On The Sofa (6)
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Craig 10 years, 11 months ago.
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14 June 2015 at 07:07 #40640
Hello each, I’m Missy and raring to go and delighted to be here.
16 June 2015 at 19:42 #40679Here is another obsessive fan that goes back to Pertwee and this was very fun to watch
17 June 2015 at 08:59 #40688Hello there!
Took me a while to find something to write about (while I enjoy ‘just reading’ your postings!), but finally something popped up in front of me:
I think I found out, what happened to the walking base stations from ‘The Bells of St. John’ after the Doctor was finished with Miss Kizlet – they went into advertising! Saw them in a Calzedonia shop in Cologne.
17 June 2015 at 13:25 #40697@stormageddon Now that would not encourage one to venture into the shop. btw nice to hear from you.
Cheers
Janette
18 June 2015 at 15:11 #40702Courtesy of last week’s Popbitch (for non UKers a salacious – if past its best – gossip newsletter and website with a focus on music, media and celebrity generally). I can’t make up my mind whether “enjoy breakfast” is a euphemism or not.
Those of a over-sensitive disposition should look away now.
“Ask a Doctor Who fan where Patrick Troughton
died and they will likely tell you
that he died at a Doctor Who
convention in Columbus,
Georgia, two days after his
67th birthday.Which is perfectly correct.
But another answer would be:
“At a Doctor Who convention,
inside a fangirl with whom he
was about to enjoy breakfast.”Said fangirl has been dining
out on this story ever since.”18 June 2015 at 15:52 #40703PS – an update this week
“An addendum to last week’s Dr Who
story. We neglected to mention
that Patrick Troughton was also
in full costume at the time.”18 June 2015 at 20:08 #40707@pedant — I think the only reaction to that story is ‘oh my giddy aunt!’
19 June 2015 at 04:41 #40714@pedant my reaction to that story would mirror @jimthefish‘s if I had any aunts to get giddy.
Cheers
Janette
21 June 2015 at 10:22 #40752I would really love to join in,but am having trouble navigating my way around.
Bear with me.
Missy
21 June 2015 at 11:34 #40755Anonymous @
welcome @missy this is the best place to start. Or, go to the Activity page which will let you know who said what in the recent future 😉
Or click on ‘Forums’ which lead to specific areas about all things Doctor (from 1 onwards) and also Books, The Pub (Cloven Hoof) for deep discussions and The Sofa for lighter ‘sessions/discussions’ and a great place for a new member to start.
There are also Blogs for various things Dr and non-Dr at the moment.
enjoy!
puro.
22 June 2015 at 22:29 #40770Hi, all — for those interested, found something interesting on Den of Geek this morning; the kicker is in the last couple of exchanges (but I love the whole think — “Truly, Madly, Deeply” is one of the greats, IMO, so is “Galaxy Quest”:
24 June 2015 at 00:52 #4079424 June 2015 at 01:10 #40796Ah, Galaxy Quest. That film nearly got me thrown out of the cinema, I was laughing so much.
Well, you can imagine. It mercilessly takes the p*ss out of actors, out of SF geeks and out of SF conventions. As an SF geek who has been known to attend conventions and is also a professional actor, I didn’t stand a chance. 😀
Well forget it! I’m not doing it! This episode was badly written!
Excuse me, I’m starting to snortle…
24 June 2015 at 22:28 #40809hey guys im mlpiceking. Im new I love Doctor who and sci fi shizz. couldn’t find another forum to introduce my self so hiii.
26 June 2015 at 00:24 #40837@purofilion (#40794 above) Hmm, my panel? Can you give me a post #? Did I mention a panel at Wiscon (Madison feminist SF convention, May 21-25)? Blasted memory. Remind me? Thanks —
ichi
26 June 2015 at 01:30 #40840I recall you mentioning a literary convention you were attending in the past few weeks? In Oz, we’d call that a panel. I assumed, in this situation, you’ d be sitting in a large convention-centre-room where questions are directed at you and other panellists. I’ve been involved in a few where I was called upon to discuss the nature of textbook writing/publication and editing vs computers and internet search engines (believe me, a very boring panel, indeed!). Yours sounds far more intriguing.
I realise I responded to your discussion with kharis on the spoiler thread when I ‘digressed’ during the conversation after he’d suggested you ought to consider writing a novel or screenplay -hence my reply to both this poster and to you followed by a question (above) about the success of your trip. I think Madison, WIS, was the destination!
Kindest, puro
26 June 2015 at 02:58 #40841@purofilion Hiya! for you and all the Buffsters
Buffy aka Sara Michelle is doing a Q and A on FB – Not sure if it lines up for you in your time zone
but it is happening tomorrow@fatmaninabox Congradts to you and best wishes on your future horticultural career!
Only a smidge more than two months everybody and we all get to celebrate season 9 together! Hooray! 🙂
26 June 2015 at 07:06 #40846@purofilion — that would be Wiscon, yes; an interesting time was had by all, I’m sure — the convention is 39 yrs old, and last summer there was a super-bust up centering on sexual harassment complaints against a well-known editor (which should have been dealt with much sooner) and an uproar over dueling poets and racism. Result: all my old pals who’ve been running the show for decades made appropriate defenses and apologies and then stepped aside to be replaced by much younger women brimming with passion and energy and, probably, mistakes waiting to be made, and let’s see what happens next year! I will be on hand. It was grand, and honest, and exactly not the way this kind of thing is usually done . . . heads did not roll, and I doubt that grudges were founded. I was damned proud of us.
Now, an SF con in the States is a 2-5 day program of readings, speeches, discussions among what we call a panel of participants on a subject thrown open, after a while to the audience at large for questions and comments, yakking in restaurants and shops and (of course) the hotel bar, an exhibition of fan/pro art on SF themes, fun and games, hospitality suite, etc.
Here’s what I did there: at an opening party on the Friday afternoon, I gave tarot readings for three hours, which surprised me — usually I’m only good for about two, but I as smokin’ and had a long line of aspiring querants, because, they tell me, I am good at this. I went to the Helsinki WorldCon bid party (I hope the Helsinki Con committee wins, went once, want to go back).
Marked these panels in my program (though I didn’t get to all of them — it’s impossible):
“Overlapping Magisteria: Where Science, Religiion, and SF meet.” “Death to Love Triangles”. “Living in a Post-Growth Future”. “Scientific Utopianism in the work of Kim Stanley Robinson” (he was one of the guests of honor). “Kids Speak” about what they like in YA fiction. “Where are the Asexual Voices?” “Utopias, Cyborgs, and Dialects in Feminist SF”. “Fandom, Creators, and the Space between” (fan fiction). “What Makes a Character Come Alive?” “Can BDSM in Speculative Fiction be Feminist?” “Beyond Hogwarts: Magical Education in Fantasy Stories”. And lots more.
I was on a Panel called “Free-Range Parenting is a Social Justice Issue” as a product of a time when most working moms, like mine, necessarily raised their kids “free-range”, vs. stories of modern moms thrown into The System because a neighbor called Child Services on them because a nine-year-old daughter was allowed to go home on the subway on her own. I didn’t say much; I was busy listening.
I was not on a panel called “Don’t You Think he Looks Tired: Strategies for de-Moffatting Doctor Who”. I looked in just after they started and discovered that a) this was not the “STFU Moffat” gang over on tumblr, as I had expected, but glum adults, mostly women but not all, gloomily and resentfully commiserating over Moffat’s “sexism” (female companions circling a central male figure like subordinate planets around the Sun etc.), lousy writing (those long and longer plot and character arcs and other disappointing whatnots), and I’ve forgotten what else. When I realized that most of them hadn’t watched S8 because Deep Breath had seemed too downbeat (or, worse, just because fellow fans had warned them that the new Doctor was mean and gloomy etc.), I had to speak up. Nicely. I was sorry for them. None of them had bothered to go look up interviews with Moffat about S8 vs. S9. Afterward, the guy who had suggested the panel topic to the ConCom thanked me for having said the first thing he’d heard that had given him “hope”. What I’d said was, Moffat says now that Capaldi’s Doc is settled in and post regeneration fugue, he’s really hit his stride and scripts will be more about adventure and funnier.
Another panel that I was not on but joined at the panelists’ invitation was “Old heroes — are they Really Possible?” I used Capaldi’s Doctor as an example of audience reaction to an older actor taking on a leading part that had been held for years by young men. More thanks, after. There’s a lot to be said for being a little bit of a Grand Old Dame in your field (still with lots of good company, too — my generation has only recently begun to die off).
I think at this point all the genres have various regional conventions yearly — Western Writers of America, Romance Writers of America, Horror Writers, Mystery Writers, etc. Most are designed by pros for pros. SF Cons, on the other hand, have a long tradition of being organized, run, and paid for by the fans, who invite pros to come and participate in the program. Works great.
26 June 2015 at 07:07 #40847Rats. That ran on a bit; sorry for rambling so long!
26 June 2015 at 10:43 #40848@ichabod yep, our panels tend to be positive and not gloomy. I don’t recall any fights -which, you know, could be fun if there’s a sports bar in the middle <*\*>
Fancy thinking Capaldi (or Moffat) looks tired. Actually, so what if they do? The Doctor’s frustrated with some of the people he meets. Gone is the “I’m naked” Matt Smith Doctor -spinning around and whooshing. Mind you, I liked that a lot.
26 June 2015 at 18:03 #40849@purofilion — Oh, they meant that Moffat “looks tired”, along the lines of the Moffat-haters who keep telling each other that he’s been writing the show too long and has gone “stale”, isn’t as good as RTD was (or was better, but is a better writer than he is a show-runner), or is irredeemably sexist, so he needs to move on. Most that I’ve seen online say they love Capaldi but want another writer for him, even most of the ones who started out with “I just can’t warm to him” etc. This mob, at the panel, had already spent their anger when I got there, and were just sharing a pathetic sort of discouragement. I think I cheered them up a bit, and encouraged them to at least give S9 (*and* S8, for those who’d given up) a chance before hanging themselves.
Smith was what they were missing, I think — not his stories, of course (since Moffat wrote most of them), but his giddy goofiness. I didn’t take that on, since I didn’t care for the flirty stuff and, frankly, *did* find the plot-pawn utilization of Clara (or so it seemed to me) sexist at worst, clumsily and blurrily confusing at best, so I was then pretty much where they are now.
We’ve got some general fighting going on around the Hugo Awards right now — a couple of heavy-handed, reactionary Christian writers (of no great talent besides) have tried to sabotage the Awards system this year for ignoring their crappy fiction all these years, and have lately mounted a campaign to get a good, experienced editor at Tor Books fired for dissing them. Uproar; not my kind of thing any more. There have been actual fights in the past — Harlan Ellison once walked into a hotel lobby and socked Charles Platt in the puss. It was decades ago, and I doubt that anybody (except Harlan and Platt) even remember what it was about. Mostly, people just have a great time. The tone is usually upbeat, since we all are there to cheer each other up in bad economic times (especially for writers) and enjoy our overlapping fandoms.
27 June 2015 at 00:05 #40850exciting life you lead. However, I shall shout my ignorance and have in fact asked a few nurses (no, I haven’t been sectioned) who Charles Platt and Ellison are! No-one knows.
I believe this long conversation should be in The Cloven Hoof (from memory it serves me that The Sofa is for welcoming newbies and less intense chats. Is this intense? 🙂 )
I love Capaldi without a doubt. But there’s a soft spot forevermore for Smithy.
27 June 2015 at 01:21 #40852@purofilion — okay, over to the Hoof.
30 June 2015 at 15:25 #40880Nice puff piece for new biog of Verity Lambert. Just makes me like her all the more. Obviously, Who is what she’ll probably be remembered for but I’m in two minds whether it is actually the greatest achievement in what is surely one of the most stellar careers in British TV.
30 June 2015 at 18:40 #40881On the one hand, I don’t think Who was her greatest achievement. Though, to be honest, it would be hard to point to Verity Lambert’s ‘greatest’ achievement, because she achieved so much.
But on the other hand – would she have really, really had the chance to achieve so much if people hadn’t known her as – not just the producer of Doctor Who – but the young, female producer who brought in the Daleks against Donald Wilson’s advice?
30 June 2015 at 19:28 #40882@bluesqueakpip — certainly I think Who and the popularity of the Daleks helped cement her reputation as a force to be reckoned with pretty early on. And it’s also definitely hard to pinpoint one highpoint in her career. But I do think Widows was a far more influential series than it’s often given credit for and my personal favourites are the Budgie/Minder aspect of her work. (Although the ITV4 reruns are showing Minder to be slightly creaky around the edges and not holding up that well. I wonder if Budgie would be a similar disappointment in this day and age.)
30 June 2015 at 19:58 #40883@bluesqueakpip @JimTheFiah I wiki’d Verity Lambert cause I knew of her primarily thru
DW and was so very pleasantly surprised! She really had a very interesting career. Some of the
facts are that she influenced productions of many favorite series such as Rumpole of the Bailey
and Johnathan Creek. I’ve also seen The Naked Civil Servant and know of but haven’t seen
The Sweeney. But most of all I was most surprised at her involvement in the classic Quatermass
series which imho is a little gem of sci-fi. She had a big influence on bringing great and
innovative television to all of us! So I’m glad to see there is continued recognition of
her work and talent. She leaves a great legacy.S
30 June 2015 at 20:05 #40884I’d agree with you about Widows, but I’d put in a good word for the earlier Rock Follies, as well.
30 June 2015 at 20:11 #40885Hi there, I know this has nothing at all to do with the blog, but I just wondered if you knew where I could download peter capaldi first series from, as I missed the series and am desperate to catch up.
30 June 2015 at 20:23 #40888@theviking Here <http://www.dailymotion.com/us>; this seems to be working.
30 June 2015 at 21:15 #40889@bluesqueakpip Re Rock Follies, seconded! I remember watching Widows and enjoying it, but it is Rock Follies which resonates in my memory, no doubt in part because of the innovative format, but also because of Julie Covington’s performance.
@lisa Verity Lambert was involved in the last Quatermass serial in 1979 but, for me, that did not have anything like the impact of the 1950’s originals. I did not see the first two, although I was kept fully informed by school friends and later read the scripts when they were published, but by the time ‘Quatermass and the Pit’ aired my family had acquired a television, and it made a huge impact. A few years ago, when the remastered DVD appeared, I found that I was still able to quote whole chunks of dialogue as I watched, even though my memory for that sort of thing is normally rubbish and I was accordingly confined to bit parts (usually comic) in school drama productions.
30 June 2015 at 21:34 #40890@ichabod I have a ‘sometimes’ bonkers theory that Tom Baker Doctor has already
pre-filmed a solution to Galifrey? It might be that we could possibly return to the
under gallery where he has been keeping watch over Galifrey in the “Galifrey falls no
More” special Time lord matrix-y stasis cube-ish/painting for safe keeping. So maybe the
timelords have been coming and going (Missy) back and forth from there. Also, Davros and
the matrix all have to fit into my theory because I think that probably has to be for
some reason. (Davros aka Dr. Skarosa) But right now I think this all could tie together.
I am still working it all out but if anyone wants to join in with this please do or even push
back. It makes sense to me. I’ve come to the conclusion that Missy gave co-ordinates
that will hookup together with both the painting/stasis cube that the 13 Doctors created
‘Its where it always has been’ and at the same time a deflection of explaining where it
actually is which maybe within Tom Docs undergallery?30 June 2015 at 21:57 #40892@mudlark I love the ‘Quartermass and the Pit’ flick which is a totally amazing classic!
I also know the BBC series with John Mills which I loved and the remake with David
Tennant which I liked a lot but that previous John Mills version had already made an
impact on me so its hard to rate a comparison between both but I’m going with the Mills version.
Btw folks- all these are loaded up on Yt30 June 2015 at 22:55 #40893@lisa I was referring to the original BBC television dramas – The Quatermass Experiment (1953), Quatermass II (1955) and Quatermass and the Pit, starring Andre Morell as Quatermass (1958/1959), each broadcast weekly in 6 half hour episodes – rather than the films which followed them (and which I have never seen). Quatermass and the Pit was ‘must see’ television in a way that it is almost unimaginable today. The fourth series, starring John Mills, came two decades later, and the fact that it had less impact is not necessarily a judgement on its quality; by that date it simply appeared less innovative, and reflects the way that television had developed in the interim, and audience expectations had adjusted accordingly.
The original TV series are available on DVD, although The Quatermass Experiment is represented only by the surviving first two episodes, with the scripts and stills for the remaining four.
1 July 2015 at 00:44 #40895@mudlark I totally understand how that was a big influence on you and its a pity that
there are only some of the episodes around now. For me it was the 1967 Pit movie when
I was little. I’d never seen anything like that ‘cricket’ invasion before. Sort of like
insect ‘daleks’? A truly mind expanding moment I guess at the time. I think there was also
the series called “The Tripods’ about insect machines invading Earth at around that time?
It seems to have possibly been a popular trope in UK sci-fi? It was only a few years back
that I came across the John Mills Quartermass series on YT. Possibly not as sophisticated
but held my interest. Love classic British sci-fi and all the contemporary British Sci-fi too!1 July 2015 at 03:59 #40896I’ve been looking online to customize my laptop with some Doctor Who stickers.
I found a few online and thought you guys might also know of some good places.
I prefer Amazon, but let me know what you find!
1 July 2015 at 07:51 #40898Hello, this is my first post. It feels an awful lot like my first day at school! I couldn’t find my tv remote 4weeks ago and Dr Who (The Eleventh Hour) was on, so I just watched it. Initially I was enjoying the eye candy of Matt Smith before beginning to enjoy the story and ended up in tears at the end of the episode. And so I was hooked! I’ve been managing a season ever 2 days and am LOVING Tennant.
This show has totally captivated me and sadly I don’t know anyone else who watches it so it’s a lonely addiction at the moment.
1 July 2015 at 18:10 #40907hi Ichabod, thankyou for that info, most of series 8 seems to work ok, but episode 1 doesn’t appear to.
1 July 2015 at 21:17 #40910Hmm…what’s been happening around here? Some recognizable faces and some new ones.
Must investigate. Back soon.
1 July 2015 at 22:30 #40914@lisa I have a feeling that the wording of my last post may have misled you. It is only the first, 1953 Quatermass serial for which episodes are missing. Quatermass II and Q and the Pit survive in their entirety and are available in digitally remastered form. The visual quality of QII is not all that great, and I suspect that it is mainly of historical and nostalgic interest. Quatermass and the Pit was a more ambitious production and still stands up surprisingly well IMO, with some quite impressive effects, given the limited technical resources available and a budget of about tuppence ha’penny. Not having seen the film, I do not know how the two compare.
2 July 2015 at 04:07 #40916Halloo and welcome! I am in the same boat. Though my son loved it -he claims not have warmed to Capaldi because he enjoyed Smith’s particular style and optimism but I think he’ll change. He’s quite fickle in that way.
So, basically, I’m a lonely watcher too. But 18 months ago I discovered this Forum & haven’t looked back. The discussions here abound with theories about where the arcs are going, what doctor is favoured, whether Missy will stick around, if River Song will ever return and how long Clara will stay.
We have a Spoiler’s thread which is for news about Who that may have entered the papers/telly but which isn’t mentioned on this site anywhere so people can enjoy the surprise of a new or returning character without being ‘spoiled’.
2 months to go and it all revs back up! I’m pretty excited.
Welcome back after a long break. Hope you’re well.
Kindest, puro.
PS; a lot has happened. Namely @jimthefish & @pedant introduced me and a few interested others to Whedon World with Buffy, Angel and Firefly and accompanying blogs. Great stuff.
4 July 2015 at 00:06 #40934Hi new to the forum. Been wanting to talk to someone else who is a fan of the show about a multitude of things, but the one most recently that has been bouncing around is that the story / movie Enders Game could massively be used as an analogue for a young doctor. Might even present a little of the whole “doctor, who?” The method comes down to this:
“In the moment when I truly understand my enemy, understand him well enough to defeat him, then in that very moment I also love him. I think it’s impossible to really understand somebody, what they want, what they believe, and not love them the way they love themselves. And then, in that very moment when I love them -”
“You beat them.” For a moment she was not afraid of his understanding.
“No, you don’t understand. I destroy them. I make it impossible for them to ever hurt me again. I grind them and grind them until they don’t exist.” – Ender & Valentine, Ch. 13: Valentineplus by the end of the story what does he do? He steals a ship and runs away from his own people to try and save the very species that he nearly destroyed. Just seems like a basis of what shaped him. I would love to hear anyone who can see problems in this idea. Dont get me wrong either, i don’t think this movie is cannon, or in any way stolen from doctor who, just seems like if you wanted to show someone who wanted to know what the doctors formative years might have looked like, this could be an analogue.
4 July 2015 at 03:10 #40935halloo and welcome. I hope you enjoy it here.
I haven’t read the book (Ender’s Game) but I did see the movie: I’m actually not a real fan of sci-fi although I love Who and Firefly and the occasional Star Trek.
Interesting hypothesis you put forward and I’m sure there’ll be interest.
“I don’t think this movie is cannon, or in any way stolen from doctor who, just seems like if you wanted to show someone who wanted to know what the doctors formative years might have looked like, this could be an analogue”
Do you mean “canon” and if so, do you mean with Doctor Who or Ender’s Game? In Who, canon is the established and received knowledge of the programme and its contents. Some consider the books and audio works to be “features” or ‘extended ideas’ rather than canonical works.
As for “analogue” I think you mean an analogy and if so, that’s interesting. I must take another look at the film to see the connections. Certainly that’s a thoughtful quote. Does the phrase originate with young Ender? I wonder if the Doctor would “grind down an enemy until they don’t exist.” -if those are his words.
I know the Doctor will do almost anything to help a group of aliens find a home -another safe, uninhabited planet, providing those very ‘aliens’ give their word to stop destroying earth and its peoples. I recall this happened in Vampires in Venice when Rory joined Amy on the Tardis and in the 2-parter with Tennant’s Doctor and Martha, when, after he’d used the Chameleon Arch, he offered the enemy (who took human form) the possibility of another planet -somewhere safe – (Human Nature).
Mind you, this group had been chasing the Doctor and Martha and having tracked their scent would latch on to them for eternity, sneaking in behind the Tardis. I think that’s why he employed the Chameleon Arch -that, and people wanted to see the Doctor subdued, or perhaps overtaken, by human nature and snogging – -but not with Martha 🙁
Good to chat!
Kindest, puro.
4 July 2015 at 11:06 #40936hey – welcome @crieshavoc !
Wonderful! I know you didn’t label it a bonkers theory but its close enough to satisfy the distinct lack of bonkers theories we have between seasons!
I kinda like it as a kinda inspiration for fan-fic.
Young Gallifreyans’ (the posh sort) education includes soldiering and the technique to develop empathy with the enemy.
In war gaming, The Doctor may have played with his great mate The Master, both developing a deep empathy for each other. Of course, that would all get a little messy when The Doctor won’t actually go ‘all the way’ with the Master’s plans for domination [I’ll leave the shipping to mariners].Running away due to something connected to that relationship is kinda easy to imagine too.
Nice bonkering – thanks and welcome again!
4 July 2015 at 15:12 #40940@crieshavok (@purofilion @whisht)
It’s always interesting to hear “headcanon” ideas for the Doctors formative years, and if the Enders Game analogy works for you, go with it.
My own has evolved over the years somewhat, and I actually could see an analogue in a fairly recent book (no laughing at the back) in Harry Potter and the Deathly
AssassinHallows.We know that the Master and the Doctor were friends at the Academy. We also know that, at the start of Doctor Who, he isn’t the hero of his own story. Ian and Barbara are really. His transformation into hero is gradual over the first couple of series, with Dalek invasion of Earth being the first time he meets a foe he recognises, steps up to the plate, stares down a Dalek and says “I’m here to beat you” (to paraphrase).
We know he “got into a bit of bother” before legging it with Susan from Gallifrey (Deadly Assassin) and that the Time Lords have a telepathic region of the mind which can network with other Time Lords. Except that the Doctor had that bit somehow “deactivated” when “they kicked me out” (Invisible Enemy).
In the Harry Potter books, one of kindly old Professor Dumbledores achievements is listed as the defeat by dual of the Dark Wizard Gellert Grindelwald. In the final book it’s revealed that they were adolescent friends and shared a desire to use magic to make the world better (It’s also heavily implied that Dumbledore was attracted to Gellert). Suppressing non-magical “Muggles” for “The Greater Good” for Dumbledore, darker reasons for Grindelwald. In the end, their is a horrible event that leaves a stain on Dumbledore which makes him repent.
I kind of see that as a good analogy for the Master and Doctor. Both having a desire to use the powers of Time Lords in a forbidden interventionist way, but the Doctor telling himself it was for the greater good. This led to an unspoken event which saw him marginalised before escape from Gallifrey, and a 50 year history of trying to be the good man. “I’m not a good man. A good man wouldn’t need so many rules.”
And this is where I think both RTD and SM got it right. Both have implied that it’s the Doctor, not the Master who has significantly changed in their life cycles. Missy talks of “wanting her friend back”. Back, being allied to her viewpoint. That using Time Lord knowledge to suppress other species is the best way to bring order to the Universe.
4 July 2015 at 17:47 #40946Good Morning Whosters !! This weekend the Disney XD channel has the first season of Tenant Doc.
in a marathon all day and repeating tomorrow again. I guess its part of the July 4th marathon
programing that all the channels do on holidays in the states. So if you want to catch the early
10th on TV and record it and have that channel well there ya go.@phaseshift and crieshavoc etc.! (you guys know who you are) so I saw that info. regarding
River and the 8th Doc and what popped into my mind was the notion that River had ‘her’ Doctor and
I’m super curious if the 8th was that Doctor for her? If you recall -(I wish I could recall the
particular spot) but I do recall for sure where she refers to ‘her’ Doctor and I can just imagine
that its the 8th mostly cause of his romantic scenes in the movie but I would be very interested
to see in the audio stories where that might end up.5 July 2015 at 01:23 #40950I never thought of River using her vortex manipulator to ‘visit’ her other doctors. I supposed it was always Smithy. When she met Tennant on ‘that’ night in the Library she expressed amazement at his youthful eyes and the Doctor’s response to her “you’re really young; so young,” was, “no, I’m really not, not at all.”
She would never see him before or since, but it makes a great deal of sense that other, ‘earlier’ doctors are familiar to River. That’s a terrific idea!
@phaseshift @crieshavok I’ll also echo @whisht ‘s thanks for the bonkerising theories we’ve probably not had as much of during the ‘gap’ (I’ve now added “bonkerising” to my Microsoft dictionary so I avoid the red squiggles -this concept has to be TM’s @phaseshift!).
Phase, Havok, I can see what you mean about the Doctor as the one who has changed: the nature of the ‘kindly’ man, the ‘help,’ the gentle one who assists ladies and put infants to sleep is one incarnation of his tremendously complicated personality -one with superb abilities to gently touch a child’s forehead (Listen) at the beginning of the story …”The end… aaand good night” as well as sending new enemies to another dimension as in that wonderful moment (Flatline) where he formally names them The Boneless, and having been thrown his sonic by Clara, abruptly sends them away.
I think that teaching his companions wasn’t done ‘previously’ -he was The Man, the Leader. He was quite pig-headed and bovine. He lost patience in favour of heavy sarcasm -see the foppish Pertwee. Ironically, he’s the Doctor I favoured as a seven year old when Mum died and continuing this at 4 pm everyday was a comforting routine: for me it was like having two dads and yet both were brusque, telling me in their own way to, “get up, get going and use your brain.” This Doctor wasn’t ‘the teacher’ but he recused companions and those villagers and people in UNIT whenever necessary although was occasionally handicapped by scientific experiments and fixing the work of ‘lesser’ men.
Yet, I don’t think we hear too much about the Doctor’s family (and his gentler side) until Doctor Tennant which is noted in Fear Her. I always wonder to what extent the memory of his family has contained his darker side..
I think the Doctor is painted as a hero but his heroism is definitely different from what we might assume. The two friends, Master and Doctor were close, indeed and yet the title the Doctor chose was something I assume he did at an early age. I assume also there’s a ceremony of a type with aristocratic boys in the Time Lord ‘camp’ and whilst there’s a sense the Master, with his “lands” comes from wealth, I don’t think that’s necessarily true of the Doctor. I wonder if these titles come from a youthful vision or are aspirational.
@cathannabel you would communicate this far better than I, for in both Time Lords I see a rebellious nature but with choice dictating their actions. The Master makes the time of youthfulness a permanent quest causing deliberate havoc for amusement as much as anything else. The Doctor’s occasional discretion veils his motives and there are segments of confusion, after the Time War, where disclosure of the Doctor’s past is prudently skimmed and superficial so it’s difficult to profess a knowledge of the Doctor’s character. We know he never gives up, never acts as coward and says there is something you should never do if “you value your continued existence,” you’ll never put him “in a trap.”
As @jimthefish pointed out in Whedon’s Serenity commentary, Mal doesn’t move from “hero to hero” -it’s complicated, darker, with a cleverer evolution and I think this is similar to the Doctor’s growth -otherwise it simply lacks momentum. PhaseShift, I like your comparison with Dumbledore and Grindelwald & I’m also in the middle of Ender’s Game (my 1st watch was an awful long time ago) so thank you @crieshavok for a push in that direction.
@phaseshift -eerm, on the other thread, how’s the re-watch of Farscape? I think someone mentioned, an eerm: cough: blog? 🙂 Because that would be great. Arbutus and I are watching it and I’m 3 episodes past ‘A Human Reaction’ which I think was @fatmaninabox ‘s first ‘grab me’ episode. -I found that great…..anyway, to the TV related Thread….
Onwards!
Kindest, puro.
Kindest,
puro.
5 July 2015 at 02:59 #40955@Purofilion I know its hard to work out the River/Doctor timeline. So did she spend time with the
8th before the 10th? Did she go back to the 8th in the way she re-visited the 11th? She said ‘her’
Doctor was the one that cried when he knew she was at the end of her life. But how would the 8th
Doctor have known that would happen? That bit has me stuck. Still he was one of the more
romantic Docs so I can imagine him taking her to that place where they had that special
moment she was recalling in the Library episode. I will need to get those stories !5 July 2015 at 05:26 #40958@lisa I thought there was a minisode on Youtube and the DVD Specials where Smithy takes River to the Singing Towers -now that’s what I think happens and I could be quite wrong.
Known to happen.
5 July 2015 at 13:10 #40959@purofilion and @lisa
There is indeed a minisode (First Night, Last Night), and it’s certainly when the Smith Doctor thinks it’s the last night ever.
However, he doesn’t have the ‘new haircut’. Possibly they couldn’t manage a wig on the minimal budget for a minisode. Or possibly Moffat did it on purpose – to give himself leeway in case he wants River’s real last night to be with a different incarnation.
Sort of a Schroedinger’s Last Night. 😀
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