The Fox Inn

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    JimTheFish @jimthefish
    Time Lord

    @puroandson– @winston pretty much has it right.

    The referendum on June 23 will determine whether the British people want to remain in the EU under the frankly cosmetic changes of the ‘deal’ Cameron has just ‘negotiated'(Bremain). Or leave the EU and either negotiate ad hoc trade and movement agreements or have associated relationship with the EU a la Norway (Brexit).

    At the moment, the Brexit campaign seems to have become a home for a collection of the most risible political entities in the UK — like a really, really crap selection of super villains. The general attitude seems to be a deep suspicion of anyone who wouldn’t comfortably gain membership to a home counties Rotary Club and a nostalgic yearning for some kind of 1950s fantasyland where there is still some benign form of empire and women and fuzzy wuzzies know their place.

    As for Yaffle(y). Yes, it probably wouldn’t mean much to anyone not brought up in the UK in the 70s and 80s. Professor Yaffle was a pompous, humourless know-it-all in the children’s TV show Bagpuss. He might remind you of someone.

    Mudlark @mudlark

    @puroandson  @jimthefish

    Related fact of very little importance.  Yaffle is an old name for the  Green Woodpecker, the bird on which Professor Yaffle was based.  The favourite food of the bird is ants, and the name comes from it’s ‘laughing’ call.



    Anonymous @

    @mudlark @jimthefish @winston

    Thank you so much for that definition and the details of the situation also. I’ve also explained this to Son who, whilst smarter than some kids his age regarding Oz politics, knows next to nothing about UK politics -doesn’t appear on our TV news (only our car radio -under the banner of something called Radio National and also ABC local radio with ‘guest spots’) – US politics tends to get coverage what with the horrific image of @tardisblue ‘s which was a certain large Trump sitting behind the oval office desk!

    I can’t imagine Trump will get anywhere. But my main thing now is to ‘investigate’ this Brexit situation with its “crap” super villainess elements like Buffy’s The Trio: “you’ve heard of us, of course?”

    Thank you




    (I’d actually like to know who coined it as they deserve a hearty kick to the knackers for it).

    Don’t know the who, but I’m pretty sure the why is because neo-whig would sound silly…

    (Whig Liberalism was once entirely about unrestrained free trade, in contrast to the patrician and protectionist Tories – a bit like how the Republicans used to be the radical party and the Dems the conservatives. Lincoln was a Republican.)

    Bluesqueakpip @bluesqueakpip


    I’m beginning to wonder if the Brexit campaign doesn’t really need leaders – if it’s tapping into the same kind of anti-multinational, anti-globalisation groundswell that Occupy tapped into on the left. The Indy’s latest poll has 52% ‘Leave’, rising to 54% when you add in how likely the respondents are to vote.

    Neck and neck, then.

    I’m not sure Project Fear 2.0 is the right way to get a Remain vote, either; Project Fear 1.0 didn’t have to spell out the advantages of ‘No’, because people already knew them (even if they didn’t believe them). But Project Fear 2.0 has an audience that’s already very largely Eurosceptic. It’s tricky convincing people that the world’s going to end if they Brexit when they’re already half-convinced the EU’s going to implode even if they do stay.


    On an entirely different topic, this happened yesterday: Bottoms up, sigmoid! Hopefully informative and amusing. Feel free to pass around.

    JimTheFish @jimthefish
    Time Lord

    @bluesqueakpip — yes, neck and neck in the sense that the outcome is becoming increasingly unpredictable. Nice to see the Tories (rather predictably) turning on themselves in the most feral way possible. I’m currently listening to lots of old 90s bands too, so it has a nice symmetry to it.

    @pedant — I believe Tory originally comes from the Irish toirdhe, meaning ‘outlaw’ or ‘pursuer’. First used to mean robber or highwayman (appropriately enough) but by extension came to mean supporters of Charles II. So, yeah, the outsiders do become the establishment in the end.



    Heh. Four legs bad, two legs good.

    Bluesqueakpip @bluesqueakpip


    Nice to see the Tories (rather predictably) turning on themselves in the most feral way possible.

    Oh, putting a genuine possibility of getting out of the EU to the Tory Party is like throwing a big bag of catnip into a group of cats.

    It won’t be pretty. 😉

    nerys @nerys

    A meme making the rounds today:


    Just to make us all feel young and fresh: 19 years yesterday since Buffy first aired.

    Anonymous @


    Had it not been for you and @jimthefish I would have said “Buffy Who?”

    I been edercated since. And propa.

    Scotch and poker anyone? For kittens?

    Definitely no American beer: beer bad, tree pretty, fire also bad.



    Is everyone here stoned?

    (Still the crowner of funniest gag in anything, anywhere, ever)

    JimTheFish @jimthefish
    Time Lord

    @pedant and @puroandson–

    personally I prefer: “Is this thing on?” (tapping invisible mike) after a particular zinger has met with a tumbleweed moment. Still use that to this day.

    Anonymous @

    @pedant @jimthefish

    all true -before the “is everyone here stoned?” I also loved Marsters calm delivery of “no, no (like a school teacher attached to a bunch of silly 10 year olds), Ben changed into Glory and Glory changed into Ben. Ben is Glory and Glory is Ben”.

    “So you’re saying that….”

    leading to “is everyone….?”

    It’s one of the best for me. Strangely, many of the best include Spike moments. There’s an episode where Buffy, in S4 (is it Season 4?) avoiding all the oddities of macabre murders, wants a “normal thanksgiving” and whilst Giles and Willow argue empirically about the state of the nation, Spike explains it all very well.

    Another time, again a fav of mine, is Spike’s speech in the final episode of all, where, on bended knee, he instils his faith into Buffy (where before he was instilling other things!) and gives his declaration of love for, and belief in, her. Very moving moments (and funny ones) often contain Spike which is interesting as at no point is the ‘Spuffy relationship’ (per S6) a healthy one -only in S7 does he atone (to some extent) for his deeds -though the bodies in the ‘basement’ caused by a trigger still allows for the “I’ll come in and have myself a real good day” motif from much earlier.

    I have no time for the Spuffy nonsense but I have a lot of time for Spike as a character -Drusilla not so much. Listening to her accent in re-watch was awful ( enjoyed the love she and Spike evidently shared -as wacky as it was and I liked her human seer-like qualities which were increased when she was vamped) and one of the potential slayerettes in S7 had such a bad English accent that I was happy when the Bringers offed her –is that a bad thing to say?  🙂

    Anonymous @


    outing my miserable ignorance, but what’s a ‘tumbleweed moment”?

    I am doing my best but Google aint working.



    @puroandson @jimthefish

    Molly’s offing was, for many, a highlight of S7. Crimes against accents in a capital offence.

    “You made a bear! Undo it. Undo it”.

    But they pale to insignificance alongside the second use of “Bored now”. And the only use of “She’s a hero you see. She’s not like us”.

    “tumbleweed moment” – when a gag is told and all that you hear is the sound of tumbleweed in the wind.


    @puroandson @jimthefish

    Hang on. Are you saying Ben and Glory are related?

    Anonymous @

    @pedant @jimthefish

    Oh yes! The bear moment. I remember being caught up in the raucous story during the first viewing and on  2nd viewing, aided by wine, laughed my head off.

    Ah, the relationship of Ben and Glory –that old chestnut 🙂 Or, no nuts, really.

    Thx for the tumbleweed explanation. We don’t generally use that term at all -even in the Oz “outback” about which I prefer to stay ignorant  -other than a few failed trips in a caravan which on one occasion saw Dad crashing headlong into a bus of oldsters on a day trip to Port Augusta -some distance from Adelaide – I find that nature hates me and I prefer concrete.

    Oz has a truly commendable amount of aggressive snakes, scorpions and deadly spiders.

    I think I’ve mentioned the story of a large python stalking my brother’s land rover in Western Australia, constantly banging its “head” against the window of the vehicle until the window smashed. He went back and ran it over. Twice. To be sure.

    Other nights he slept on top of the 4WD because when roving his torch about, he saw the entire ground moving (like some outback hellmouth) with thousands of scorpions -all vanished by first sunlight.

    Gotta love it. 🙂

    Anonymous @

    @pedant @jimthefish

    I remember ‘bored now’ and was…amazed. It didn’t hit me the first time  -only a whisper climbing up my spine –  but on 2nd view, the whisper became an alarm.


    I truly loved Willow as a character -her maturity and depth of development is so intriguing. Listening to Passion of the Nerd’s discussion of series 3’s (or is it Two??) episode where MOO makes an appearance I was interested to hear he didn’t particularly enjoy it -at first. On further viewing Mr Nerd changed his mind but felt that Will’s mother as character was never played out properly and was more a hindrance than anything directly progressing the plot.

    JimTheFish @jimthefish
    Time Lord

    @puroandson — yes, I watched that Passion of the Nerd review and I could kind of relate to what he was driving at. I enjoyed Gingerbread far more when I revisited it on the rewatch. It’s a more significant episode than its ‘fillerey’ feeling might suggest.

    I quite liked the way they did Willow’s mum. But at the same time, what more could you do with the character? Her one joke had been played out and we pretty much had learned everything we needed to know about her and how she had affected her daughter’s psychological development. (Unlike Joyce, who has a definite arc of development to work through.)

    And, yes, the ‘bored now’ line is a good one. And it’s an interesting demonstration of the through-line of Willow’s latent capacity for evil right from The Wish through to its ultimate manifestation as Dark Willow.

    lisa @lisa

    Just popping in to mention its both Alex Kingston and John Barrowman’s birthdays  today.

    Also daylight saving time begins in many places which  has a feeling of  peculiar incidence.

    At least for me  many reasons for celebration.   I will raise 1 shot of tequila to the day         🙂


    I also would like a River-Missy mash up!     I would not even mind throwing in a smidge of  Jack.





    Anonymous @

    @lisa is it both their birthdays? Well spotted!

    Ah yes, Daylight saving time. Stoopid me, about 3 years ago in Austria, off on some tour of areas in The Sound Of Music, missed the bloody bus because of the clocks.

    I turned into an angry werewolf early (relevance? I’m on a Being Human re-watch) .

    @jimthefish Yes, I think Gingerbread was great on re-watch but I actually liked it the first time round. Buffy’s “did I get it?” on repeat is as funny as ever as is Will’s and Amy’s witchy behaviour. Not to mention Oz and Xander’s “we were here to rescue you” whilst falling thru ceiling.

    Not a lot one can do with Mrs Willow, as you say, -the adults are generally out of the picture -other than “put the fabric softener in” and “do you want a milkshake” (to Giles), Mrs Harris has little or no involvement and Mr Harris none at all til the ‘wedding’ in S6. How depressing that was though it was worth it to see the awful bridesmaid’s dresses.

    I’ve seen and worn worse. A three layered cream – almost diaphanous – outfit with brown piping and blue plastic flowers being the worst of a short list. 🙂

    @janetteb @fatmaninabox I’m with you on the outrage (maintain the rage Janette: PM Whitlam agrees) regarding social ‘service’  -the amount of ‘services’ in any country is disappearing but  apathy of the populace – thinking that services should be given out thru corporate profit entities whilst anyone with genuine needs ought to look after themselves (because, didn’t you know, Hill Song and other nutteries think prosperity comes with obeying Jeezus  whilst poverty is the fault of the ‘poor’ individual) is on the rise amongst, of all people, conservative late teens and early twentysomethings.

    Thoughtless in deed and knowledge, ignorant of good print media, they spout rubbish on worthless blogs whilst mindless ‘centrelink’ offices and other ‘officials’ take a person (like Mr FatMan) away from a credentialed position to clean offices both preventing the spread of institutional wisdom, the benefits of qualifications and good education AND taking those underpaid jobs from others who are trying to get a legal foot into the country’s squeaky clean (un)employment merry-go-round.

    I’m reminded of the Educ Dept which many years ago would make a veritable shitstorm of mistakes by transferring ‘Mary’ to the other side of town whilst ‘Bob,’ who actually lived on the other side, was transferred into Mary’s school ensuring the families would need to purchase a second car if not actually sell their home -only to be transferred back three years later. Fools.

    Back to Mr FatMan: real arborists and landscape gardeners are disappearing -and they’re sorely needed what with droughts, floods and other signs of climate change. Most idiots who turn up here say to me: “oh yeah I’m a *cough* landscape gardener too and do concreting as well, mate, need any of that done, do ya?”

    I say: “where’s the best place to plant the azalea bush in this garden?”

    “I’ll erm, need to check my phone for zalah bushes -or trees? Are they trees, mate? At all?”

    Me, cold and sharp: “azalea is a shrub, mate, grows ‘across’ rather than up, needs good drainage and full sun and with herbs around it, prevents the growth of mould in the rainy season.”

    “are you a landscaper too then, mate?’

    “Aint neither of us landscapers, mate.

    Mr FatMan needs a sapphire blue gargle blaster. Full colour, lots of straws, lots of little umbrellas and pointy things with pieces of fruit artfully arranged around a very tall, blue glass 🙂

    Hugs to you all and enjoy your Saturday night -the vid @jimthefish posted On Sofa (our 8th couch) is excellent and well worth a watch -such a talented, humble and generous individual (so is PC). Is he still going to stay with Chibnall’s first season: does anyone know any recent information? Because, I wish he’d stay! 🙁


    <trying to wave a wand and causing things to explode a la Neville and t’other bloke>



    janetteB @janetteb

    @puroandson My guess is that Peter will do one season under Chibnall provided Chibnall wants him which, if he is sensible, he will. That is clearly what the BBC want, what Moffat would advise and given that he is a fan of the show and reportedly loving the role what Capaldi will be happy to do. I am sure a lot depends upon how Chibnall and Capaldi relate and possibly Capaldi’s view of the scripts for series 11? I have a feeling we will be kept in suspense until the series has aired next year. In the meantime I am certain there will be ample articles by journos with no more idea than you or I or quite possibly Capaldi himself at this stage, interpreting every comment he makes as proof that he is leaving and clogging up the internet.





    Anonymous @


    yes, quite so, they do love their “rumours and rumours of wars”

    School back in full swing? Despite Easter being this month ? weird in itself!

    janetteB @janetteb

    @puroandson Yes school is indeed in. Nice having only one student this year. Indeed you reminded me he has a Maths test on Tuesday so revision tomorrow. (Maths is not my department. I help with English and History when and if help is required. He was studying the poetry of Wilfred Owen a few weeks ago which was interesting, especially as I am currently researching WWI for my own purposes at the moment.)



    Anonymous @


    Ah that is good! And I too love Owen’s poetry.

    Yes, History and English preferred here also.

    Chemistry in Year 9: whoa. I didn’t work up to ion formulas and valence electrons with positive or negative charges til year 11 -not year 9!

    In fact, @craig or @phaseshift  -any chemists and those with physics/ chem under their belt, I understand the cation is listed first (followed by anions) in an ionic compound formula but how is a balanced formula containing a neutral electrical charge (or zero charge) created?

    That’s my biggest threat right now! 🙂

    Anyone? At all?


    Anonymous @

    @jimthefish @pedant

    I was listening to Passion of the Nerd’s episode in S3 whereby Spike appears -only the once.

    It’s a great episode but when Spike exclaims “love isn’t brains children  -it’s blood working itself to get free…you can never be friends”.

    Mr Nerd claims it’s a nice line but ultimately disagrees. Selfless love is both intellect and blood driven…

    Which I think IS kind of the point in this episode -bringing the passion back via Spike and also with Willow -her intent to bewitch Xander is passion+ but without integrity just as Spike’s need to ‘have’ Drusilla is absent of both integrity and selfless love (what is best for Drusilla: which, let’s face it, turning the coin, means a quick stake).




    I can pretty much guarantee this will make you LOL.

    @puroandson @jimthefish

    I think that line – and the episode – are designed to provoke that sort of question. Spike, shorn of his moral compass – because, vampire – but also, we later learn, of distinct Byronic heart and inclination before that – would see it that way.

    But his being there taints everything around him – and if there is anyone nearby with a bit of darkness lurking below…why, hello there Red!

    ichabod @ichabod

    @pedant  Right, sure made me laugh!  Spike, as I recall him, could be a sort of inverted Doctor — generally bad, but with a romantic heart(s) and flashes of goodness . . . ?  What’s Marsters up to these days, anybody know?  He had presence, that guy — well, they all did, didn’t they?  Loved Willow . . . also the werewolf boy, and Giles the Patient, and Faith . . . Haven’t seen any of that in a long time.

    Right now, enjoying a series called “The Magicians” from a set of books I couldn’t stand; good example of how casting interesting looking young actors with a bit of range can rescue a bad (but best-selling) print series.  On the page, all the lead characters were kind of cold and repulsive, but on the screen it’s brought to life with some very appealing gusto.

    Dunno how it will work, though, when they get to some of the nastier stuff in the books (4 vols I think, though I only got to skimming V.2).  I think the author tried to do a sort of GoT thing with the “Magic School” template that Rowling treated so successfully, and the result was just icky on paper.  On the screen, the nasty edge is diffused by everything else that you can see going on, and it’s a lot more fun.  And (so far) none of those stupid Lord Thingamjig-and-his-brothel-of-mindless-sex-bots scenes in GoT.  I don’t know if “The Magicians” is accessible in the UK — it’s shown on the Sci-Fi channel here (along with “The Expanse” and a few other watchable series).



    Anonymous @

    @ichabod  @pedant

    Spike was bad bad bad.  🙂

    I never subscribed to the idea he had flashes of good in him -he was a rapey dick. Still, he got himself a soul and for that I don’t hold the stake up -I keep it in my handbag.

    Gotta love Spikey.


    Anonymous @


    Gawd the rain. I was interested in the car behind them? A rover or a jag?

    Anyway, mumbling.

    Thank you. I subscribed to the Poke too until it fuckin crashed my ‘puter and this alarm came screaming out: thought there was a bomb in there!



    I think it is one of the big-arsed Mercedes SUVs.

    The Poke had some bunch of malware pricks passing themselves off on Facebook as The Poke for a while. You may have copped one of those links. The site itself is fine and usually pretty funny.


    As puro says, Spike was bad. Even when he got his soul (as thus became amenable to the redemption he achieved) he was still a narcissistic twat. Fabulous character – one the best; appalling creature.

    Marsters has been on quite a few things (including Torchwood and some other nerdy stuff and a stint as recurring baddie in Hawaii 5-0). Been pretty busy if IMDB is a guide. And I presume he still has his band.

    Anonymous @


    I think you’re right about the SUVs -more now in the UK than, say, 10 yrs back.

    Yes I loved the Poke -every Saturday I’d wake up & there’d be some hilarious stuff -there was a Dr Who recipe thing one morning and some truly hilarious my child ate my H/W thing.

    Then there was the stuff related to facebook where a child was billed for not attending a pre-organised $25 or $75 (who knows?) 5 year old birthday party. People were arguing that the parent should be billed as his child had actually RSVPed, not shown up, hence they were ‘owed’ -various arguments showed up on the Poke thereafter. America!

    ichabod @ichabod

    Ah, Spike — some nasty crap would be sure to be flying around whenever he popped up!

    Miapatrick @miapatrick

    @puroandson- good idea. I want the finest Pan Galactic Gargel Blaster known to Betelgeuce sevenkind, I want it here, and I want it now. And the head of the man who invented the telephone.



    Further to your query, Marsters is going to be at Wales ComicCon (as is Amber Benson from Buffy and all sorts from Dr Who – incl Davison, McCoy, Redgrave and Starkey and assorted production types). So still very much in the mix.

    My cousin is unfeasibly excited about this. She’s 43.

    There will, apparently, be a lot of fancy dress. Or ‘cosplay’ as we must now call it. But it’s fancy dress.

    XAD4 @xad4


    Don’t give me ideas!


    Too late.

    ichabod @ichabod

    @pedant  Thanks — Wish I could go!

    Anonymous @

    @arbutus @pedant @whisht @craig @fatmaninabox @mudlark @ichabod and lots and lots of others on this great forum: have a wonderful, peaceful and relaxed Easter. Scoff some chocolate eggs!

    Love to you all, Puro and Son

    ichabod @ichabod

    @puroandson — love right back, our very own Hybrid.  Astrologer pal tells me the moon is “void of course” (??) tomorrow, so a day best used for calm reflexion, daydreaming, friendly conversation and turning loose the tiller to let the tides carry us where they will.

    That’s all bosh though, right?  Search me, but I never mind being advised to be lazy and free for a day, especially after handing off the effing tax into to my accountant a couple of weeks early!

    Best, all —



    Mudlark @mudlark


    Thank you! And warm Easter wishes to you both in return, though I suppose Easter day is almost over where you are.

    There is, indeed, a large chocolate egg for me to nibble on, and a chicken in the fridge waiting to be roasted with tarragon, butter and garlic.  There are also some fairly urgent tasks to attend to in the garden, but showers are forecast and, since the clocks went forward to BST last night, my body clock is discombobulated, so I will probably spend much of the day in self indulgent laziness.

    I now have a date for the hip op – May 4th, assuming all goes to plan, which gives me plenty of time to clean my flat thoroughly and cook enough to fill the freezer in anticipation of six weeks on crutches.  I’m saving my rewatch of series 9 for that period of convalescence.

    All the best,




    Whisht @whisht

    Thanks @puroandson – Happy Easter to you both too!

    And everyone else of course!

    @mudlark – glad to hear you have a date for the op. Good luck with it – my mum had 3 hip ops and each one improved her mobility massively.

    (now now people, no, she didn’t have 3 hips, that’s just being silly…..)


    janetteB @janetteb

    Happy EAster all.

    @purofilion I don’t really like chocolate much but another family member scoffed enough eggs today to make up for my abstinence. R.3 noticed that some of his eggs, which he had left conveniently on the coffee table, were missing. An investigation of the dog yard revealed lots of shiny egg wrapping. Oops. Having calculated that it was probably not a lethal dose she was then caught bolting for the back door with a chocolate bunny in her jaw. The bunny was rescued, (or the dog) with only one canine puncture mark and hopefully the dog will survive her stolen feast.



    Craig @craig

    @puroandson @ichabod @mudlark @janetteb @pedant @whisht @fatmaninabox @arbutus @jimthefish @phaseshift and all of you who I’ve forgotten or don’t have time to include. Happy Easter to you all too. I fully intend to be back to normal service after this little seasonal break, which has allowed me to get my breath back. Tomorrow night I’m going to see whether Batman can beat Superman. And once that’s out the way, it’ll be back to the real world of the Doctor. Love you all. My Easter:

    Craig's Easter

    Arbutus @arbutus

    @craig and everyone!   Happy Easter, lovely people. As always, thanks for making this such a pleasant place to hang out!

    @mudlark   Glad to hear that your date with your new hip is now firmed up! Based on my own family members who have done this, it should change your life for the better!  @whisht, my mother-in-law has had both hips and three shoulders done. We call her the Bionic Woman.   🙂

    Bluesqueakpip @bluesqueakpip

    Happy Easter to all!

    @puroandson No chocolate eggs, though there is some Millionaire’s Shortbread that seems to be free from everything except sugar and chocolate.

    Glad to know you have an op date @mudlark. My grandmother had a hip op, and it improved things so massively she practically had to be tied to the bed for the required rest.

    I went for lemon and garlic for the chicken. 🙂

    Mudlark @mudlark

    @whisht  @arbutus  @bluesqueakpip    Thanks!   Fingers crossed and touching wood, but if the op this time is as successful as when I had the other hip done ten years ago I should, by late summer, be leaping about like a mountain goat  🙂

    winston @winston

    @everyone     Hoppy Easter to all of you!  There was no chocolate here this morning but my granddaughter figures  that my dog scared the Easter Bunny away. Newton!!!!!  It was a beautiful sunny day with a high of 14C and I spent most of it out in the garden. Purple crocus are the first flowers open and they were covered in hungry honey bees. The birds were singing a rock opera and the Canadian geese were gliding back and forth on the creek. I wish you all the calm I felt sitting in the sun in my garden.

    Anonymous @

    Yes, happy Easter all! No chocolate here either, other than the usual amount that I add to my morning coffee. 🙂

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