The End of Time

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This topic contains 15 replies, has 13 voices, and was last updated by  tommo 3 years, 9 months ago.

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  • #29771
    Craig @craig
    Emperor

    And so we reach the end of both Russell’s and David’s tenures. And once again, Russell throws the kitchen sink at it – the Master, Timelords, another chance to see all the companions, and the wonderful Wilf! There’s a lot wrong with this finale, but there’s also a lot that’s really great, so I’m not going to make any complaints. I’ll leave that up to the rest of you. 🙂 They both went out with a big, beautiful bang.

    Facing his mortality, the Doctor returns to Earth find the planet’s population haunted by horrific nightmares. Reuniting with Wilf, he investigates a lingering mystery that threatens to unravel the planet as an old enemy is reborn. Only the Doctor stands between the age of order and the time of chaos… and only one song remains to be sung…

    #29842
    Arbutus @arbutus

    @craig sums this up well:  There’s a lot wrong with this finale, but there’s also a lot that’s really great.  I felt that the beginning and ending were the weakest parts, with a fair bit of pretty good stuff in between. For me, one of the chief problems is that the great bits don’t really hang together, to create a cohesive great whole. Way too much crammed in, too many sharp turns between goofy and intense, and some plot points really don’t make a lot of sense.

    On the plus side, every moment of Wilf is awesome. I liked John Simm’s Master better than in his previous outing, as there was more intensity and less goofiness this time, and the one-on-one scenes with the Doctor were quite good. In general, the intimate moments work really well in here. And it was fun to see Donna again. Notably, this episode gave the me the one moment where I really warmed up to Sylvia Noble:

    Donna: “Are you shouting at thin air?”     Sylvia: “Yes… Possibly… Yes.”

    Okay, the ending. In a nutshell, I wish that the whole “fear of dying” subplot could be expunged right out of DW, the Doctor fixing up Captain Jack just felt strange, and Martha in a shootout with a Sontaran? The only time during that whole epilogue that I truly felt moved was when the Doctor said his final farewell to the Noble family. Did I say that Wilf was awesome? But on the whole, Eleven dropping his bow tie to the ground and going out with a smile felt far sadder for me than what went on here… interesting really, in light of the common view that RTD handled emotions better than SM.

    One final thought occurs. As I have said on here many a time, I’m easily entertained, and not terribly critical most of the time. I really enjoy the AG show. But it is true of modern television in general, that it’s always trying to make me cry! It’s rather nice, sometimes, to just be entertained, and I’m starting to feel really hopeful that there will be more of that in the near future.  🙂

    #29851
    janetteB @janetteb

    We attempted to rewatch these episodes a couple of months ago and did not make it past the first few minutes so I really appreciate your review @arbutus though I am still not inspired to rewatch them, (as I was after reading your remarks about “Waters of Mars”.)

    Wilf and Donna are always worth watching but I am afraid the negatives far outweigh the positives in this story for me which is a shame because I really liked DT as the Doctor but I find his final moments unwatchable. He deserved so much better than this. I love Matt’s final moment. (Have rewatched The Time of the Doctor twice in the past week, once alone and again with family in preparation for Sunday) It has the right degree of pathos for someone who is not dying, just renewing and as he so correctly observes we all change every day. Change is a condition of life. DT’s final moments ramp up the emotion to maudlin and for a man who has already had ten or eleven lives, it is excessive.

    Doctor Who is at its’ best when it delivers as many (or more) laughs as tears. I am with you @arbutus on hoping that there will be no shortage of laughs this season.

    Cheers

    Janette

    #30940
    cybrdragon @cybrdragon

    Wasn’t the acting really good during the rant and during the final moments, though?  The more I watch the ranting at Wilf, the more I feel I understand the Tenth Doctor.  Along with David Tennant’s comments in the Confidential show for these episodes, I am able to see that it was fitting for this particular Doctor who was the most human, with such human emotions and such a love of living.  To him it was like a death, as he explained to Wilf in the cafe earlier.  As hard as it is emotionally for me, it was harder for the character of the Doctor (and also for DT), and I don’t mind a little self-indulgence on his part as he expresses who he really is with all his doubts and fears, knowing in the back of my mind that he will always give himself for someone else in the end.

    Sorry, I am only on the second Matt Smith season right now, and still not over the loss of the Tenth Doctor.  I came late to the show and am greatly affected by it so far.

    #34792
    CourtK0027 @courtk0027

    I guess I’m one of the few that really liked this episode 🙁

    But I do have two questions… The answers may be obvious and I’m just oblivious, but:

    1) What happened to the Master?? My bf says that it’s obvious that he went back with the other Time Lords BUT with the most recent episode coming out, that would lead us to believe otherwise… So where did he go??

    2) Since the drumming in his head was essentially caused by the events that happened in order to link the Time Lords with Earth, does he/she still hear the drums?

    #34793
    BadWulf @badwulf

    @courtk0027 What happened to the Master?

    I don’t know how familiar with BG episodes you are, but the Master has a history of apparently dying, and then reappearing in a later story with no explanation of how he escaped. The guy was vaped by the Daleks at one point, and still managed to survive!

    Since the drumming in his head was essentially caused by the events that happened in order to link the Time Lords with Earth, does he/she still hear the drums?

    Unknown – but since the sound of drums was only introduced by RTD in the episode of the same name, it has not been an integral part of the character for long, and again, might be ignored from now on.

    Other aspects of the Master that have been dropped (that can seem as almost defining to his character) are:

    • The Tissue Compression Eliminator, which kills people by squeezing their bodies until they are the size of an action figure
    • The awesome goatee beard
    #34796
    DrBen @drben

    Not to mention that weird thing in the TV Movie where he’s basically a snake who can possess people.

    #34848
    CourtK0027 @courtk0027

    I’ve been watching classic Doctor Who on amazon prime, netflix, and I’ve downloaded the episodes/seasons missing.  Speaking of, why is that??  Like on netflix, entire seasons are missing!  I’ve been watching all that I can, but I feel a bit like a virtual River Song watching the Doctor out of order :/ which is more than just a little confusing, to say the least.  I want to watch them in order (without spending $200+ on the DVD complete series… Which I might just have to give in and do lol). Was there ever a complete collection on VHS?  I bet it would be a fraction of the price and after all, I just want to watch them!  And in chronological order lol

    thanks for all the info guys 🙂 greatly appreciated!

    Any further enlightening would be wonderful as well 🙂 I am American and 27; so needless to say, I was not raised in a time or place where Doctor Who was an icon or cultural past time… Unfortunately lol

    #35737
    nerys @nerys

    I actually did love this episode, a very poignant sendoff to Tennant’s Doctor. I just came across this interview with Timothy Dalton (and I hope I am posting it in the correct thread; if not, then mod please feel free to move it). In it he discusses his role on Doctor Who, among many, many things.

    #40763
    Major33 @major33

    A question for any and everyone, which will seem odd on the surface.

    Why did David’s doctor regenerate into the 11th? I know it is to lead to the next obviously, but the way it happened.

    I ask given he died from the radiation from the booth when he stepped in to replace Doona’s grandfather, yet he previously showed this ability to absorb radiation and channel it into his shoe from the episode on the moon with Martha when he absorbed the radiation from the MRI machine.

    #40938
    PhaseShift @phaseshift
    Time Lord

    @major33

    Ah, the old “absorb the radiation into the shoe” conundrum.

    It’s not a trick or power that any other Doctor has demonstrated, although a couple of them have claimed a higher tolerance to radiation than mere mortals. It’s also worth pointing out that the Third Doctor suffered radiation poisoning which led him to regenerate.

    Ten specifically mentions Roentgen radiation in Smith and Jones (that’s what we technically call the “arse end” of the electromagnetic spectrum – x-rays, gamma waves and cosmic rays). That doesn’t include things like Beta particles which are high energy electrons with are both penetrative (unlike alpha, which your skin absorbs) and more likely to damage tissue. There are also a number of fictional radiations in the Whoniverse.

    So you could say it was the wrong sort of radiation. Or perhaps the dose was more than a shoe could take?

    Or you could say that the Doctor, being an inveterate bullshiter on occasion, was out to impress a potential new candidate for the open position of companion? He was in no danger from that particular dose in Smith and Jones, knew it, and decided to go for “Odd”.

    #40947
    Major33 @major33

    @phaseshift

    thanks for the insight.

    im not really familiar with the details of various radiations beyond the names of a few. I thought both would be deadly to humans, so as you pointed out, if the first was him showing off a bit, if only he had of worn larger shoes then he would of been saved etc. even though I loved how he got his reward by going to the various times to save the others and give the gift to Doona, but given he had so much time to allow him do that added to my thoughts that he could of saved himself.

     

    #40949
    Bluesqueakpip @bluesqueakpip

    @phaseshift – I go for ‘inveterate bullshitter’. 😉 Or as the Tennant Doctor himself admitted:

    No idea, I just made it up. Didn’t want to say “Magic Door”

    #40951
    PhaseShift @phaseshift
    Time Lord

    @bluesqueakpip

    I go for ‘inveterate bullshitter’

    It’s brilliant that we watch a show that we can use that term endearingly for our hero, isn’t it? I agree, 10 in full bullshit mode.

    @major33

    I actually know a kid who followed up the Roentgen link on his computer and learned about safe doses for X-Rays and much more.

    Doctor Who can still spark a line of enquiry for the interested. Dose in radiation is key. Someone who lives in Aberdeen will soak up a natural dose from the granite beneath their feet to set alarms off in a nuclear power plant.

    You, youself, are a gamma emitor. The potassium that lines your nervous system contains potassium 40. Approx 4000 disintigrations of this occur per day. The disintigration of potassium 40 releases a beta plus particle. A positron, Yer actual antimatter. It annihalates in the body to produce gamma rays you shoot at other people.

    The universe is truly bizarre and strange. The Doctor could never stop running could he?

    #40954
    ichabod @ichabod

    @phaseshift  What??!!!  Shooting gamma rays — !  Bizarre and strange barely begin to describe it . . . is there a type of bedrock that doesn’t irradiate us?  I have read that building bricks are supposed to be significant emitors, but I’ve gotten the sense that pretty much everything is, one way or another, which means that beings living closer to the more concentrated groups of stars and planets can be expected to be “armored” in form, more or less like Earth’s beetles, to withstand the constant heavy bombardment of radiation.  Out here in the galactic boonies, not so much . . .?

    #49178
    tommo @tommo

    @cybrdragon – i’m totally with you there mate.

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