I like them very much — but am being driven absolutely crazy by frequent breaks for as much as four consecutive minutes of advertisements to every seven or so minutes of program! They’re running almost an hour and a quarter here, to make room for the god damned ads! It’s maddening!
What I can see, I like; but I think maybe we’re getting a drastically cut version, trimmed to make more space for bloody advertising.
“Penny Dreadful” is rolling along quite brilliantly, very satisfying — with a startling double wallop of downright feminist dialog in Series 2 episode 8 about the “place” and treatment of women in Victorian England; took me very much by surprise. I am a bit downcast, though, by the African character Sembene, who seems to me to very clearly fit the description of a recurrent SF and adventure stereotype that POC have pointed out and drily named “The Magic Negro” — the black “sidekick” who has hidden magical powers which he or she *only* uses to further the interests of his white associates, never showing signs of even having any independent goals or interests of his/her own. The first clearly identified figure of this kind was the black man who helps the young hero in Stephen King’s “The Shining” to deal with supernatural forces in that novel, and as they say, once you see, you can’t unsee; so I call Magical Negro status on Sembene, with apologetic regrets (the actor is excellent and a commanding presence in the story).
I do love it that The Creature, here “John Claire”, that Frankenstein brought to life harks back (at least at the beginning) to Mary Shelley’s original idea of an intelligent, basically sweet-natured being twisted into resentment and violence by the reactions of others to his appearance (and those cold, dead hands, of course). He’s presented as almost a sort of poetic soul of very meek demeanor, not a mute, coarse-framed, looming giant. A wonderful conceit, IMO.
22 June 2015 at 15:18 #40766You should have 60 minutes of drama – basically they whizz into the action immediately after the 60 second recap. They are, however, bringing out the blu-ray here practically the second that the finale has broadcast.
I hope they haven’t cut anything; compressing a massive doorstep of a novel into a seven part series is hard enough as it is (to the extent that they were allowed to expand to 7 hours – instead of 6 – providing they did it on the same budget). Entire backstories get compressed into one line.
My assessment (at Episode 6) is ‘bloody brilliant’. Shame it seems to be getting a tiny audience over here.
22 June 2015 at 15:26 #40767@bluesqueakpip I have been busy recommending your posts over on the Guardian. Just watched the last episode and has taken an hour or two to re adjust back to reality. Unfortunately we have a very long wait until the final ep as we are heading of O.S. tomorrow.
@ichabod. Shame about the adds. It must really break the immersive effect. It is a series well worth buying the DVD or Blu-Ray of.
Cheers
Janette
22 June 2015 at 22:57 #40771@janetteb – I have returned the compliment and recommended your post. 😉
I do agree that it takes some time to return to reality after each episode; I find myself re-watching almost immediately.
22 June 2015 at 23:02 #40772Hi @purofilion – earlier last year I had some ‘spare’ time and binged on a massive 4 season viewing of Game of Thrones.
Though maybe that’ the new normal (bingeing hours of TV!)Anyway, really liked GoT to begin with. Liked the characters, how they develop, die and found it very satisfying where I really wanted to know what happened next.
But over the four seasons there’s probably been diminishing returns and the last season I binged over at the weekend. And its dour stuff. Big battles, petty deaths. Less memorable dialogue, more memorable nudity and swearing (a bad thing as it stands out for being utterly unnecessary as opposed to ‘real’).
hey ho. Maybe its an arc or something.As for Strange and Norrell – I wasn’t utterly taken at first and still find it good in parts. Its as if I’m liking it reluctantly. I can’t tell if its because I remember liking the book (and as Blue says its very abridged though maybe tighter than the book). Maybe its a slightly stilted approach to the acting (though certainly similar to how non-genre TV takes this period and who knows maybe realistic!).
But I do like Mark Warren’s Gentleman (not as I imagined but I enjoy what he’s done – almost forming the words as someone who doesn’t speak English very often; or someone drunk if I was being cruel) and Arabella. I don’t know the actress, but I’m as taken with her as the Gentleman is – she’s intelligent, and has several small moments (a kiss she begins, a look in the eye) which give her a sense of being more ‘real’ than Carvel’s Strange (maybe she’s just a better actor – dunno; happy to be told I’m wrong!).
But Paul Kaye…. ffs. Either he should get some range in his acting or people should find actors who can ‘do’ “madcap” [deliberate word] tramps. Good luck to him but he’s never a surprise.
hm – enough of my pointless blathering. Strange & Norrell can wait I’d say in terms of when you see it as its less spoilerable imo.
22 June 2015 at 23:26 #40773bloomin’ ‘eck.
Just been to read some of the comments on the Jonathan Strange Guardian boards after JanetteB’s link.
Some commenters really like the sound of their own keyboard.
I’d say as much but can’t be arsed with having to explain what an opinion is to them.
[sigh]
23 June 2015 at 00:12 #40775@whisht – yes. I always find it strange (not Jonathan Strange, just strange) how some people not only define ‘not my cup of tea’ as ‘an objective judgement of quality’, but will seemingly watch a ‘bad’ series week after week.
The only explanation I can think of is that they live in a household that doesn’t know what the pretty red button on the remote is for. Possibly they think it’s some kind of self-destruct. 😉
Charlotte Riley’s very good, isn’t she? But pretty well all the actors are very, very good – lots of BAFTA material in this series. Carvel’s doing a terrific ‘arc’ for his character, but he’s a lot more theatrical than Ms Riley. However, I’d say that suits Jonathan Strange, so possibly it was an artistic choice.
23 June 2015 at 02:32 #40778@whisht thank you for the info on Strange (*\*) -I hope to catch it someday. I hear Netflix has no ads (& therefore might show it) which sounds compelling enough and I fully respect @ichabod‘s annoyance with ads every 7 or so minutes and it’s why I never actually watch telly. There’s a tendency amongst some of our teachers to assume that means I’m an “annoying git who is a show-off to boot as she listens to opera all day, wouldn’t know a rock song if it splashed in her face and watches the ABC just to show how immensely twatty she really is.”
Who knows, they may not think this at all! Just because I work at the uni occasionally, doesn’t mean I don’t like pop or rock or jazz. Also, the ABC has its own share of total garbage. I was noticing an ad on youtube which advertised an Australian/BBC production with David Wenham about the ‘convict experience’. I think it’s called Banished but I could be off-track there.
We haven’t heard of it, yet.
Ah, yes, the marathon watch of GoT -it can be quite persuasive in a way and catches you in its tits&ass net, so to speak. I don’t recall much vulgarity (with language) but then possibly I was completely taken by everything else. I wonder whether the little person still survives? He was the only one with clever lines. I guess Dragon Lady will emerge as the star of Westeros with her army of the undead, the dead, The Faith, The Seven or The Virgins. No, I think it’s the latter -although they’re castrated, if I recall?
@jimthefish I didn’t know you weren’t watching Farscape! Sorry about that, there. I don’t confess to a total love of it yet. I loved a few episodes and Crichton is compelling as a character. I’m still ‘space muppeting’ about it as Rygel with his farts and binge eating and just his, well, floating about, is very irritating. I guess there is a lot to the characters but I just don’t love them a great deal. At this point in F’Fly -episode 8 – I was in love with the lot. I wasn’t ever a fan of all the greasy, wacky space aliens in various films (except ET) & so meeting people with odd eyes (or no eyes), several heads and lizards with mouths isn’t my thing. I’m waiting for the main characters to open up.
I can say – & that’s weird considering this site – that I’m not a fan of sci-fi and fantasy -so she says now!
@pedant gave me a list of great books to start with but other than the most famous, & perhaps the more ‘obvious’ I never really read them as a younger person. My particular interest was drama and literature from a different genre altogether. Even films and telly of a fantasy nature never grabbed me: other than Who, that was it! With Buffy and Firefly things changed but I haven’t been fully converted to Farscape. I guess it being Australian makes me want to applaud it. But gosh, I do cringe at the Oz accents. They’re really noticeable and high pitched which I’ve never liked. High pitches rarely soothe the ear which is why my personal repertoire has denounced the Romantic era of music and centres on Baroque, early Baroque, Renaissance and early Classical.
Kindest, puro
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