[herisson @replies]

@macphisto96: about Danny’s life being messed with – not sure i agree. Most of the interaction is positive, especially helping Rupert/Danny to learn how to handle fear (rational or otherwise). He already had the toy soldier, after all.

The Doctor is sometimes shown as if he was a god, but i can’t imagine that even his powers of post-hypnotic suggestion are *that* strong.

 

[herisson @replies]

@bluesqueakpip: yes, that slip of paper was… interesting.

Personally, i liked Danny, and I somehow can’t imagine that Moffatt is going to have two consecutive companions leave on such a sad note, if only because the Doctor will likely be even more devastated than he was in the Christmas special where Clara was introduced. Or… maybe not (given that he’s newly regenerated), but that plus Osgood feels like it’s either piling on fans or else there’s some misdirection and sly editing involved.

Then again, I have a far easier time believing in that than i do in moon = space dragon egg, so who knows?

 

[herisson @replies]

I really liked the episode, though honestly, the ending (Clara/Danny plus boy) surely was either a dream she had, or else taking place in an alternate reality, because

– if the Nethershphere is a Gallifreyan HD, where is Danny now and how could he possibly be able to return?

– Who would send a child who has been dead for some years back to this world, not even knowing if that child’s parents are alive? Or how they, if around, are possibly going to be able to handle having their child restored to them *and* at the exact same age he was when he died? The French show Les Revenants (The Returned) deals with this exact scenario – and similar ones – and it’s a hell of a horrible shock for all those still alive here, having been grieving and learning to keep on living as they all have been doing. If that wasn’t simply due to SM leaving loose ends and/or not thinking things through, then it’s pretty disturbing, frankly (or fairy tale-like, take your pick).

I don’t expect Doctor Who to be terribly logical, but that ranks up there with the entirety of Kill the Moon as far as implausibility is concerned. This is all the more so given the realism of Jenna Coleman’s acting in both parts of the finale (she is very, very believable to me in this, more than in any of her other performances).

As for call-backs to Listen, my hunch is that the scene where the plane is going down is the same bit of green screen filming used for Capaldi in the capsule, just shown from different angles. My one and only post here previously was in. re. that ep., thinking that the “thing” the Doctor saw at that moment was Missy. Well, maybe not, but it’s kind of nice to see a visual reminder of the Doctor in that scene – almost like a reflection in a reflection.

@coly, i doubt SM will ever spell things out re. Listen. But the notion of spying and surveillance has been laid throughout this season’s episodes, though it doesn’t start becoming clear until the final scene of In the Forest of the Night.

Loved Michelle Gomez!

[herisson @replies]

@purofilion – Thanks for the welcome!

I’ve been lurking on this forum, off and on, since early last season, but decided to jump into the discussion due to “Listen.” Check my “How Tom Baker made me love the Doctor” intro. post above. 🙂

 

[herisson @replies]

Hi all – longtime lurker here, but yesterday’s episode drew me out of the woodwork.

I started watching the show in 1983, when I was in graduate school and really needed a break from studying and all-round stress. PBS (for you non-USians, that’s Public Broadcasting Service) had licensed a goodly chunk of Too Baker’s run, starting shortly before The Horror of Fang Rock and ending right after Logopolis. So Tom Baker is definitely “my” doctor, though Matt is right up there with him and Capaldi is gaining fast.

I love the old series, with its serial episodes (even all the running down corridors!) and bargains basement special effects and sets. My favorite of the latter is the but where the Doctor and Romans are on Gallifrey, and some of the doorways and stairwells look like the back mof a warehouse that’s been festooned with tinsel and crepe paper. It’s a bit tacky, but somehow that adds to the overall likeableness of the show and characters.

Baker’s hat, scarf, greatcoat, pocket full of jelly babies – and facial expressions – will always be among my favorites aspects of not only his Doctor, but *the* Doctor. Add his comic timing and deadpan delivery, and you’ve got a combination that makes for great watching!

I have reservations about a lot of both RTD’s and Moffatt’s ideas and scripts, but the show was uneven BG, so I’m not complaining – just very glad to have it back, less farting aliens and superhero movie effects-style Master. (I think I’m still very partial to the BG version of him, to be honest.)

This forum seems like a wonderful place to kick back and toss ideas around, and I look forward to it.

[herisson @replies]

@arbutus again: I’ve got the impression that the Nethersphere might be some kind of distorted, fun house mirror version of waking life – more specifically, the Doctor’s wakingn life (and possibly his dreams as well). Which fits with his mentions of doubles, shadows and ghosts.

[herisson @replies]

@arbutus: I also believe he’s an orphan.

As for the monster in Rupert’s room, my guess is that in each mperson’s mind, it is the thing the fear most – either in dreams or in waking life. That makes Clara’s being a literal “monster under the bed” more ironic and poignant.

As to the monitor going off in the aTardis when the Doctor opens the door of Orson’s ship, either he really does see something/someone, or it’s a massive red herring. Personally, I think he does see either Missy or something/someone else, but we might never know.

I’m still struck by the Doctor’s lines about shadows and doubles – doppelgangers, maybe? That’s a very old “scare” trope in folk tales and books like The Tales of Hoffman, and I think Moffat drew on those concepts for the fright factor, but possibly for other reasons as well. This Doctor seems very haunted – almost like he’s got mild PTSD from the Time War.

[herisson @replies]

I’m new here (more to follow in the proper forum).

My head’s spinning, my brain’s scrambled, and…

I think the Doctor saw Missy on the spacecraft at the end of the world. She’s acted like a stalker, she wears black, her original name (in scripts and credits) was Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere… Which would, imo, function much like the shadows and doubles the Doctor was talking about early in the episode.

I think he’s being stalked by someone he already knows. As for the rest, it seems like a depiction of peoples’ dreams, Clara excepted.

Moffatt knocked this one out of the park!

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