The Next Doctor (2)
2 March 2014 at 07:03 #26007Anonymous @
@faegrl when The Tenth said ‘a baby?’ and Rose said ‘no’, she didn’t mean “their baby” as in his and Rose’s!! He was worried it was Mickey’s, I think who was hanging about the house with Rose’s dad from parallel universe and Rose’s mum from Universe A.
Nope. no pregnancy of Rose and the Doctor. Or Mick, for that matter. I hope so anyway. Maybe @bluesqueakpip will enlighten us with her vertiginous memory.
Hi @Recky (love the avatar) welcome. I too, ‘mate’, am from Straya! Hence the time zone response. Gosford. Cool!
I’m in my 40s and remember pretty much all of Who being shown in the 70s and 80s before it died out. As for Capaldi. My gosh, he’s my luurve. That man. Sigh…. Right, fantasy over.
He’s been in BBCs, The Hour, in The Thick of It. Also various Scottish TV productions which can be bought on Amazon. Additionally, a man of the stage who I was lucky to see when in England some yrs ago.
Anyway you’ll have a wonderful time reading material on this site: it’s fun, mature, kind and sensible (well, not always that, I hope, as bonkers theories abound). As we get closer to the new Doctor’s arrival, theories will churn through time like shooting stars. And so they should.
Kindest, purofilion2 March 2014 at 07:19 #26008
@purofilion – Oh? I never would have guessed he meant Micky, for the fact Rose and him were over since the start of the Doctor showing up as the Ninth. And I was pretty sure that poor Mick had long got the hint of it, way before the final goodbye between Rose and Tenth. So, that’s why I deduced that it was a bit of a joke there of the Doctor worried that Rose was pregnant with his baby, but she wasn’t. However, no the Doctor didn’t have a child with any of his companions, as far as I know of. He did have children, hence the granddaughter Susan, but nothing is known about his previous family beyond her. It was just a moment in the episode of Rose and Tenth that made fans go, “Ah-ha! So they did get together off-camera at one point!” Heehee. 😉2 March 2014 at 08:28 #26009
@Recky – he’s very well known in Britain, yes. He has ‘name’ recognition, especially as the Machiavellian spin doctor Malcolm Tucker in the comedy programme ‘The Thick of It’.
He’s also done a number of films; Local Hero, In The Loop, Dangerous Liasons, Lair of the White Worm. And he’s won two British Academy of Film and Television Awards – Best Short Film (he also writes and directs) and Best Comedy Actor.
He’s also a Doctor Who fan. Which is quite possibly why this extremely successful actor gave up another prime-time role (Cardinal Richlieu in The Musketeers) to play The Doctor. 😉2 March 2014 at 08:59 #26010Anonymous @
@Recky I done tol’ you didn’t I?? @bluesqueakpip is our resident knower of all things….well, ALL things, really. Yes, I couldn’t remember any title except In the Loop and The Thick of It. Of course, The Musketeers. No doubt a handsomely paid man as an actor -not that they pay Doctors poorly any more I believe! Kindest, puro.2 March 2014 at 09:12 #26011
@purofilion – nope, no pregnancies outside of Torchwood. And Amy and Rory, of course. While many characters have had children mentioned, Baby Melody is supposed to be the first ever pregnancy shown on-screen on Doctor Who. It was also pretty obvious that the tone meetings had decided that they had to avoid the word ‘conception’. 😈
Madame Vastra had quite some difficulty asking the Doctor if he’d been sleeping with Amy – without using the words or phrases ‘sex’, ‘conception’ ‘sleeping with’ or ‘are you all in a threesome?’ 😈
Presumably this was on the grounds that ‘Rory and Amy are married and now they’re having a baby’ is understandable to all small children, but ‘Mummy/Daddy, what’s conception mean?’ is likely to lead to impromptu sex education sessions. 😉2 March 2014 at 12:47 #26012ConfusedPolarity @confusedpolarity
@Recky – as @bluesqueakpip and @purofilion say, Capaldi is very much a “name” actor in the UK – far more than most of his predecessors during my lifetime have been when taking on the role! I understand Eccleston was in the same kind of bracket when he took the role although I have to admit I didn’t know who he was…. maybe Capaldi’s been in more of the kind of shows I watch!
I’d add the Civil War drama “The Devil’s Whore” to his list of credits too; I’m a history geek so not often impressed by “historical dramas” but have to say, his King Charles I was superb.2 March 2014 at 16:01 #26029Arbutus @arbutus
@faegrl I have to agree here with @purofilion, I always assumed that Mickey was meant in that little moment. It would have been the obvious thing to wonder, especially if, like the Doctor, the subtleties of human relationships elude you just a little. We know that Rose was never going back to Mickey, but would the Doctor have known that?
@Recky I loved Capaldi years ago in the Bill Forsyth film Local Hero, which was a big favourite of mine when it came out. He was absolutely charming, earnest, and very funny!2 March 2014 at 23:16 #26040
@arbutus – Hmm… interesting. You know the fans in US did take that moment to mean that The Doctor thought it was his baby, not Rose and Mickey. Not to discount yours and @purofilion view, not at all. It’s just weird how we took it differently. Which goes to show, one person’s “obvious” is not always the same for everyone. And to answer your question: Yes. I do think the Doctor would realize that Rose and Mickey were over and take that hint long before. For two reasons, he’s the Doctor and clever. And two, they had a bit of a love affair before that moment of goodbye (re: the hand holding and lovey dovey looks to each other), so he had to have known that Rose was so over Mickey. Unless he thought she was a tart, who flirts with him and yet has a boyfriend. Hmm…
Or that’s just my observations of it. I also think that Mickey had long figured out that it was over between him and Rose, and he did complain about it once or twice to the Doctor. So, the Doctor would have realized it from there. And he was aware that Martha had a crush on him, way before she left the Tardis, yet hoped to ignore it. He quickly discovered it with Amy (he had no choice but to see that one, as she kissed him the night before her wedding). And that whole disclaimer he made with Donna Nobel of “I just want a mate!”, expressing that he was tired of his companions falling for him, besides Rose. People laugh, but I often refer to Martha as the “rebound companion”, as Rose was the only one yet that the Doctor had honestly fallen for. As illustrated in this comic: Doctor Who: The Rebound.3 March 2014 at 02:38 #26042Arbutus @arbutus
@faegrl I should say that I have always experienced DW in a bit of a vacuum. I don’t have friends or family who watch the show, and only in the last year or so have I really followed things on forums (of course, there didn’t use to be forums to follow!). So it may well be that the entirety of North American fandom took that scene one way, and me another. 🙂
In my view, contrary to that of many fans, I do not believe that the Doctor was actually in love with Rose. I think he cared for her very deeply; but I never found it convincing that a millennium-old alien with the history and experience of the doctor would fall in love with any human. I absolutely believe that Rose was in love with him, for many obvious reasons; but I don’t believe that he loved her the same way. For one thing, how do we explain the fling with Reinette in The Girl in the Fireplace? For another, there is the awkward moment in The Impossible Planet, when Rose suggests that, trapped without the TARDIS, the Doctor will have to settle down. He jokes a bit about it, but when she suggests that they might settle down together, he gives her a very uncomfortable look, and she falls into an awkward silence. And of course, there is their final goodbye in Journey’s End, when he can’t say the words that she wants to hear: I love you.
I don’t expect everyone (or even most people) to agree with me on this, but that’s okay.3 March 2014 at 03:17 #26043Anonymous @
@arbutus and @faegrl no no, you are right Arbutus (IMHO). I do agree with you. I found it unconvincing myself. I’ve expressed previously that the Doctor really loved Rose: but ‘in love’ with her?? I was never sure. A psychologist friend of mine believes that the concept of ‘loving’ and being ‘in love’ is very difficult for people (patients, notably) to appreciate. They get hung up on the idea after years of being together that if they don’t somehow experience feelings of ‘in love-ness’ that their relationship is over. This psychologist tried, and still tries, to convince them otherwise.
A long and happy relationship may move from that surging, animated, heart in the mouth terror/love to something more settled and comfortable. Is that bad? No, curiously I think it’s wonderful and quite beautiful. After all, love, in its early days is coupled with beauty and the mother of beauty is (not terror) alarm. See something intrinsically beautiful? We immediately associate such perfection with amazement which turns to alarm and even discomfort -not necessarily a bad thing. It keeps us on our toes (eeer. Yes).
Perhaps, then, it was enough that the Doctor really ‘loved’ Rose and was delighted and content to spend the rest of his time with her (as the Blue suited one-heart Doctor). Maybe her feelings (still as a love-struck teenager) were different to his. As you say, he’s a 1000 year old alien.
He feels wonder at complex machinery and species who have adapted into sentient, non-corporeal vessels. He knows civilisations millions of years old and has seen these universes born, re-made and destroyed only to be re-made and destroyed all over again. He knows of many things; the deepest fears and vanities of species. And he’s confessed to keeping terrible secrets of his own which must never ever be told. Such loneliness! And yet Reinette could understand more than a little of this terrible weight. Despite her youth, she had a maturity and wisdom exceeding Rose’s. He feels the earth move under his feet 🙂 (I had to get that in there….for some fun as I’m taking this all too seriously -being self-indulgent- and love needs a little lightness).
Kindest to you, purofilion3 March 2014 at 04:08 #26047Anonymous @
Boy Oh Boy. I finished that paragraph above really quickly (for me)!! I had a tradesman ready to be paid. About early November we had a lightning strike and lost the modem, the BOSE stereo, large TV and other bits n pieces of electronics. In fact, it was only through Mr Ilion’s Ipad that I found this Forum. I had only 3G availability. If I’d waited for my insurer to deliver on all the technology (not buying the modem for ourselves first), I wouldn’t have had any internet access until today! So what’s that? From mid-November til March 3? Grief! I guess I have the lightning strike to thank for clicking on (or ‘swiping) the Ipad and finding this great space. Yee-hah. Now of course I have to learn how to use this new TV. Even the Bose is waaaay different from 13 years ago. You don’t actually put a CD in the system! You place it in the DVD player and it connects: automatically with no power cords! I am way behind the times, that’s for sure.
Anyhow others may disagree with me about 10s love/’in-love’-ness for Rose. I think he loved her deeply (maybe not in the same way that others saw). Disappearing into the void and caught by her dad, 10 was mighty glad she was safe and yes, torn from him so quickly (not so glad). But look what happened when Amy and Rory were vanished back to NY: he spent months locked away, clinically depressed. Who knows what aliens feel? We have our human interpretation of emotions but dovetailing them along side a multi form so complex like a Time Lord is probably going to result in a diminished, two dimensional evaluation if not a complete avulsion.
Right….I must now learn how to turn the new TV on, or off – yikes, the Academy Awards. Why do they sound so grave when announcing “the nominations are:…” It’s like a Nobel Prize dinner! Mad!3 March 2014 at 04:41 #26049Anonymous @
@faegrl yes I think that Martha had a crush on the Doctor: but more than a crush I think; she fell in love with him. As for Amy, I might respectfully disagree? I think Amy said: “Oh Doctor, how nice, but I wasn’t thinking about anything so long term!” Smooch, smooch, hands every where…. She was attracted to him and wanted a nice little slap and tickle before the wedding but her love was with Rory-and always had been. If a young, cool (but nerdy) guy takes you to ‘outer space’ you might well want to indulge yourself a moment: if you’re 19 and flighty! And that was Amy for sure.
You know, all this talk about romance and love (I heard this from a new poster who has a radio blog which is very nice) makes me long for Capaldi in the role. My son is 12 and tired of the ‘does he love her; or love her not’ theme: “this is a Sci-Fi show mum: it’s about adventure and monsters not sex!”. Whoa. And of course RTD wanted an instant success: good looking young Doctors in love with sexy companions was a great tag line along with astounding special effects. Let’s keep the arcs mysterious and the Doctors equally so….
Kindest, puro.3 March 2014 at 07:15 #26051
I’m back! I just got done with laundry and all of the menial tasks of my daily life, yet was pleasantly surprised to find my inbox full of great DW debate! Seriously… you people are beautiful and make my life a lot less dull! I’m not brown-nosing, just stating a fact. 🙂
@arbutus – Regarding viewing DW in a vacuum, I can relate, believe it or not. I know I speak of my grandmother and great grandmother, but the honest truth is that by the time I became a fan of the show, both had died. I never got the chance to speak with them about it or watch shows with them sadly. And as I mentioned before, my mother was never a real fan of the show. She found it “weird and scary”, although it was her who told me how much my relatives had loved the show. As for forums, I have joined a few, but none were as graceful or intelligent about the show, like this forum. The usual course was that I would write a opinion contrary to what the others may view it, then it would become personal rather than a healthy debate. It was more like, “You don’t like the Eleventh Doctor? You found him ‘too silly’? Well, you’re ugly, you’re stupid, you’re breath smells, and your mother is horrible for ever giving birth to you!” That’s when I began to become a “lurker” on forums, never commenting or sharing my views, just watching everyone else bicker in such a personal way with some few hints of any information about the show that was useful. So, it’s just me and my sister who have Doctor Who discussions now… which lead me to this forum. I only joined it because I saw the “no flaming” rule. 😉
Now, for the subject about Rose and the Doctor, I have to disagree there, respectfully of course! You ask how can I explain the moments with the Tenth, well I can do so very simply, but I warn you that I see with eyes of a “hopeless romantic”. The episode with Reinette had clearly sparked such jealously in Rose, as if they were a couple, that didn’t go over well and there was some angst over that one. And when Rose asked about settling down together and the Doctor did that awkward pause, the same thing happens with some men when their girlfriend asks, “when are we going to move in together?” It doesn’t mean that he does not love the girl, the Doctor may have had cold feet about taking that next step. And when he ran out of time and hesitate in telling her “I love you”, a lot of men have an issue in saying those three little words sometimes, it doesn’t mean that they don’t feel it or think it. And the Doctor also cried tears after that scene. However, the biggest evidence on how the Doctor really felt about Rose is when he dropped off his clone to be with her, “Journey’s End”. Rose asked the clone, “Before you disappeared, what were you going to say to me”, the clone whispered in her ear and she kissed him… very much! OR… you could just say it was because the clone was half human or something like that.
Although, I have to disagree with the idea that the Doctor could never fall in love with a human… River Song was part human and he was in love with her, she was his wife. It just has to be an extraordinary human, in order for the Doctor to break is defenses… and I believe he doesn’t wish to fall in love with humans because he’s a Time Lord and sooner or later they will die and he will not. Yet, as the Seventh Doctor had quoted before, “Love has never been noted for its rationality.” Even the Doctor has no power over who he falls in love with.
And yes, it’s very okay if you don’t agree with me! It’s just one of my theories is all. 😉3 March 2014 at 07:23 #26052
@purofilion – Yes, DO disagree about Amy, because you’re so right! She was more of a flighty hands everywhere type. lol. Not at all on the same level of Rose or Martha, who were actually in love with the Doctor. Yeah… I wouldn’t want to indulge, even if it was the Doctor, while engaged. Then again, I’m so not flighty and not that young either. However, I can understand he lack of judgment there, if only for a moment. 😉
I think this conversation of relationships happened when another member bought it up, about the Clara and “next Doctor” possible romance. Now we’re revising all of the love-matches of earlier regenerations. Seesh! Not that I mind, but I fear the Topic Dalek stopping by and exterminating us all. 😮3 March 2014 at 21:20 #26077Anonymous @
@faegrl That was/is a lovely tale you shared about your memories of your grandmother and great grandmother – how amazing. Thank you for sharing that-it was sweet, though brought a tear to my eye.
All these great discussions occur over night!! I wake up and da dum, all this terrific debate…and music on the other thread. Yes, I can’t wait to see how Capaldi copes with his memories, or even to understand how deeply buried they are. I will miss River Song and whilst I think her time is past and the next Doctor’s feelings would not be so insistent regarding River, I assume she’s now ‘let go’ her ‘presence’. Perhaps she knew too that the Eleventh Doctor’s time had…. elapsed.
Kindest, purofilion4 March 2014 at 03:21 #26081
@purofilion – Aw, thank you and it’s alright. I feel like in watching this show and being a true fan of it, I’m still connected to my grandmother and great grand, and with every BG episode I watch I think, “This may have been episodes they had enjoyed too!” And it feels like I’m carrying on the Whovian tradition within my family. It’s nice. 🙂
Yes! This forum is the best, I love how I sleep and then wake up to so many mentions and new posts to check out. It’s like Christmas every day. I think I’m becoming a bit addicted to this site.
I will miss River Song as well, if she’s truly gone. Although, I think it’s fitting that she should fade away, like the Eleventh, a final ending to that chapter and love story. However, we never know what curve-balls the writers will decide to chuck at us next. I’m way too excited for the new season to began!24 March 2014 at 04:00 #26574pah1971 @pah1971
Watch Torch-wood so yes funny that Peter Capaldi is the new doctor.. I wonder if Clara will get to go with the doctor to see Gallifrey or here is a thought the face of Boa aka Jack Harkness should get to see the doctors home planet or we have the wedding of river song and the doctor on Gallifrey . who knows but the possibilities is endless. as long as each new episode is leading the new Doctor home I will be happy.
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<div class=”notifyIcon” style=”display: none;”></div>11 April 2014 at 06:55 #26802sdunc76 @sdunc76
I am actually quite happy with Peter Capaldi as the next doctor, though I must admit it will take some getting use to.
I have been somewhat unhappy with some of moffat
s previous decisions and I hope the next series is better. Ill be honest with you, I don’t like Clara very much. I wish they hadn`t killed off Amy and Rory, I think they were something a little different for the show and I really loved Amy, it was sad to see them go.
Has anyone else realized that Clara and Amy share a similar personality and in season 8 they are potentially introducing a new companion as well as Clara, Danny pink I think they named the character (Samuel Anderson), I can`t help but see the similarities, its all getting a little boring and stupid.
And then there is River song, should they keep her in the show?
And how about the doctor, each doctor has a different symbolic thing, a word or a habit or how they dress, something like that. What is Peter Capaldi`s going to be?11 April 2014 at 06:59 #26803sdunc76 @sdunc76
As for the love stuff, I was ok with it. I`m ok with River Song and the kissing every once and a while. But I want to see more SciFi than romance I must agree.11 April 2014 at 07:10 #26804Anonymous @
Matt Smiths regeneration was both awesome and underwhelming…he blasts the baddys with his regeneration energy and then Capaldi “popped” into reality…to be fair, it took me a good half of Matts 1st season to get into his Doctor…I can only give Capaldi a similar gesture3 July 2014 at 04:19 #28671PhantomTollbooth @thephantomtollbooth
I’m happy that they’re going to have an older Doctor. I could never take Eleven seriously.
Capaldi looks like he’ll be amazing. I hope he’s just a bit scary and unpredictable like Seven was.7 August 2014 at 09:12 #29599Whisht @whisht
However – if you were to unexpectedly meet the Doctor in the street, what one question would you ask him?
😉7 August 2014 at 09:25 #296007 August 2014 at 09:48 #29601Whisht @whisht
@bluesqueakpip – the REAL Doctor!*
I’d probably say something like…
“erm, oh, wow, erm…. can I help?”
No harm in asking.
(Actually there probably would be danger of harm, but y’know, might just get that once-in-a-lifetime-adventure!)
* He does exist y’know. Just like Santa.
(Obviously if I saw Santa I’d ask for a shiny red bike, and then go “duh! I meant World Peace! Can I have another go?”)
😉7 August 2014 at 10:18 #29602Anonymous @
@whisht only one question? I’d ask, “could you take me somewhere?” or, rather, to avoid the inevitable “yes, I could”, I’d ask, “Please take me somewhere, would you?” In which case there’d be a planet or a constellation called Somewhere peopled (well, ‘creatured’) with those who never speak in any form except through questions. My day was oddly filled by people well versed in side-stepping questions by asking their own. A small nightmare. Kindest, puro.7 August 2014 at 11:42 #29607
@whisht – “Is there a vacancy in the TARDIS?” would be mine – though, given the death rate of people who want to travel with the Doctor, “Should I notify my next-of-kin?” might be the subtext. 😉14 August 2014 at 11:28 #29734denissenco @denissenco
I like this show very much. The plot of 7 season is: The Doctor is captured and taken by his old and surely the most evil enemies, whom you can easy recognize by the “exterminate!” word. Doctor’s two married companions will get into this trouble together with him, but their situation will be even more difficult as their marriage faces this time the threat bigger than the daleks – a family crisis.
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