[thedoctordude @replies]

Spoiler discussion…

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Just a thought about the trailer “spoiler” about Clara “being created for the doctor”. If Moffet doesn’t mind us knowing that she was created for the doctor, there is probably more to her then that. Maybe it is partly who she is, but not her true, full identity. Most likely something else will be the big reveal about her…or maybe that line won’t even turn out to be true and just be a misdirection…

[thedoctordude @replies]

Rewatched and noticed a couple things…

The cyberman in the chess room was the 699th wonder of the universe? do our number geeks have any connections on that one?

I thought it was interesting when Clara said the “only reason I’m still alive is because I do what the doctor says”. As others have pointed out, she has been the first companion to do what he says. She also states that she “trusts the doctor.”

The “Child’s brain with infinite potential” line very much reminded me of the leaf from RoA

Mr clever states that if he wins he gets “brains and memories, all of it”. Again the importance of memories.

“And nobody dies, you got that nobody dies”. I can’t remember where, but I’m sure I’ve heard this in another episode.

Angie’s statement at the end seemed like to almost be directed at the doctor about Clara…
“It’s obvious…am I the only one paying attention to anything around here?”

@htpbdet I think the phone had to do with the fact that Angie lost her phone to the cybermites when she set it down.

[thedoctordude @replies]

Great episode. Definitely going to require a rewatch.

Did anyone else notice the reference to the captivity of Amy with the phrase “Wakey, Wakey, boys and girls”??

[thedoctordude @replies]

@phileasf and @have you fed the fish

I think there is several pieces of evidence that the doctor may have gone through these events several times. Firstly how would the doctor know where to go get rid of the red poison? He seems to know exactly where he needs to go.

He also isn’t very afraid about Clara or about anything really. This would also explain the two different pictures in the dead Mr. Thursday’s eyes.

I thought it could explain his use of the chair to break Clara free. In the scene where Clara disarms the rocket launcher, the doctor says that he has a sonic screwdriver, but Clara says she has a chair. The chair seems to work better in the situation. Therefore, on the final successful run, the doctor decides to use a chair to bust her out of her jar.

In the next scene the doctor says that if Clara follows Mrs. G, Eva will get shot. How does he know unless he has been through it before??

[thedoctordude @replies]

Awesome well written episode. A couple things I noticed…
The doctor uses a chair to break Clara out of her glass bubble and she uses that later on the machine.

The boy says he knows that he knows that the Doctor is an alien because of his chin. This is the same as was referenced in Hide about “sticking out like a big chin” and Oswin calling the doctor chin boy in AotD.

Very timey-wimey how the doctor doesn’t know how long he has been in the red state.

Gotta love the boy that sounds like a gps unit.

I think the doctor had Ada stand outside the door so she could hear what was going on. Mrs Galliflower still wanted to blast her up on the rocket anyway.
There also seemed to be several instances of the doctor having or not having a plan…I guess normal doctor who?

Dark doctor…blackness in a heart, calling him the monster…I guess we’ll see.

[thedoctordude @replies]

What if what we are seeing right now is actually the doctor giving his memories to Clara as the repository? This would explain why she had to know his name. I think a book or however it happened would be an excellent way for her to find out what his name is without the doctor having to consent or say it himself.

It could be too that the program run:”You Clever Boy and Remember” has already started and is working on transferring memories to her through this whole series.

[thedoctordude @replies]

One thing I noticed, the lighting in the Tardis changed from blue to red when the magnetic thing took over.

I also thought that Clara’s quote about red was interesting. “Red flashing light means something bad, get out of here fast, possible, whatever you do don’t open this door.” Maybe a hint about Clara as a red flashing light?

Interesting to hear the cloister bells again. I guess there are several time lines running again.

Maybe the two other Claras in AotD and Snowmen were just echos of her indicating a larger time rift that is happening?

Or maybe they were again repetitions of the same thing until the doctor got it right and saved her in tBoSJ?

[thedoctordude @replies]

First of all love the new theories coming out on Clara. Really some interesting stuff.

Just a thought about her though. There doesn’t seem to be any definite proof that she doesn’t know who the doctor is or isn’t aware of who she. She seems very good at solving problems that come up, even more so then the doctor.

The area she struggles is in being a good companion. She is always wondering if she is being a good companion and “passing the tests”.  What if she is aware of who she is (daughter, granddaughter, doctor, etc.) , but trying play “the companion” so he doesn’t suspect? This would explain why when asked about what she does she says “you know just stuff”.

Also, what if the doctor’s “dark side” is really just the master? Probably been brought up before, but just crossed my mind…

[thedoctordude @replies]

Another theory I was thinking about, was what if the question “Doctor who?” is not just a question that just the doctor asks, but a question that everyone is asking. We have seen the Doctor slowly erasing himself from the universe. In AotD, Oswin is able to delete him from the database of Daleks, his arch-enemy. He leaves them saying “Doctor who?”. We see the Doctor too is losing his memory. (On a side note it could be that his memory is based on how well known he is in the universe, thus he is losing it.) What if the dark doctor wants to be forgotten? He likes the words “Doctor who?” as stated in tBoST.

This would make it the ultimate question. We would see that it gets to the point where nobody knows who the doctor is, and the question would be asked “Doctor who?”. Maybe this would allow something to happen like the time lock to be opened or something.

btw. I don’t think Clara could help him remember who he is at this point. She doesn’t even seem to know enough about him, unless she is a hidden form of somebody else.

[thedoctordude @replies]

Also just a thought that others have intimated at…what if the answer to the question “Doctor Who?” is not the doctor’s name but the explanation who he actually is? With the splintering and stuff going on it seems like we might be able to find that out soon.

[thedoctordude @replies]

@badwolf99 I think that’s a very interesting idea that the universe has recreated her three times. If the universe recreated her, that would explain how she has such complete backstories and how she can have such an effect on events.

I’m really liking these new theories on Clara. They seem to make quite a bit of sense from what we’ve seen.

[thedoctordude @replies]

I know there has been a lot of discussion about two doctors. I just realized that unless I missed it we haven’t seen the doctor wear Amy’s glasses since RoA. Maybe he’s just finally able to get over her, but what if this is a different doctor that doesn’t need them or doesn’t care for her?

 

Also, the references to the way “a big chin stands out” might indicate a subconscious link to Oswin. What if Clara somehow has some memories or at least subconscious memories of the doctor from their other meetings? This might explain her apparent nervousness. Probably totally off, but just a thought.

[thedoctordude @replies]

It was interesting how many times in this episode how slow the doctor was. He kept getting so absorbed with what he was doing that Clara would have to tell him to look here or there. This was especially prominent in the chalk drawing scene and in the scene the first time the “mirror” appeared. This also happened when the ice warrior first appeared in Cold War. At the end of Hide we see him stating it outright, that he is so slow.

I’m not quite sure what this indicates, but it might be some evidence of a fracturing doctor. It also probably points to how “slow” he is with figuring out who Clara is. Probably her mystery something that he should be able to figure out right away, but is too preoccupied to see it.

I have a feeling it will be both. In the finale, we will see how “easy” it should have been to figure out who Clara is (Susan maybe) and then in the anniversary special we will see him having to deal with his fracturing self.

 

[thedoctordude @replies]

Just rewatched and noticed a few things…

If I heard it right, Clara says that whiskey is 11th most disgusting thing ever invented. I guess another eleventh doctor reference.

I think like others have mentioned there is a big comparison going on between the professor and the doctor. When they are talking in the development room he says that there “were thousands of others, millions of others, I was just lucky enough to come back.” He goes on to say that he has “killed and caused to have killed” and that “it haunts him, living, after so much [death].” He says he didn’t mind dying for that cause; it was a very fine cause, defeating the enemy.

This seems like a very close parallel between him and the doctors situation. They are both haunted after all the killing they have seen and caused. I think we see a little bit of the doctors feelings come through when he asks what he would say if he could talk to them. Perhaps this is something the doctor wishes he could do too.

They also both have “ghosts” that they are trying to figure out. The professor has the ghost in the house, the doctor has Clara and humans in general. For both, it is “the only mystery worth solving” and allows them to carry through the pain they feel.

I thought it was interesting how the last scene with Clara played out. The doctor talks about something that all lonely creatures do sharks, monsters, everything. They get a companion. He says its the oldest story in any universe. Then these companions get separated by something and they are yearning for each other across time and space. This seems to be a reference to the what he is feeling; quite possible with River or in a slightly different way with Susan.

Also some inconsistencies…
The main photograph shown in the development room scene shows the doctor and ‘the ghost” together in one photo, yet the doctor was the one who was taking all the photographs previously. I might be wrong but there doesn’t seem to be a scene where that photo could have been taken.

The “psychic link setup” is linked into the tardis, yet Clara is able to take the tardis and rescue the doctor in the echo universe. Maybe she goes in a different tardis??

[thedoctordude @replies]

@morbius I noticed that too. I didn’t seem to pan out quite right.

I don’t know if anybody else noticed it but there seemed to be another blackout moment right after the doctor asks to see the maps of the compound. Lightening strikes and then suddenly the doctor is at Clara’s side asking her to come with him. Might be nothing, but it seemed a little strange.

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@lula It would kind of make sense then that she had already in some way been linked to the doctor in AotD or else why else would she be placed right in the same place as all the other daleks who fought him?

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@bluesqueakpip Now I might be wrong about this, but it seems like there are have been several instances when the doctor has stated it is impossible for him to insert himself or go back into a timeline he has already established. It seems in that like it would be impossible for him to be around Clara if she actually was the doctor because their timelines would interfere. Now of course there were times that this did happen such the episode on pete tyler’s death and does seem like they have some very similar qualities.

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@thommck That’s true. An alternative would be that for the memories to be unlocked clara would have to say “run you clever boy and remember” and then the doctor would have to respond with another specific phrase for them to be unlocked.

I’m probably completely wrong on this, but it was just something I thought of.

[thedoctordude @replies]

@bluesqueakpip What if Clara, human or not, is actually a repository for the doctor’s memories? When the time comes the doctor will have to deposit his memories into Clara in her time line in the past and password lock them with a song . This would keep the memories safe from a dark doctor or especially dalekised doctor who wouldn’t value songs. Or maybe the memory transfer would be made by a song such as in RoA. This would also explain why she can’t seem to access her own memories or ideas very much. Her head is so full of the doctors memories that she can’t remember anything or have any desires of her own.

[thedoctordude @replies]

Just a thought or two…
the Doctor seems to be a little bit nervous about the Tardis: first he doesn’t want to take it into battle with the spoon heads and now he has set up a feature so it automatically relocates. It seems to be a theme building up.

Also in the underwater scene with clara, the sonic screwdriver appears to stay “on” while it is underwater. Probably insignificant, but it seemed a little odd.

Lastly, the professor seemed to be pretty confident about them getting out of the scrape. Usually, no one is that confident in these situations except for the doctor. He seems to really care about Clara and be interested her in a “longing” sort of way. He also didn’t hesitate to use a gun against the ice warrior unlike the doctor.

[thedoctordude @replies]

Its interesting on the first page of the book we see that Ellie (clara’s mom) was 11 when she got the book. Also of note, Ellie’s maiden name was Ravenwood; perhaps another reference to trees/paper/wood.

I think the man standing next to Clara in the grave scene will turn out to be somebody. It would have been as easy to have her standing there by herself yet they chose to put him there.

Probably just a bonkers theory, but we don’t seem to be able to see where Clara’s mom comes from when she saves the dad. What if she just somehow appeared or something?

Also, that scene seems quite similar to the how rose’s dad died, even the same colored car. I wonder if they are somehow related?

[thedoctordude @replies]

Hello Everyone,
I am just new here and discovered this forum recently. So, here it goes…
I rewatched Asylum of the Daleks and noticed a few things.
In the introduction to Clara, we find out two things: that it is her mom’s birthday and that it is 363 days after they crashed. I couldn’t find anything indicating the day they crashed, but it was interesting to see her mom popping up again.

Another interesting thing is that despite being made into a dalek she seems to have not completely been converted. She shows to have a certain amount of a free will e.g. she manages to wipe the dalek memory of the doctor despite being a dalek herself. She also doesn’t appear to have acquired their knowledge of him. I don’t know what it would take to for this to happen, but it seemed like the conversion was some how incomplete.

Also she states that she’d “know a dalek when she saw one.” I wonder how?

Maybe somebody has already mentioned these things before, but I hadn’t seen anything on it so I thought I’d bring it up…

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