Forest of the Dead – S30 (4) 9

Home Forums Episodes The Tenth Doctor Forest of the Dead – S30 (4) 9

This topic contains 83 replies, has 26 voices, and was last updated by  Missy 3 years, 9 months ago.

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    midnyt @midnyt

    Ten is not my favorite Doctor, but this is absolutely one of his best episodes.

    The Vashta Nerada are one of the best monsters, especially when the Doctor explains that “Normally they live on road kill. But sometimes people go missing. Not everyone comes back out of the dark.” If that doesn’t give you chills I don’t know what will.

    Donna is my favorite companion for ten. Her quiet observation near the end gets me every time: “Is all right special Time Lord code for really not all right at all?” “Why?” “Because I’m all right, too.”

    And River’s introduction, of course. Ten’s just getting used to the idea of who she might be “Bet I like you” “Oh, you do”, and then she’s gone. The way he’s just staring at the spot where she was (I’m assuming she was vaporized) is just heartbreaking perfection. He’s already lost so much, and now he’s having to say goodbye when he’s only just met her. I think ten would have been much more open to the relationship with River vs eleven’s acting like a spoiled teenager about it.

    wking999 @wking999

    In the Forest of the Dead, River whispers (what I assume is the Doctor’s name) in his ear… as a means to get him to trust her.

    This means he would know she is his wife. Does this not mean that Doctor 11, Matt Smith, knows that she is his wife…. so for the entire time he was doctor he knew that she was his wife?

    how do we explain that? Thanks!

    Anonymous @

    @wking999  Smith’s Doctor knows she’s his wife when he knows…. What I mean is, when Tennant has the name whispered into his ear he says “there was only one time where I could”. I don’t think this is automatically because of a marriage ceremony. Also, time can be re-written so Smith always asks ‘who are you?’. He knows she’s in storm cage for killing a ‘good man’ and he’s not stupid. He finds Time sensitive and tries not to make snap assumptions.


    Kindest, puro.

    Kharis @kharis

    @Bluesqeakpip It makes sense that she is putting Cal to bed.  We clearly see it’s Cal, and River made the choice to share space in her mind with Cal, so naturally, just like Cal, she is part of the computer now; a controller and storage, so far more than just an uploaded version of her as Donna and the 4,000 people saved were.  Also, not only was the Doctor not sporting a new hair cut before they we to see the singing towers, he was wearing a tux not a suit.  Not the same time. I think we were led to believe it was, but the sonic River had in SITL/FotD was not the 11th Doctor’s sonic.  It is some future version.  I think the new Doctor, the 12th (or 13th, whichever you ascribe to) is River’s Doctor.   Maybe he goes back to his old style before he takes her to the towers?  I have a bunch of crazy theories surrounding SitL/FotD, but some seem so good I am afraid they really are terrible spoilers.  How much do people really want to know, and when is it truly spoiling a moment better suited to letting the experts, like Moffat, portray it with all the magic of theater?  Wouldn’t reading it be kind of anti-climatic?  I’m just wondering because I almost feel bad writing anymore than I already have.  Do you wrestle with that?

    Kharis @kharis

    Sorry, I meant to write @bluesqueakpip

    Anonymous @


    this forum is about theories! I don’t think a theory is a spoiler if it’s yours? It’s the mast of this forum -“theories more insane that what’s actually happening”

    After all this time, FotD  & theories won’t necessarily be spoilers, imo. I think River’s ‘doctor’ is Smith. A minisode saw Smith take River to the Singing Towers: his last date with her, I believe.

    “I almost feel bad writing that…how do you wrestle with that?”

    that was interesting! I actually thought you were referring to someone’s “bad writing,” but you meant “basically I feel bad in writing what is almost certainly a spoiler.”

    Yes, if you’re the show runner, the writer, the photographer’s assistant or you’ve ‘got an in’. I don’t think in all my wildest times here I’ve ever thought, “you know what? If I write what I think is going to happen i’ll upset everyone because I know so much about the show and its arcs.” I would get it wrong anyway (because I always do but there have been others smarter than me who have been very close to the truth)

    I think most people here don’t need to wrestle with anything like that. Spoilers are about what is yet to be seen but may have been revealed by newspapers/radio/panels. I would stay away from the spoilers pages which we have here. If you do have actual content knowledge then that’s the place to write it down.

    If it’s a theory then go for it!!

    It would be welcome @kharis.

    Enjoy and jump in <*\*>


    Kharis @kharis

    @purofilion Good to know, I was concerned.  Some of my ideas center around Smith not being River’s Doctor, considering my theories in the above comment #40818.  Smith’s Doctor did say he was going to the Singing Towers with her that night, but like in the above comment, he was not sporting a new haircut or new suit.  The 11th did think it was an important trip, but it could have been important for another reason and became their special spot.  In the Library she didn’t say it was her first time at the Singing Towers.

    Thank you, I feel better now about throwing out my theories.  🙂   I think SitL is an incredibly important episode on so many levels, and in my view we have yet to see half of it seen through. I am leaving for the weekend camping, but I will write a few of my crazy theories when I get back.

    Kharis @kharis

    After watching this two-part episode again I am positive River was merely uploaded and CAL is Clara.  I don’t think River’s Doctor is Smith alone, I truly believe it’s a later Doctor, possibly the current Doctor.  I believe Tasha Lem is River reaching out from the Library through another mainframe.  Tasha does mean birthday and Lem means owned by God or Great One.  I also think it’s interesting that the new Doctor has styled his TARDiS as a library.

    Kharis @kharis

    Okay, fair to say my thories above are holding water, with the recent news that ********* will be returning. 🙂   Skweee.

    • This reply was modified 7 years ago by  Craig. Reason: Removed spoiler
    Anonymous @


    is *******? really!  I think I did know that.

    Then I forgot.

    I think this is great: I can be surprised over and over like a traumatised person. In one way, good, in another way, not so good!

    • This reply was modified 7 years ago by  Craig. Reason: Slight spoiler removed
    Kharis @kharis

    @purofilion He he!  You were probably the first to know!  🙂   I feel like a kid counting down to Christmas.  I am so excited!  🙂

    bendubz11 @bendubz11

    @kharis definitely agree with you on the CAL=Clara theory! Been thinking it since pre-regen. Looks more likely now that there is the announcement about ———- in the Xmas special. Had a thought whilst reading this thread that helps that theory as well: In TMA CapDoc is looking for a bookstore at the start. Thinking rationally, you’d link that to Sally Sparrow and the Weeping Angels, especially as Blink was SM’s first ep, but the exact wording is niggling me. Bookstore. We’re British, we say bookshop. So if not a shop, why not somewhere that books are stored, like for instance a Library.

    Kharis @kharis

    @bendubz11 Good point, really good point.   I would call it a bookstore where I am from, so I completely overlooked that, but I am Californian @purofilion so I would most likely say, “Dude, where’s the bookstore” or just say point me to a coffee shop, since most bookshops in SF are coffee shops.  😉    My dream was to work and live in Great Britain, but it was too hard to receive the right to work.

    <span style=”line-height: 1.5;”>This may be the most important episode to review for the story arc we are now in.  FotD/SitL are actually master works and brilliantly done on every level.  There is so much in this episode yet to be resolved.  </span>


    lisa @lisa

    @kharis I agree with you that Tasha is River ! I figured that out too.
    Lem is Mel backwards too and Mel was the younger version that came just
    before River. Also, not sure about the CAL-Clara?
    Need to think about that more but its interesting! That would certainly work with
    impossible girl though.
    Cant locate this Tarot theory you mentioned today. But I would really like to find it.

    BTW- Are you in the Bay area? I live in Sactown 🙂

    lisa @lisa

    @kharis That also might help explain the telepathic link that River had with Clara
    to some extent? I think we also saw a version of Clara as 1 of the Claricles behind
    TenDoc in the Library? I definitely think she is a hybrid. This morning I thought
    she could be linked to Missy. Now you’ve messed me up 😉 lol

    Kharis @kharis

    @lisa  Yes, born and raised.  The tarot theory is on The Witch’s Familiar thread.  I have a much more complicated theory involving a lot of the Whoverse, tarot, Atlantis, Egypt, Greece, Rome, etc.  but I am not a great writer, plus my last theory on Silence in Library and Forest of the Dead I posted not long after Asylum of the Daleks came out and was immediately picked up and turned into an article a few days later and lives in cyberspace forever more.  My concern with that is that it became a public theory.  This is going to sound weird, but I feel like it’s one thing to obsess over our theories here and other threads with us crazy Whovains who just have to talk about it while we wait for the next episode, but when the theory hits the general public it isn’t fun anymore. I felt guilty. Like parents can sit around and talk about Santa not being real, but telling a kid Santa isn’t real feels crappy.  Not quite the analogy I want, but basically I felt bad after.  Maybe more like cutting someone off mid joke and telling the punchline yourself.  Not sure, how to explain but I feel Moffat has weaved these incredible story lines and I ruin the impact by telling the outcome.  BBC has such amazing artists who bring Doctor Who to life.  The music, acting and videography create a visceral reaction that telling it in a post can’t, so when you get to the reveal on the screen, it feels anti-climatic.

    I have this crazy theory, this huge over arc of a theory, but it feels like a mega spoiler.  I can easily talk about little things, like the tarot part, but the other theories make me feel like letting the CAL & River theory out of the bag.  Like I knew the boy was Davros, but I can only imagine the impact if I hadn’t figured it out, so much more fun to be surprised.

    Can send you a private message with some of it if you are really curious, can promise not to repost and you are sure knowing wouldn’t spoil your fun.

    I could be wrong too, about my big theory, about CAL and River, then all my stressing over people knowing would have been silly.   The CAL theory has been out there for awhile so talking about it here is just fun.  It’s always different with crazy fans because we get excited about everything.  (:

    Leave you with this lovely thought about Forest of the Dead “The only water in the forest is the river”  So she can flow in and out.  Just saying. (:


    Kharis @kharis

    @lisa   Yes, that was Clara at the library with the tenth for sure.  (:

    bendubz11 @bendubz11

    @kharis I’m intrigued to find out what your mega spoiler theory is

    Kharis @kharis

    <span class=”useratname”>@bendubz11</span> I can private message you if you promise to never repost and promise it will not spoil anything for you.

    bendubz11 @bendubz11

    @kharis 100% promise, my lips/fingers are sealed

    Kharis @kharis

    @bendubz11  Sent  (:

    bendubz11 @bendubz11

    @kharis much appreciated :~D

    221BadWolf @221badwolf

    @kharis Can I join the Mega-Spoiler-Theory club? I won’t repost anywhere, cross my hearts!

    jhonsoneric86 @jhonsoneric86

    such a nice forum post. I really like it.

    hanks and Regards.

    Anonymous @

    I just watched this tonight. It was my second viewing.

    Shivers down my spine moments: a) When Donna’s digital husband saw her in the library after she’d been searching for him and teleported away just as she walked off; and b) When River Song spoke about the singing towers and the Doctor in a new suit.

    a) gives a hint of just how mean SM can be to the companions.


    Missy @missy

    Has anyone wondered what happened to River’s screwdriver and her diary?


    Missy @missy

    Mmm, no response. Probably because I’m an idiot!

    I watched Forest of the Dead again the other evening, and of course River is holding her diary as she says good night to her vertual children. *rolls eyes* However, what did happen to the screwdriver? Was it left with CAL? Or did he keep it so that it could be given to River by the PC Doctor? Did I miss something?


    the12thdoctor @the12thdoctor

    love the tenth doctor and David Tennant I love all his episodes and his doctor


    Missy @missy

    Have just watched Silence in the Library and Forest of the Dead again, and still marvel at the pure genius of Steven Moffat.

    To link it all together in Husbands of River Song and, in a small way, Doctor Mysterio shows a superb mind and talent.

    God I miss him.


    ichabod @ichabod

    @missy  Me, too.  Me, too.

    Anonymous @

    @missy @ichabod

    Amazing, wasn’t he?  On top of all that with River Song, to confound expectations the way he did with Dr. Moon, the little girl, Miss Evangelista…  Incredible.

    Missy @missy


    Sigh! Life just ‘aint fair.


    Indeed he was and is. How some people can say that he wasn’t a good writer renders me speechless.

    I found it so exciting when River, in one of the above, says “MY Doctor ” and  “you know when you see and old photograph of someone you know, but they aren’t quite done yet.”And you know she means the 12th not the 11th Doctor. daft I know, but it still makes me tingle.


    Anonymous @

    @missy – Oh, he was incredible.  But of course not to everyone’s taste.  (Is anything?)

    Missy @missy


    Alas no,which is fair, as this new one is not to mine.

    Such is life,


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