73 Yards

Stunning. The best RTD story I have seen, and one of the very best Who stories I have seen.

I have been sceptical of RTD’s focus on fantasy…until now.

It was as if he managed to blend Who and M.R. James and…RTD!

Wow. It seems churlish to reference previous ideas from Who and elsewhere… but…

‘Turn Left’ obviously…

66.7 meters echoes the 66 seconds to ‘phase matter’ in ‘Mummy’ (thank you Perkins)

The ‘ghosts’ in ‘Beneath the Lake’

Inside #9 ‘The Twelve Days of Christine’?? Will have watch that again.

Ghost Story for Christmas 1977, was it ? ‘The Signalman.’

and the politics… ouch.

Top tier.

@thane16

Also… the time energy “factory” in ‘Angels Take Manhattan.’

Nothing wrong with these reminders. Interesting we should both think of (different) Toby Whithouse stories though.

Susan Twist would seem to be a thing. Question is what? Mrs Flood is back.

No. No idea what Russ is up to.

Schrödinger’s Cat … the point at which Ruby *doesn’t* read “I miss you” is where the Doctor both exists and doesn’t exist ….in the ‘box?’

Puzzled.

@blenkinsopthebrave

Why does no one go to the police? That was when arrived UNIT wasn’t it? Which went well.

I did like the ‘can I pay with my phone?’ moment, when the audience all thought 73 meant 1973

Anyone checked out the name of the Welsh village for Thomasite Llareggyb meaning? I don’t have head for unlikely combination of consonants. And what was the pub called again? I did expect Nardole to turn up claiming he was a solitary reaper or something.

To tell the truth, this was closer to Midnight than say Blink or Fireplace Girl. The mystery lay in the mystery which was a mystery. Is Mad Jack another pantheon dweller and we’ll only see the working parts when the arc is resolved? Might be better if we were left to shiver while scratching our heads. Which shouldn’t really be possible.

Well that was excellent and has added to the arc in a couple of interesting ways:

Firstly, Kate Lethbridge-Stewart confirms that we are in a universe where fantasy is bleeding into reality, when she says: to Ruby; “We’re the Unified Intelligence Taskforce, created to investigate the extraterrestrial and, more and more, the supernatural. Things seem to be turning that way these days.”

Secondly, this is the third time we’ve seen alternate timelines so far in Series 14:

a) When Ruby steps on a butterfly in the Jurassic in Space Babies and then becomes an Alien/Bjork hybrid creature, until the Doctor revives the butterfly and course-corrects the time-line;

b) When Maestro gobbles human music in The Devil’s Chord, turning the Beatles shit and leading to a nuclear winter, until the Doctor defeats/ banishes Maestro and course-corrects the time-line;

c) When the Doctor breaks the magic binding circle on the Welsh clifftop in this episode, leading to the rise of fascist leader Roger ap Gwillam (aka Mad Jack) until Older Ruby banishes Mad Jack and course-corrects the time-line.

All of which seems to connects to back to Wild Blue Yonder, as the origin point of the arc divergent time-line the Fifteenth Doctor is now inhabiting – a time-line which leads to the bi-generation of the Fourteenth Doctor in The Giggle (a metaphor for divergence in time) into Gatwa and Fourteen 2.

It’s in Wild Blue Yonder that we get Tennant 2 and Donna’s encounter with Isaac Newton, turning “gravity” into “mavity” and where the Doctor attempts to bind the terrifying Doctor and Donna doppleganger entities at the edge of the universe using the fairy-binding myth about salt. He tells the entities they (the fey) cannot cross a salt line without first counting each grain, and when they sneer, he insists that salt-line protection is both a superstition and real – they are then obligated to count the salt. And this is the crux – superstition and reality have been bled together.

So the fantastical has entered the Whoniverse. Goblins snatch children in The Church on Ruby Road, bringing to mind the changelings of fairy stories. and a mystical snow follows Ruby through time and space wherever she goes evoking The Snow Queen.

What is it that Old Mysterious Witchy Ruby tells everyone who talks to her about Young Ruby in 73 Yards which terrifies them so much? That Ruby is a changeling? That certainly seems to be the implication, given that her Mother then rejects her telling her, “Even your real mother didn’t want you.”

I’ve also been pondering the number 73. I did a bit of Googling and apparently Sheldon in The Big Bang Theory in the 73rd episode of the show, which is called The Alien Parasite Hypothesis says he loves the number 73 because:

“73 is the 21st prime number. Its mirror, 37, is the 12th, and its mirror, 21, is the product of multiplying seven and three … and in binary, 73 is a palindrome, 1001001, which backwards is 1001001.”

https://www.mathnasium.com/math-centers/kirkwood/news/bang-math-professors-prove-tv-show-theory-about-the-number-73

So we could say that 73 is a “mirror number” suggestive, in this series of Doctor Who, of mirror universes.

Does that also mean that Ruby is an “alien parasite”?

@ps1l0v3y0u

Anyone checked out the name of the Welsh village for Thomasite Llareggyb meaning? I don’t have head for unlikely combination of consonants.

Llareggyb is the name of the village in Under Milk Wood, by Dylan Thomas (hence Thomasite, I presume. The y in Welsh is pronounced more like u. Try saying it backwards with the double L as in English pronunciation 😉

Thoughts on the episode to come.

@mudlark @juniperfish

apparently the name of the pub translates as ‘the dead wood.’ The actual pub also featured in Torchwood!

The full Big Bang 73 numerological analysis was outstanding, juniperfish.

I shall now rewatch to check out the name of the village

Glyngatwg… Glen something…

sub the initial and ultimate g for a… and you have alyn (alien?) gatwa??!

Old Ruby is apparently using BSL.. I saw a transcription somewhere on the web but can I get it back???

>For the first time, Ruby feels she recognizes the hiker played by Susan Twist. “Haven’t I seen you before?” or words to that effect. That also acknowledges that Ruby has previously seen Susan Twist’s face. (I know that it has been argued that while we, the audience, have seen the same face multiple times, that Ruby was never in actual eye contact in previous episodes.) This question by Ruby belies that argument. But as for what it means, or where it is leading, I no idea.

@blenkinsopthebrave

Well I think you’re right, didn’t she see the face of the ambulance in Boom?

I suppose if nothing else it means Susan Twist is a spy or a time traveller? But whether benevolent or malevolent who knows.

@blenkinsopthebrave

Apologies for not seeming to acknowledge that you raised the point about Ruby recognising the Susan Twist before I did. You  posted while I was writing the above.

@juniperfish

I’m a bit haunted by the messages from the fairy circle which Ruby reads out. They are: “I miss you” and “Rest in peace, Mad Jack”. Surely no one misses fascist Prime Minister Roger Ap Gwillam.

Except that when Ruby reads out that message Roger ap Gwilliam is some twenty years in the future. In retrospect I interpreted this as ‘Remain bound and buried spirit of Mad Jack and don’t rise again to disturb us’ or, in a timey-wimey way, wishing the same of the future prime minister.

@mudlark You make excellent points about the importance of abandonment in relation to Ruby. I am starting to wonder if the Doctor doesn’t just appear in the dance hall and strike up a conversation with Ruby in The Church on Ruby Road but rather seeks her out precisely because he knows all about her and the centrality of abandonment to her. Indeed, he may already be aware of the events in the episode we just watched when he meets her back then. Of course, others may have already made a version of this point.

p.s. @mudlark No need whatsoever for an apology, as the comments are coming thick and fast and overlap is inevitable.

Second viewing, second thoughts.

Perhaps some of the most important words are spoken in the pub early on, by the Sian Phillips character when Ruby reveals that her friend (ie, the Doctor) accidentally stepped on the circle of thread and Ruby read the messages aloud. The Sian Phillips character points out that the spot that is being described by Ruby is the boundary between the sea and the land and, as such, is a liminal space.She is making the point that this is where magic can happen, and where there are distinct rules to be followed, and that by breaking the circle and reading the messages, Ruby has broken the rules. And one implication is to release the spirit of “Mad Jack”.

Now, this is sort of reminiscent to Wild Blue Yonder, which is also a liminal space at the edge of the universe–ie, where magic can happen. And the Tennant Doctor constructs a line of salt, with his own rules (that the pieces of salt have to be counted). And then, in The Giggle, the Tennant Doctor admits that by doing this, he may have allowed the Toymaster entrance to the universe. Once here, the Toymaster creates his own set of rules that have to be followed.

So, to return to 73 Yards, we are seeing another example of magic intruding into the real world with attendant rules to be followed. Ruby and the Doctor inadvertently break the rules, the Doctor disappears (?) and Ruby has to play it out to the end–of her life.

Anyway, just some late night thoughts.

@cookgroom

Wasn’t sure if I missed something about Marti?… why was she scared of him (and why did she stay?)

I think the implication is that ap Gwillam sexually coerced/ abused Marti Bridges. He creepily insisted she (a mere volunteer in the hierarchy – so a massive power gap between them) be invited to his celebration party (but no other “low level” staff) and she tells Ruby he’s a “monster”.  It was hinted, rather than made more explicit, because of the child audience.

As for why she was scared of him/ didn’t leave – all the domestic violence charities have pages on why e.g. see:

Why don’t women leave?

But to paraphrase for this particular situation:

a) Fear – the guy’s just become Prime Minister – he’s a fascist (they aim to exert total control over the media, the police, the military etc.). What would he do to a lowly campaign volunteer who tried to go public with a sexual abuse story, let alone in the aftermath of his victory when he’s riding high in public opinion? And even if he did nothing, how would she be treated by the press?

b) Shame – she’d supported his politics/ been part of the campaign to get him elected – probably feels horribly (of course overly) responsible for her part in getting this monster into power

@whohar

…the older Ruby appeared no older than younger Ruby. I assume this was deliberate, rather than lazy makeup choices.

Yes, I’ve been thinking about that – an indication of additional genetic longevity linked to Ruby’s mysterious parentage?

Something else I noticed is that Old Witchy Ruby is wearing a wedding ring in the final shot from her POV when we see her hands underneath the withered tree reaching out to Young Ruby and the TARDIS in the distance (I can’t work out how to upload a screenshot here @craig ?).

Since we know Ruby in the Mad-Jack-is-free timeline never marries, as we are shown all her relationships failing, does that suggest Old Witchy Ruby is from yet another timeline, come to help correct the Mad Jack problem?

She must be, right? Because Old Ruby in the Mad-Jack-is-free timeline never becomes Old Witchy Ruby. When Old Witchy Ruby finally appears in Old Ruby’s care home, the timeline corrects, but why then? Why not at the point ap Gwillam is spooked into abdicating power?

And why, after ab Gwillam abdicated did the snow stop falling over Ruby? Perhaps because magic/ the veil between fantasy and reality was banished from that timeline when ab Gwillam was banished?

Greetings all. Finally watched the ep and able join the party.

A few random thoughts. Lots of questions, lots and lots of questions. We have talked about it for at least as long as we were watching. Was the woman in white Ruby? What was it she said to people? My theory is she sort of mesmerised them with some kind of mind power. Very 70s. Very Omega Factor actually. I loved that kind of supernatural mystery story, especially those that leave things open to interpretation.

Funnily enough it reminds me a little of something I saw as a child that may have been Doctor Who though I have not identified the episode and given I was very young, was watching on a snowy 59s black and white tv and must have “re written” the memory a thousand times since it might by very different to how I think I remember. It involved a white man who had a mesmerising influence over a group of people in some kind of space station with plants in it. I am certain about the plants, and the fear that lasted for years after. I stopped watching tv for a long time after that.

Mrs Flood is still a presence and I think will have some significance. Susan Twist. I still suspect that her only relevance is the name. I keep picturing RTD seeing the name on IMDB and saying, “oh that is perfect. I’m going to use that. It strikes me that she is a clue of hte same kind as the portrait of Lady Hamilton on the wall of the Doctor’s Study when he meets Bill. (the famous Mistress as a clue that Missy is about)

Again the Doctor steps on a butterfly, or the equivalent thereof and history is changed. Ruby aging and in hospital reminds me of Billy in Blink and Clara in Last Christmas.

Minor quibble. We are still getting to know the Doctor and I would prefer the Doctor/Lite episode to be later in the series. I would have liked more Doctor in this one.

I loved the ending, leaving a bit of mystery, because it is magic/supernatural and there are things that a normal human cannot understand. It is all outside our comprehension. We might go mad otherwise, like Ruby’s Mum and Kate.

Cheers

Janette

@juniperfish

Yeah the timing of the corrected timeline is an interesting point and not one I’ve managed to reconcile yet. Similarly with the 73 yards thing. Why not 74 or 72 it some other number? RTD made a big deal about this in a pre ep interview (talking about having to pace it out on a pier to ensure the ep worked) but I am not seeing any significance atm.

@craig – thanks so much for posting Old Witchy Ruby’s fingers showing the ring (and noted re how to link to pictures for the future – many thanks – will attempt it).

I always get my left and right mixed up – bit dyspraxic!

I remember you posting your wife’s picture before, but just to say again how lovely she looks. Russell T Davies gave an interview in 2023 about how returning to Doctor Who has brought him comfort, because his husband was still alive when he was showrunner last time around and he values that connection:

https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/02/02/russell-t-davies-doctor-who-husband-grief-comfort/

As well as your reason for wearing your wedding ring on your right hand now, it was also a bit of a tradition for LGBT folk to wear unofficial wedding rings on their right hand before same-sex marriage was legalised (in those countries where it has been of course):

https://www.gayandlesbianweddings.com/why-some-gay-men-choose-to-wear-wedding-rings-on-the-right-hand/

I don’t know if that’s significant, or if Old Witchy Ruby’s ring is just a random ring…

@juniperfish

I too wear a plain gold band on the third finger of my right hand, but for different reasons again. It is in fact made from the gold of three wedding rings; those of my mother, my maternal grandmother and my grandmother’s mother who was born in 1841 and married in 1862, so it is a link across four generations of my family. The long span is because my grandmother was second to youngest in a large family, born when her mother was in her forties, and my grandmother was 33 when my mother was born. Obviously that is highly unlikely that there is anything like such an explanation here, but in any case we only only saw the inner side of witchy Ruby’s ring, so it could have been a signet ring or even been set with a stone (but see below)

Having now watched the episode a second time, my reading of the relationship between Ruby and the old and witchy’ Ruby who follows her is this. In one speculative theory of multiple universes, every decision point in a person’s life generates an alternative path – in effect a whole alternative life, so that when the thread of the fairy circle was broken Ruby’s and the Doctor’s time lines split into two. The doppelganger was the Ruby who would have lived, or perhaps did live if the circle hadn’t been broken, who perhaps continued travelling with the Doctor and had a very different life until in old age she was able somehow intrude into the other Ruby’s life from the point of divergence, as a constant reminder and a warning. That purpose was in part fulfilled when the Ruby whose life we followed was able  to use her to scare off Roger ap Gwilliam and put an end to his sociopathic intentions, and the frightening off of the others before that was in order to a) put the idea into her head in the first place, and b) isolate her and cut her off from all support and relationships which might have diverted her from achieving that purpose. After that Ruby had to live out her life to the end, though still accompanied by her alternative self.

When old, witchy Ruby saw her younger self emerge from the Tardis she said something like ‘I’m sorry, but it was all I could do’. Their two alternative selves could never meet or approach close enough to see one another clearly because of the time paradox – the same reason that 15th Doctor could not go back to Totters Lane in 1963 to meet his earlier incarnation, and at least one reason why he said that he could never take Ruby back to the church on Ruby Road on the Christmas day she was found. But when the Ruby whom we followed finally reached the end of her life the two could meet and merge and rift in their time lines be healed. At the point they merged we heard the beeping monitor flatline.

How the old, alternative Ruby was able to achieve this haunting of her other self is, of course, not explained, but it does reinforce the idea that there is something other-worldly about her and the mystery of her origins.

Have watched the episode after a fashion( I had to watch it on iPlayer with fairly diabolical internet conditions as I’m currently sitting in hospital having had a massive  Heart Attack on Monday  which after extensive angiography procedures  I’m much better now). Unfortunately the hospitals free WiFi for patients has been down for the last few days so am reliant on very spotty  mobile internet on my phone so have not been able to watch the episode in it entirety all the way through as it kept skipping bits and freezing up but the bits I could watch appeared to be a very companion centric  and a  bit in the vien of the Donna Noble led episode Left Turn and other episodes  from Who past. The witchy/scary watcher I think had a flash back to T Bakers final story (Legopolis) with the mysterious watcher watching the doctor from a distance. I see our recurring guest Susan Twist was again in the episode surely this has to have  some major plot line meaning.. But until I’ve had a chance to watch episode in it’s entirety and uninterrupted I won’t make any more comments other than to say it looks a good episode

@devilishrobby

Wishing you a speedy recovery!

@juniperfish

Yes I think we may revisit Mad Jack aka ‘big-stick crazy-hat’. My personal candidate for Emperor of Death.

RTD’s big challenge this season would seem to be making all the mad stuff add up. Watch out for red buttons, Artron energy and American Diners

@juniperfish

This time, Ruby sees Old Witchy Ruby before the circle break and therefore knows (without knowing why) to stop the Doctor breaking the fairy circle, and this time the Doctor knows to tell Ruby not to read the circle’s messages out loud.

Yes, I think that the merging of the two timelines brought about a kind of recursion and that, on the second time round, the alternative life involving Roger ap Gwilliam bled somehow back into the other, so that Ruby had a subliminal awareness, triggered by the sight of her alter ego stalker, which led her to stop the Doctor from treading on the fairy ring. The first time around she didn’t see her until after the circle was broken. What the Doctor knew to begin with, whether that differed on the second occasion, and whether he had any hand in shifting the points on the railway tracks, so to speak, remains to be seen. Since it involves time lines the latter is certainly on the cards. The switching points analogy only goes so far, though, and I prefer to visualise the implied dual  narrative as the digging of a bypass channel on a river in order to avoid a flood.

I haven’t seen Dark but it sounds just the kind of thing that appeals to me. The only problem is that now that we have such a myriad of choices I never seem to have time to watch even a tithe of all the programmes I want to watch, and as it is I already have an unwieldy number of recorded but unwatched shows accumulating on my TV box

@thane16

Good to see you here, Puro, (should have said that earlier) and I’m glad that your husband is doing well, though it must obviously have been stressful at the time.

You mentioned The Flip Side of Dominick Hyde, and that came to my mind also when, for a brief instant, it  occurred to me, too, that Ruby might be her own mother. Then I realised that although, if time travel were possible, a man might be his own father, that couldn’t possibly work with women – unless, of course, we are talking about parthenogenetic cloning, in which case she would strictly speaking be her sole parent’s identical twin.