The Next Doctor

[ScaryB @scaryb]

FishComBobulated Not discountng your experience, but as pointed out above the BBC licence fee system does make a crucial difference. (It’s not immune to suits’ opinions, ratings etc but it is protected – the key thing it must deliver is quality (and it must work in the UK market)).

Re new Dr speculation – I agree with those who say speculation is futile as it’s already been cast – and probably was when series 8 was confirmed to have been commissioned. OTOH all the names floating about keeps the various news websites busy (esp heading into the silly season summer period), and any actor whose name is mentioned gets his/her profile boosted for a while. I attach no credence to any f the rumours and i expect a late official announcement (as late as they can possibly get away with).  If they think they can keep the new actor under wraps even while filming the Xmas special (in Sept?) they will do.

[FishComBobulated @fishcombobulated]

@scaryb

I understand what you mean; however: How is it protected? What crucial difference? From everything I’ve read, the TV tax you have to pay in Britain is just that: a tax for a bureaucratic government that does not afford any intellectual promise as to the quality of the programming. The business, regardless of it being about a show or film, in a socialist capitalistic or democratic capitalistic country that produces these productions, is still simply at its core a business. I’ve not worked in England, but in the countries where I have worked on productions, at the top the ultimate decisions are made in those board rooms (or the people from those boardrooms fly out to the location and crack the whip if it’s that kind of gig).

I understand the ideal of hoping it’s not that way, but if there is a significant amount of money involved, the people controlling that money make unilateral calls all that indelibly shapes the creative production process. I truly wish it were not that way. Unless the BBC signs some sort of structural contract that frees the process from the interests of money, it’s the same in the US, Britain, AU, and even South American countries. No implicit promise exists not to do that.

I’ve followed new Who since its inception and from an industry perspective on issues such as this. I am happy to agree to disagree. I am often wrong but not usually about production matters and the social machine that drives them.

When it comes to the original (OP) question, I only want to say this: I doubt that anyone but a white and properly accented male will be cast as the next Doctor because the way the industrial side of the show is designed, TPTB will want to keep the status quo. That being said, the following Doctor could be female or not white because the same people who profit from the status quo know when the status quo is lagging behind the times. However, at that point, they will get a new showrunner, a new Doctor, and new writers. They house clean, and from the first day in preproduction, they get everyone o. The same page: “It’s not the same Who now that it’s 2016. The fans have been voicing for a change in tone since 2013. We gave you the tools, money, and responsibility. Now you creatives go make the best series in the 53 year history of this show!”

[HTPBDET @htpbdet]

@FishComBomBulated

@scaryb is right.

The BBC is a unique institution. Its funding is completely separate from its editorial charter. They are given the money and can spend it as they choose.

There are “Suits” but not like “Suits” in American networks.

Truly – the American experience is the same experience in the other English channels, but not at the BBC.

The BBC is unique.

Unfortunately, this can mean that meglomaniacs sometimes get control of the product. But that is a different issue from the intervention or grand plan of “Suits”.

Cheers

[FishComBobulated @fishcombobulated]

@htpbdet , @scaryb

I am happy to concede. My only question is what makes the people who control the content on the BBC different from other “suits”? Could you send me a link that explicates the difference in how the BBC top dogs are required to follow governmental rule to follow a different production system? I would love to learn more.

Always love to learn. “Intellect and romance over the brute force and cynicism.”

[HTPBDET @htpbdet]

@FishComBobBulated

Try here:   http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbctrust/governance/regulatory_framework/charter_agreement.html

[FishComBobulated @fishcombobulated]

@htbpdet

Thanks! Perfectemundo

[OsakaHatter @osakahatter]

A devious thought occurred to me, and I’m not sure if it’s been previously suggested.  Moffat et al, deciding that much as they’d like a surprise regeneration realise that with Matt Smith’s film commitments, the three year rule of thumb approaching etc there was no way they could quell the speculation or prevent the news getting out.  So they leak confirmation that MS is in fact leaving.  The episode arrives, we all sit in baited breath, waiting for that blast of time energy, radiation, poison, stray bullet, TimeLord maliciousness or radio telescope to take out our hero and.. it doesn’t happen.

Series 8 starts with Matt Smith still twirling his bowties and it emerges that he’s contracted per episode rather than for the season – every moment of danger is then the one that could cause a regeneration, maintaining suspense until mid-season he’s off.

I don’t think for a second this will happen, because I think given that the regenerations are event episodes, they will always be used to lead in or out of the Christmas specials now, bookending the series.  But if I were in charge and wanted to maintain an element of surprise…

[CraigNixon @craignixon]

They could even have him start regeneration but not be able to complete it (remember Tennant being unconcious in The Xmas Episode?) and -with a doctor lite episodes have Clara pilot the Tardis to somewhere he can recuperate.

Could that be Trenzalore?  Fall of the Eleventh meaning thats where he regenerates / has to be brought to absorb some timey wimey wibbly energy?

[OsakaHatter @osakahatter]

@craignixon – yeah, I think there’s a reason we’ve seen the Doctor trying to teach Clara to pilot the TARDIS and I don’t think it’s just to prove that he can teach better than Sexy herself!

[wolfweed @wolfweed]

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2013-06-20/doctor-who-new-doctor-to-be-announced-in-the-autumn

[Whisht @whisht]

btw @osakahatter – an actor contracted per episode to increase jeopardy.

I like your devious mind!

[topperofgallifrey @topperofgallifrey]

When Dorium is talking about ‘The Fall of the Eleventh’ he says it will take place on Trenzalore. So how can Matt be regenerating in the Christmas Special when they are always set on earth?

[Craig @craig Emperor]

@topperofgallifrey “Voyage of the Damned” was mostly on a spaceship and most of “The Doctor, the Widow and the Wardrobe” is in an alternate world entered via a wardrobe. So not always on Earth.

Any more questions?

[topperofgallifrey @topperofgallifrey]

No thanks Craig.

[Arkleseizure @arkleseizure]

@craig: Moreover, absolutely none of A Christmas Carol is set on Earth at all!

[Craig @craig Emperor]

@arkleseizure Ah yes, forgot about that one, flying sharks an’ all. So 3 out of 7 (I think) not set on Earth.

[ProfessorRiverSong @professorriversong]

@bluesqueakpip What about the end of time? That was the last episode with David, and was a Christmas special. (the whole episode was based around the girl’s Christmas present, the Infinity Ark. Arc? Arck? I dont know, but I’m sure they will be fine with it.

[ProfessorRiverSong @professorriversong]

Just a special note for any of you guys who play the game Draw Something 2, I am having a contest to see who can design the best, and most unique new costume for the new doctor. My username is whovians,UNITE, so check out the contest and its rules

[ScaryB @scaryb]

I missed the memo about rules re where or when Xmas specials are set 😉  And I’d say that one way or another the Trenzalore prophecy has been fulfilled. The 11th fell in NotD. He then seems to have got back up again, but it was a close thing. If the prophecy refers to his (earlier) death which resulted in the Tardis tomb, then there can be no regeneration after that.

Unless Eleven is actually Twelve of course…

[thommck @thommck]

SFX have just published an article on who would be the worst casting choice for the next Doctor.
I hope the Moff doesn’t see it and think, “hmm lets throw them a curveball”.

To be fair, some of them wouldn’t be too bad.

I voted against Russell Kane FWIW

[thommck @thommck]

Now I’ve re-awoken this thread I might as well put my final guess at who the Hurt Doctor is after weeks of stewing over all the options

I think the only ‘logical’ solution is that he is the Time War Doctor e.g. 8.5
I’m basing this on my speculation that the anniversary special was originally meant to show the regeneration of 8 into 9 but, thanks to an uncooperative Ecclestone, they decided to go bigger with an A-list star

There are a number of theories of why this isn’t really logical but I think it’s good enough to stop me worrying about it and, maybe, leave me pleasantly surprised by time November comes 🙂

[Anonymous @]

@thommck – do you mind posting a link to the article you mentioned in your comment 13203?

[Anonymous @]

@thommck – I’m with you on the logic of your theory that you expressed here:

the anniversary special was originally meant to show the regeneration of 8 into 9 but, thanks to an uncooperative Ecclestone, they decided to go bigger

Seeing as how all the living previous Doctor actors other than David Tennant have repeatedly said they have no part in the 50th (and I hope they’re lying, but to assume they’re telling the truth), then really, the obvious thing to me is that they will address the gap between 8 and 9 in the special.

It’s unknown ground, so, ripe for interpretation; is already known to have been so traumatic that 9 was shell-shocked and had PTSD in quite a bit of his run (so, potentially quite cinematic, rampant with action and drama); and the only other option is that the Hurt Doctor is at the very beginning of the timeline**, a notion I believe they dispensed with in TNotD when Clara was seen telling Hartnell which Tardis to steal.

But as you say, anticipation does run high for November … 🙂

** – yes, I know that there are many lovely theories about the Hurt Doctor being later in the timeline than 11.  But The Moff endured so much flack for his timey-wimeyness of the Pond/River era that I for one doubt he’d try that trick in a programme so devastatingly important (in terms of grabbing new viewers) as the 50th.  It’s much more straightforward to tell the story of the missing Time War Years.

[HTPBDET @htpbdet]

@thommck @shazzbot

I still think that the older McGann Doctor or the real Ninth Doctor are the most obvious possibilities and that is what makes me pause about them.

If the Time War sealing was the issue, why hasn’t one of Ecclestone, Tennant or Smith done something about it?

Whatever idea Moffat had for Ecclestone’s role in the 50th, we know from Smith’s first season that he can rework things if he chooses – that first season was first envisaged as Tennant’s final with him starting it with the crash that would see the commencment of his regeneration (I believe).

So, surely here, he could rework his plan if he chose. A simple way to do that is to make a new Doctor 9.

But equally, he could be Doctor Zero and we could see a tale about why the Doctor ran from Gallifrey in the first place. But I think that is just wishful thinking on my part.

And the mention of the Valeyard in Name of the Doctor might be something or nothing…

[thommck @thommck]

@shazzbot, here’s the link http://m.sfx.co.uk/2013/07/05/vote-who-would-be-the-nightmare-12th-doctor-who

[Whisht @whisht]

well, obviously we’re all bored with speculation, but who could resist wondering if this marriage of Hollywood and deepest darkest Englishness couldn’t have borne a brilliant American Doctor

it might be truly my imagination but…..

hats are cool.

[Anonymous @]

@whisht – you are awesome.  No-one but you could have run with the ‘No American’ theme and hit such a home-run out of the park.  🙂  ‘this marriage of Hollywood and deepest darkest Englishness’ indeed.

There is no … life I know … to compare … to pure imagination

Living there … you’ll be free … if you truly wish to be.

To argue the other corner just a bit (and I feel a bit dirty, somehow, doing so) what @thommck ‘s link meant by ‘No Americans’ was the brilliant (and utterly unattainable) white tombstone teeth, big hair, big abs, big noise, big cheerfulness of stereotypical American-ness.  (I share none of those qualities, meself; except the big hair.  I have enough hair for a small family.)

But you are absolutely correct, Gene Wilder in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory gives a Doctorish performance.  Genial, but scary; avuncular, but coldly unconcerned with the disappearances of horrible children; seemingly eccentric, but utterly controlled in his environment.  And a bit dashing with his choice of hat as you point out.  🙂

[Whisht @whisht]

he he – @Shazzbot – thanks very much for the “you are awesome”!

obviously you’ve explained better than I about how his Wonka was doctorish, but “you are awesome” is something I might have written on my grave!

;¬)

(oh and I dont give a damn where the actor is born, as long as they’re good)

[Anonymous @]

Also am not really bothered where the next Doctor hails from, but would just like to know quite soon. Although it has tailed off big time, there’s still a bit too much idle speculation kicking about for my liking. So much so that a friend of mine suggested Beaker from the Muppets the other day and it didn’t sound like the worst suggestion I’d heard over the past weeks…

[Anonymous @]

@jimthefish – Beaker isn’t the worst suggestion you’ve heard?  Try Kerry Katona.  Or the guy off the Go Compare adverts.  🙂  Or Giles Brandreth.  (I’m going to shoot myself now.)

@whisht – no, it isn’t about where someone was born (or else I’d be damned for all eternity) but that ineffable quality of Doctorishness … not something you’d get from Will Smith, Tom Cruise, or whoever the next toothpaste-advert ‘star’ that Hollywood offers up for our ‘delectation’.

[Noodles @noodles]

A bit sad that Matt Smith is leaving the show…reminded me a lot of Patrick Troughton. Personally, I wouldn’t mind seeing Paul McGann given a proper shot at playing the Doctor…maybe a series about the Time War told through flashbacks?

That’d be my ‘wishful thinking’ choice.

I wouldn’t mind seeing Martin Freeman or Richard Madden playing the part of the Doctor…although I think they’re a bit too ‘big name’ to accept the role. Really though, Martin Freeman would be my choice. He’s got just enough quirk in his performance to pull it off. He was fantastic as Arthur Dent…

N~dles

[Anonymous @]

Well, this puts paid to that rumour …

“I don’t where it came from and how these things evolve,” says Rory Kinnear of recent wildfire rumours that he is due to replace Matt Smith as Time Lord. “I haven’t been and I am totally certain that I will not be asked to be the next Doctor Who. If I was an actor who was really longing to play Doctor Who, then this would be torturous, but it’s a programme I’ve never watched, so I don’t even really know what it is.” Really –not even one episode? “Not one.”

… or does it?!  Everything could be mis-direction by now.

I’m starting to think that once the actual announcement is made, we’re all going to be a bit ‘meh’ from months of too much speculation.

[Anonymous @]

@Shazzbot — well, when Matt was announced the general thinking was ‘who the hell is this little kiddie with his enormous chin?’ I expect the next Doc to be an equally left-field choice…

[Anonymous @]

@jimthefish – OK, I’m finally going to say it:  What’s with all the ‘big chin’ references to Matt Smith?  I’ve never understood it, and it’s been commented on throughout his reign as the Doctor.  His chin looks normal enough to me.

Now, this is a guy with a big chin – does he look anything at all like Matt Smith?!

P.S.  I could of course have used a picture of Jay Leno, but thought that was too obvious.  🙂

[ScaryB @scaryb]

@jimthefish

well, when Matt was announced the general thinking was ‘who the hell is this little kiddie with his enormous chin?’ I expect the next Doc to be an equally left-field choice…

ROFL  😆 I’m with @bluesqueakpip – they know perfectly well who’s been cast, they’ll announce it shortly before filming starts in Sept and anyone who’s been mentioned already should be treated as so much smokescreen and very unlikely to be the new actor.  I’d be delighted to be surprised at their choice for the reason you mention, JtF.

@Shazzbot Chin – well he refers to it himself – personally I think it’s to keep attention away from his ears (he and Prince Charles could’ve been separated at birth in that department) 😯

Completely left field thought – maybe Matt got his hair cut for Dr Who, not for the film. Not sure where I’m going with this, but my thoughts were rambling along route of Matt playing Eccleston’s 9… Well it’s a lot less frustrating than pondering on his replacement 🙂

[Anonymous @]

@scaryb – yes, I was going to mention the ears  🙂  but for some reason that feels more mean than ribbing him about his chin.

maybe Matt got his hair cut for Dr Who, not for the film … my thoughts were rambling along route of Matt playing Eccleston’s 9

Now, that is suitably bonkers!  Hmm, Matt with a Northern accent in a black leather jacket …   Or, maybe he’ll play both 9 and 11 ?!?

[Anonymous @]

@scaryb

but my thoughts were rambling along route of Matt playing Eccleston’s 9

This got me wondering who Moff could use as a stand-in for Eccleston if he wanted to do an 8-to-9 regeneration scene in the 50th. The best candidate I could come up with was Ralph “Lord Voldemort” Fiennes:

But I also found this:

Which spawned a “bonkers theory” – what if the reason we’ve never seen the McGann-Eccleston regeneration is because there was no regeneration? Paul McGann was busy making a couple of movies in 2005 (Gypo and Moving Target) and his marriage was apparently disintegrating (he divorced in 2006), so maybe they cast Eccleston because of his resmblance to McGann, making him Doctor #8b, Tennant #9 & Smith #10?

And since I haven’t chimed in yet on the subject, I don’t have a particular actor/actress that I would like to see play the next Doctor, but s/he should be a ginger. Both DT and MS complained about not being ginger immediately after their regenrations, so I think it would only be fair if he finally gets his wish.

[Anonymous @]

MadScientist72  – wow, that is massively bonkers and bravo for suggesting it.  I may be wrong but I don’t think anyone on this site has done so, yet.  Calling @bluesqueakpip, I’d love to hear your take on this, especially with your number theories (The Eleventh Hour particularly).  What if Smith actually is ’10’ because there really was no regeneration between McGann and Ecclestone?

The impact this has on our theories about the 50th and the Christmas special are immense.  Valeyards, regeneration limits, all of that goes out the window if one is being purist and insists on the initially-declared number of possible regenerations.  And that includes if Hurt Doctor is Doctor 0 (ie pre-Hartnell) because this new theory means we still have one more than was thought.

The likeness isn’t so immense, and there is still explanation in your theory, @MadScientist72, required to tell us why CE had a northern accent and McGann didn’t, plus all of the other inconsistencies in character portrayal.  But that having been said, a big ol’ Time War in between allows for a lot of rough edge smoothing.

[Anonymous @]

@Shazzbot

Actually, the biggest thing that would need to be explained away is probably the fact that Clara said she saw “11 faces, all of them you. You’re the 11th Doctor.” (Incidentally, when she sees all the Doctors running by, the Doctor says “those are my ghosts, my pasts. Every good day, every bad day.” [emphasis added], so clearly what Clara saw was limited to past regenerations of the Doctor and we can’t infer anything from her not seeing any future faces.)

The timestream conversation has something else in it that could be a hint for the 50th:

Clara: “I saw all of you – 11 faces, all of them you. You’re the 11th Doctor.”

Doctor: “I said he was me. I never said he was the Doctor.”

Clara: “I don’t understand.”

Doctor: “Look, my name, my real name. That is not the point. The name I chose is the Doctor.”

This would seem to suggest that DrHurt is the one who actually went but his real name; thus Doctor Zero.

Here’s another “bonkers theory” for the next Doctor – maybe we’ve already met the next Doctor and he is Alfie Owens, the child of Craig and Sophie Owens! The Doctor has a secret real name, is a Time Lord and is also called “the Oncoming Storm”; Alfie also has a secret real name – Stormageddon, Dark Lord of all. And Alfie’s first word was “Doctor”. Coincidence, or subtle hints?

[FishComBobulated @fishcombobulated]

Some have said the name John Noble, of “Fringe” fame, as a new Doctor suggestion. (In the States, the Venn Diagram of modern science television watchers consists in the circles of those who for the last five years watched “Fringe” and “Doctor Who”, and the circles in this diagram overlap to the point of being nearly concentric.)

Wouldn’t John Noble as an actor be a promising companion, though? More than capable of running from back to front a fully conceived and executed character arc as a new companion?

Not that I wouldn’t mind seeing a harkening of the OD (Origina’ Doctah’) WH hisself in the form of a Pater Familias once again in the professorial yet emotional authority of an actor such as John Noble.

Apologies for the broken grammar. I broke it in all the right places, though. (You can get a degree in that.) More than anything, I recommend the entire series of that program “Fringe,” front to back, and ask if seeing Walter Bishop plucked from the “Fringe” time stream does not tickle your cerebrum.

[FishComBobulated @fishcombobulated]

Final thought: Walter Bishop is a direct homage to William Hartnell as the originator.

[janetteB @janetteb]

@fishcombobulated, to quote @jimthefish General open Thread, TV shows post 1219 “the campaign to get John Noble on Who starts here. He’d actually be quite a good Doctor. Or at the very least a quirky take on The Master…”

Naturally I’ve signed on..

cheers

Janette

[BunyonSnipe @bunyonsnipe]

How about doing en entire season with Paul McGann’s 8th Doctor?

[mendaxx @mendaxx]

Has anyone thought of Hugh Laurie as the next doctor.  I mean, he has been a doctor already and I think he would be great.  If people want an older doctor, there you go!

 

[Anonymous @]

@mendaxx – Hugh Laurie’s probably too big a name at this point for them to sign as the Doctor, but I agree that he’d be an excellent choice. It’d also be interesting to see him do something with his native accent again, after so many years of him playing an American.  The big question would be – should he play it dark and sarcastic (like House) or slapstick (like Blackadder or Jeeves & Wooster).

[HTPBDET @htpbdet]

@LastOfTheTimelord

Hmmm…I would not hold my breath. 🙂

I don’t think the Doctor really wanted to be ginger – and, of course, if he really wanted to be, he would be: see Romana in Destiny of the Daleks.

I have no issues with a ginger haired person being cast, whether they be male or female. Just so long as they can act and be a spectacular Doctor!

 

[Whisht @whisht]

hmmm, methinks this topic is wandering into dangerous territory.

It starts with Gingers, but then there’ll be mentions of Jammy Dodgers, Viennese….

Right. I want no more of this.

If we start “Which biscuit would make the best Doctor?”, we are seriously scraping the barrel in terms of topics.

.

honestly, I’ll go crackers.

[TiltedSouffle @tiltedsouffle]

Hello!

Obviously I’m a new face, nice to read you all. I have recently submerged myself in this whole Whovian Whoniverse (very quickly I might add).

And I was just looking for clarification from more informed fellows.  Is it possible for the new Doctor to be a female? Or does a Time Lord’s gender totally dismiss all gender binaries. I only wonder because there are Time Ladys’, and if the people from Gallifrey do not have fixed genders, why would there be a gender classification through titles.

 

Don’t get me wrong. I would love a female Doctor, but it is a question that has plagued me.

[wolfweed @wolfweed]

Welcome, @tiltedsouffle!

Time Lord sex change became am established fact with the character of The Corsair in ‘The Doctor’s Wife’.

According to ‘The Brilliant Book 2012’, The Corsair regenerated from a male (4th incarnation) into a female (5th incarnation).

Whether or not this was a deliberate decision on his(/her) part we don’t know.

Sex change was established as a distinct possibility when the Dr regenerated from Tennant, and Smith said ‘I’m a girl!’ (though that could potentially have been a joke).

As for the Lord/Lady titles issue, remember that Humans can have sex changes too!

@htpbdet The Dr maybe the only Time Lord (proper) who has no control the results of his regenerations.

When Romana regenerates in DOTD, she performs it as a fashion choice. In TSE the Dr must redirect his regen’ energy into his severed hand. In LKH, River (part Human, part Time Lord) is not in full control of her regeneration, though she did try to concentrate on her new ‘dress size’. Later, she gives the Dr all her remaining regen’s. In TATM, the Dr chooses to give River some regen energy to heal her broken wrist. Presumably he can stop this because it wasn’t started by a mortal blow.

I suppose we should presume that Romana is the norm for Time Lords/Ladies, in that she can control her regenerations. Until it’s proved otherwise. (Though why she was happy to waste one for aesthetics is yet to be confirmed). A further hint that this is the case is that the Master chose to become young for his most recent regeneration.

As for the Dr, he might end up with 2 heads,  or no head (or no nose….etc.). But he would like to be ginger (probably a reference to the future ‘Merlin’ Dr of the ‘Battlefield’ novel – and therefor an in-joke). As far as I’m aware, there’s nothing to show that he can control his rebirth but plenty that demonstrates the contrary.

 

[TiltedSouffle @tiltedsouffle]

@wolfweed Ahh I see thank you for clearing up my confusion.  Now my hope is restored once again for a female Doctor! Yipee(:

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