Spoilers (3)

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  • #59426
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    You do realise that in effect a character like the Master never truly dies especially in a series that involves time travel. Look at all the adventures that River has had since she died. All it needs is for the writers to say” I think we need to use the Master/Missy in this story oh but he/she is is dead. Don’t worry we’ll take him/her from a point before their death”.  I mean we have all been speculating on where Missy and the Master  are on their personal Time lines  any way so an extra adventure can always be fit in by the writers by saying oh this happened for him/her before all that happened. So no need for sad thoughts on the loss of a character 😉

    #59427
    Anonymous @

    @nick @ichabod

    The BBC would have wanted the bring back the buzz they had with Matt and a lighter tone. What does Chibbers want to do though ?

    I don’t personally see that any “buzz” has gone missing? The very light tone of much of the Tennant era needed to change and whilst the 1963 Doctor was less “angst ridden” society itself was changing and this was evident in the way the tone changed over the next 10 ears, in  my opinion.  Things may definitely re-boot themselves under the news show runner, though!

    Puro.

    #59428
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    @thane15 agreed and unfortunately although in my opinion Peter has been a great dramatic actor in the role for the bean counters at the Beeb he hasn’t had the heart throb appeal that the likes of David and Matt brought to the role so I am expecting that the new Doctor if they haven’t gone the gender changing route will definitely be much younger. In today’s broadcasting environment if it goes international they are trying to capture the widest possible spectrum so having just a good actor/actress isn’t enough if the could I bet they would get a Chris Hemsworth in the role just to pull the audience. Yes and I realise I am properly being a tad cynical in thinking this.

     

    #59433
    Anonymous @

    @devilishrobby

    Oh not at all! You’re not being cynical -just pragmatic, which is necessary in a day of “push/pull” audience figures.

    Now you’ll think I’m a twit but who is Chris Hemswoth? 🙂

    (back in 2005/6, I would’ve asked the same about D. Tennant!).

    Puro

    #59435
    Nick @nick

    @thane15 @devilishrobby

    I can only speak for my impression of the UK, but the level of interest shown by other media (reflecting the interest of the population as a whole) is quite a bit lower right now. There was a time when hardly a day went by without Who or David or Matt being mentioned in the media. There’s still a lot of coverage, but not to the same extent.

    @devilishrobby

    Not just at the BBC though. The level of general interest has died away somewhat. I don’t think its got that must watch TV pull at the moment. Before any one complains, TV shows in general have gone down a notch over the last 5 years or so.

     

    #59436
    Nick @nick

    @devillishrobby

    I think its a casting and general audience requirement that there be only one Master at a time. Like with multi-Doctor stories, it was always be the Doctor (current actor) show whilst the other ones will have more secondary starring guest role.

    We dont know yet whether Simm Master is going to retake the role as an infrequent guest star or is just back for this story. Likewise unless we see Missy regenerate on screen, we wont know that she is dead and gone for good. She may come back (or Simm) or it may be a new actor.

    #59437
    Nick @nick

    @janetteb @lisa

    Susan (and the photo in the first episode) resonates with the fan audience, but would mean nothing to the general one. To do it, Moff would need to make the general audience buy into the idea quite quickly and for it to resonate for them. That’s quite a tight rope to walk. That is also the biggest reason he might be doing something else.

    #59439
    Nick @nick

    @all

    My money is on the Doctor having to decide between saving Bill and rescuing/saving Missy and failing one of them. My guess is that the redacted scene from the preview will be something that gives the Doctor a strong potential motive to chose Missy first instead of Bill. The death (if that happens) could be in this episode or the next one (surely a cliff hanger ending for this weeks story ?).

    Since I’m usually wrong on these matters, I’m not putting actual money on this.

    @geoffers

    It seems likely that the bad guy who threatens Missy will be the Simm Master rather than the Cybermen. But given Missy’s link to them, it must also be possible that there is something hidden going on there as well.

    #59440
    MissRori @missrori

    Moffat introduces “World Enough and Time

    @nick  Well, if Bill becomes a Cyberman, she won’t actually be dead.  What I think will happen is that she is wounded early on thanks to Missy’s Doctor-charade going awry, and she’ll need Cyber-conversion to survive.  The Doctor will feel awful that he couldn’t get to her end of the ship sooner, but Bill will understand and he’ll have another awesome cyborg companion!  And at the end of the story the Doctor will find some way to restore Bill to humanity or otherwise set her free (i.e. with Heather Creature).

    Perhaps his love will be strong enough to save her — she’ll feel it so much that she’ll shed all her cyber parts and grow back her fleshly body.  Or he could work some magic with the sonic to turn back the hands of time.  Or she’ll want to stay a cyber-person and have more adventures!  What a wonderful idea for Series 11!

    Moffat says in the above clip that the Doctor and Missy’s friendship will destroy many lives.  But let us doom-sayers  remember that it won’t be the Doctor’s fault.  🙂  He means well, and that’s all that matters in the end.

    So if he has to make a bad choice between Bill and Missy, it can’t be said that he fails one of them.  He would save both if he could, but he can’t, and somebody has to take the short straw.  That’s life.  He’ll mourn.

    #59446
    MissRori @missrori

    @nick, I think Susan can be reintroduced in a way that the audience only familiar with the new series can appreciate.  Perhaps at the end of this story, assuming he’s left bereft and alone for whatever reasons (deaths, goodbyes, etc.), he is sitting on the ground, head in his hands, tears in his eyes, whereupon a woman is seen just entering the frame, standing before him, reaching down with her back to the viewer, and says simply…

    “Grandfather?”

    Cut to To Be Continued…

    See?  Nothing to it!  😉

    Meanwhile…with regards to Bill possibly getting the chop this week, it bothers me that it seems like an unworthy way for her to go out.  The whole season has seen Bill get stronger and smarter as she goes along, to a position of strength and leadership in “The Lie of the Land” and “The Eaters of Light”.  So having her end up a doomed damsel in distress (ala Peri Brown in “Mindwarp”) seems insulting, as if she’s being punished for wanting more from life and taking the risks of traveling with the Doctor.  It could also be read as the Doctor being punished for trying to redeem Missy, but why should he suffer for doing good — especially if it turns out that things go awry because a trap’s been laid for him and her?  Moreover, using Bill’s demise to punish the Doctor demeans her as a person; she becomes a prop (i.e. “women in refrigerators”).

    Perhaps there are red herrings afloat (hallucinations, etc.) and she’ll figure out a way to escape or even reverse her Cyber-conversion on her own, buying time as the other people in the hospital are converted (there seem to be plenty, especially if this is a “genesis” story and the process will be slower).  Perhaps the Cybermen, who at this point are just scared people trying to survive, become her friends to the Doctor’s surprise when he arrives.  This would explain his wondering look in the publicity photos of him with the Cybermen in the ward, along with the shot of her leaning against a doorway in rags with no white gown or Cyber-tech on her chest as in the trailers — because if she’s set up for conversion because she’s fatally wounded when Missy’s playacting goes wrong (which seems most likely), wouldn’t she be attended to immediately?  Otherwise, why would she be converted at all, given she’d object to being operated on and she is not Mondasian?

    So, either she won’t be converted after all, or she will but it will be undone somehow and eventually (maybe before that she’ll be the Doctor’s bodyguard and muscle), or she’ll move on to a better plane of existence with Heather Creature.  Just having her die is not going to cut it for her character arc.

    #59447
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    @thane15 Chris Hemsworth =Thor the current Hollywood beefcake de jour

     

    #59448
    bendubz11 @bendubz11

    One thing I’ve noticed is that Bill’s becoming more aware that CapDoc is prepared to risk his own life to save anybody. In Oxygen she viewed it more as him saving her life, not him sacrificing himself. But then he put his own life on the line in TPatEotW and Bill had to save him, in The Lie of the Land he uses a bit of regen energy just to make sure Bill is on her side, and then tries to stop the Monks before she does. And now in  The Eater of Light, even though the combined forces of the 9th legion and the Gatekeeper are happy to do the job, even though it’s most likely a fixed point in time, CapDoc tries to sacrifice himself again, and Bill and Nardole have to stop him, plus he’s happily discussing the fact he can regenerate if he dies.

    I wonder if Bill will refuse to let the Doctor save her from Cyber conversion, to stop him putting his own life in mortal danger. She’d then be written out as a hero, it would still be possible that she’d be reunited with Heather, and it would be different enough from Hell Bent and Death In Heaven.

    #59449
    ichabod @ichabod

    @thane15  [Peter’s Doc]  I don’t personally see that any “buzz” has gone missing?

    Yes and no, IMO — Tennant was and apparently remains a “heartthrob” for many younger fans (young women in particular), and having been so successful at that with him, I think BBC were dismayed to see some falling off of that “fangirl” fervor with Capaldi (and a lot of venomous commentary from fans linked to that weird Moffat-hatred among some older fans).  Mind you, I think he also drew in a lot of adults following from TToI, many of whom will drift off again if he’s followed by another cute young fellow in more action-y stories; but if you’re trying to build your audience as fast and high as you can with an eye toward the future who’s more important — youngsters, or oldies (out in the wider world, I mean, specifically, where populations are majority young)?  It’s inevitable, really, from a mass-audience, commercial pov.  So I don’t think @devilishrobby is being “cynical” at all, just realistic.

    @nick  Susan (and the photo in the first episode) resonates with the fan audience, but would mean nothing to the general one.

    Yup.  I barely remember her, myself; but I don’t go out of my way to re-watch BG.  Too much else going on (well, books, and new stuff via Netflix, Amazon, et al).

    This is the watering-down (IMO) that happens when creatives hit it this big — numbers tend to over-rule everything else.

     

    #59450
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    On the Susan returns debate in theory it is very easily done and not needing the original actress if working on the premises that Susan was a first regeneration time lady another actress cold stand in as a later incarnation. Of course if Susan is just an ordinary Galliferyan that then becomes more problematic as my understanding and I will happily be corrected is that it it takes exposure to the schism of the time vortex to make a galliferyan into a Timelord.

    #59451
    MissRori @missrori

    @bendubz11  That would be an interesting way to have Bill’s arc end with her death, having it be on her own terms like that.  “A good death is the most any of us can ask for.”  On the other hand, given that this Doctor’s not long for the universe anyway, as the Christmas show follows directly on from “The Doctor Falls”, it might seem kind of pointless for her to give up her life for his.  But how would he be risking his life by saving her from becoming a Cyberman, assuming he makes it there before the process is completed?  He’d just have to fight off a surgeon and nurse from the looks of things, before they slice and dice her.

    #59452
    Nick @nick

    @devilishrobby

    @wolfweed‘s and my discussion regarding Susan came out of several different ideas, but one relates to the casting of a particular actress for the series, who has yet to appear and may well have been redacted from this episodes cast list. It seems likely that the actress must be playing a well known role or it wouldnt have been redacted. Susan seems a strong possibility. Other possibilities can be imagined as well !

    Alternatively Susan could appear as part of the supposed D1 involvement in the Christmas Story (using the team from the Gatiss documentary).

    Was River a timelord ? No ? But she inherited multiple regenerations, which is a primary characteristic. There’s probably more than one way of being exposed to the time vortex than the TL ceremony.

    #59453
    MissRori @missrori

    @nick I do think if Susan were to show up at this point (in either “World Enough and Time” or “The Doctor Falls”) she would have had to regenerate to keep in line with the Big Finish Audios in which she encountered Eight and was played by Carole Anne Ford.

    Meanwhile, I’ve heard whispers that Pearl Mackie will be making a press announcement on Sunday morning, which will probably be to discuss what’s to become of Bill after whatever happens in “World Enough and Time”.  I know she’s already doing that post-screening Q&A with Moffat shortly.

    But if Bill does perish or run away with Heather Creature, how much of “The Doctor Falls” will have to be devoted to the Doctor cleaning up her loose ends on Earth?  I mean, he’ll have to inform Moira and her friends about what’s become of her, get in touch with the St. Luke’s staff, etc.  Come to think of it, what happens regarding his job there and the Vault?

    Actually I did have a bonkers idea — Bill becomes a Cyberman but survives the adventure, and the Doctor goes on to install her in his old position at St. Luke’s!  The amazing cyborg lecturer!  Everyone would love her, she’d have “made it” in life, and they’d just explain that she’s disabled in some way and needs the enhancements.  😀

    #59454
    RorySmith @rorysmith

    Latest spoilery news. Jacobi.

    Or did I miss something?

    #59455
    Nick @nick

    @missrori

    Yes, you’re absolutely right to point out that. it’s certainly possible that what we’ll see in the Christmas story. Doing it in this story would be harder (how did she get to Mondas/Spaceship), but not impossible..

    We know there is a redacted scene early on in the next episode, which doesnt seem to impact the rest of the story that much. This seems a possible place to introduce Susan as an idea (to be paid off by an appearance later ?), but only (?) if the Doctor/Master/Susan link speculation has some truth as opposed to bonkers thinking. If Missy turns out to be Susan directly as a later regeneration or indirectly (the Doctor’s wife/son/daughter who was one of Susan’s parent for example) then that gives the Doctor an added incentive for the redemption to work and also to consider choosing saving/rescuing Missy before Bill. Normally I think the Doctor would choose Bill before the Master (who can look after him/herself anyway), but perhaps less so with Missy.

    If Moff has been straight in his synopsis then it seems the Doctor is in a race against time and someone close (vowed to protect) will die. We know both Bill and Missy will be in jeopardy next episode. That suggests the Doctor has to choose between one or the other to me. Having a Susan realted connection between Missy/Doctor significantly adds to the stakes doesnt it ?

    I’m sure this is wishful thinking on my part. There’s plenty of other options available…

    #59456
    Nick @nick

    @missrori

    The Q&A and any press does seem to point to Bill loosing out this week, but I would think its definitive. However, she’s kept a fairly low media profile, so far as I can tell (@wolfweed ?) and as we move closer to the end of S10 finale,  so some build up to the final episode would be appropriate (especially if Bill dies in that episode).

    #59457
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    @nick my purpose in commenting about Susan’s status as either Time lady or ordinary Gallifreyan it had a bearing on the ability of the production team to cast another actress in the role of Susan. Of course there are other ways of becoming a Time lord/lady, though to be fair River actually paralleled the time lords method in that she had been prenatally exposed to the time vortex by the Ponds travels in the Tardis.

    #59458
    Nick @nick

    @ichabod

    re

    This is the watering-down (IMO) that happens when creatives hit it this big — numbers tend to over-rule everything else.

    While true, I think the BBC is more flexible. I watched the RTD interview (shot early 2017/late 2016) on the South Bank Show with Melvyn Bragg last night (Sky Arts channel nicely repeated it a couple of days ago). One of the things he said was that the BBC had given him complete freedom to do what he wanted with Who, much to his surprise.

    He said that they told him that they knew what they were getting when they choose RTD and were most interested to hear what he wanted to do with the show. I suspect pretty much the same was true for Moff and will be for Chibnall as well. There’s quite a stable of BBC Drama shows driven by auteurs right now (Happy Valley and Line Of Duty come immediately to my mind, but I expect there’s others).

    #59459
    MissRori @missrori

    (Sigh) I do think it’s Bill who gets the metaphorical chop this week.  The Doctor has no hope of reaching her in time with her end of the ship moving years faster than his, and so all he’ll have is her Cyber-self.  But it’ll surely be tender…embracing, crying, forgiving….reassuring…(sniff). But still, she won’t have died on his watch, and he did what he could.  He kept his promise.  They’ll have each other, and fight evil!

    #59460
    ichabod @ichabod

    @nick  Well, that’s a brighter prospect, then!  Thanks for the info.

    #59462
    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave

    I think it was @jimthefish who said that Bill either dying or being turned into a Cyberperson, or both, seems a bit too much like Danny Pink. Unless, of course, the Doctor decides it’s not going to happen twice on his watch and finds a way to reverse it.

    (Bonkers thought: We know there are going to be current versions of the Cybermen along with the Mondasian versions. We don’t know whose side the modern versions are on. Could Bill be saved by the intervention of…the Danny Pink version of a Cyberman? Who comes back from the Nethersphere somehow? Now that would be an unexpected cameo.)

    As for Missy and the Master being in the same room, I cannot think of any resolution except one that turns out very bad for Missy. It may well be that it plays on the irony of Missy turning “guid” means that she loses her ability to outwit the Master. Which would mean that the Doctor would feel responsible for losing his friend–ie, the very act of recovering his friend as his friend leads to him losing his friend.

    #59463
    MissRori @missrori

    DoctorWhoTV.co.uk has brought out their advance review.  It’s pretty positive, and they especially liked the Saxon Master buildup and reveal, and Simm’s performance…although it would have been better had the previews not spoiled his presence in the first place.  It also is a showcase for Missy and poor Bill, who gets put through the wringer.  The hospital scenes are favorably compared to “The Empty Child” and “Dark Water”.  Capaldi, on the other hand, is great but has a smaller role than usual.

    With regards to twists and character fates…well, there are big ones!  But the critic is worried that they could be undone in “The Doctor Falls”, given what Moffat’s done in previous finales.  If he follows through this time, then it could be one of the all-time finales!

    BlogtorWho was also extremely positive, but barely had any details except there are shocks and scares aplenty.

    #59464
    lisa @lisa

    I was wondering about Missy and the Cyberman army she wanted to give the Doctor in “Dark Water’.

    What I’m wondering is if  this Cybermen idea came to her from the Master in this episode ?

    The reason  this occurred to me is because in one of the promo pictures the Master is holding a tool

    and I cant decide if its a sonic screwdriver or a laser scalpel which  occasionally was mentioned

    in some previous Doctor stories.  If this is the scalpel then my guess is that the Master has been up

    to something with the Cybermen.  So does this indicate anything about Missy’s quest to be

    good and something goes wrong which is why  the Doctor falls?

    But Missy gets one of her clever ideas?  She still wants her friend back.  The “Dark Water episode?

    This is all a huge  hypothesizing leap and   probably not.  I thought Dr. Skarosa was Davros and

    that didn’t work out either.

    #59465
    Wellicanbake @wellicanbake

    Personally I’m expecting some sort of scene where Missy realises only she can stop the master but can’t kill him. Maybe like the eaters of light locked in an eternal conflict. And I’m expecting the doctor to say something like “you can’t there must be another way” this will be followed by some sort of phrase by Missy like “I’ve spent my whole life fighting my dark side at least now I have something to hit”

    #59466
    MissRori @missrori

    @wellicanbake  That would be pretty great.

    And should she beg the Doctor for her life again, he’ll say, “I could never kill in cold blood…take it away, Cyber-Bill!  Remember, aim for both hearts like you did to me!”

    ZAP!  She wouldn’t know what hit her and audiences around the world cheer!  River would surely approve!  😀

    #59467
    MissRori @missrori

    The Radio Times loved “World Enough and Time” — dark, dark, dark after a funny opening stretch.  Something heartbreaking happens to separate Bill from the Doctor and company, and “We end [the episode] on an appalling final revelation asking ourselves some big questions about more than one key character.”  Ooooooooooh!

    I’m thinking poor old Bill will be out of those questions, having suffered enough, but who nose?  There’s still the Doctor, Nardole, Missy, and the Master either way!

    Radio Times preview of “World Enough and Time”

    #59468
    wolfweed @wolfweed

    #59469
    Anonymous @

    @missrori

    I think I have to bow out of the Spoilers, really, you do like to tell me ALL the stuff other critics say  🙂  -your choice I guess, and best of luck to you….I’m sure others like it but jeepers “the critics” are frequently twits who suggest “given what Moffat’s done before he might screw up the ending…..” which isn’t really news or spoilers, innit? I see critics all over cyberspace and they aint all that edercated…..;)

    <must unclick notifications>

    But yes, Spoilers are good places -just not for me and Thane15  anyway!

    Puro…xo

    #59471
    MissRori @missrori

    So I was chatting with a sweet friend today and she had an interesting theory about “The Doctor Falls”, given what we know about what happens in “World Enough and Time”…

    She thinks that, even with CyberBill and contrary to what Moff and co. have to say about what’s to come, it’s going to have an “Everybody lives!” ending. ???

    She rationalizes that as Moffat’s (and Capaldi’s) last season finale, he’s going to want to go out on a happy note instead of a major bummer with “The Doctor Falls”.  It’s just that he’s raising the stakes so, so, so high that we viewers won’t be able to figure out how the Doctor can save the day without major loss.

    Well, it would make the transition to the Christmas show easier…what do you all think?  🙂

    #59473
    CountScarlioni @countscarlioni

    I blundered into a clip of Missy dancing with the Master so I gave up trying to avoid spoilers, and went ahead and read the SM interview about the episode in the DWM.

    SM goes on about time dilation and this concept, assuming SM is not fibbing, will surely play a part. With a 400 mile long spaceship near a black hole, time will be running at a different rate at the top end compared to the bottom end (top and bottom relative to the black hole). This presumably opens up various timey-wimey possibilities, and explains why the spaceship is so long (to get very notable differences in rates).

     

     

     

     

     

     

    #59479
    MissRori @missrori

    Yeah, he ain’t fibbing this time — it’s vital to the plot @countscarlioni.  Bill gets stuck at the end where time moves faster, and the Doctor must reach her from the end where it moves slower.  Every minute passing for him…is a third of a year for her.

    #59482
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    <p style=”text-align: left;”>Now that’s just plain stupid of Moffat the theory of time dilation effect of a black holes corona just wouldn’t be that great from where I am understanding this ship is and 400 miles is just not a big enough distance. Hell  to get the sort of theoretical time differation they are talking about I would imagine the end of the ship will have to pactically be sitting on the event horizonwhich would mean the ship would be being torn apart, unless they have Gallifreyan technology that is…..</p>

    #59487
    MissRori @missrori

    Well, the synopsis says it is indeed trapped in the event horizon of the black hole.  But I agree, it should have been ripped apart by that point.  But who knows what the tech on that thing is….and with the Master(s) involved anything’s possible.  Could it be the whole crisis the Doctor picks out was a deliberately set trap?

    #59489
    wolfweed @wolfweed

    #59490
    Nick @nick

    @devilishrobby @missrori

    If you want to let the real world get in the way, matter is physically stretched out and dissociated as it approaches the event horizon. This would be especially true for a 400 hundred mile long object, the one end would be seeing very significant physical differences  from the end closest to the back hole. All objects including individual atoms (i think) are eventually ripped apart. As matter is subject to intense gravitational forces and particles collide into each other, it also gets incredibly hot through frictional heating and eventually starts to generate x-ray radiation as a result.

    #59492
    wolfweed @wolfweed

    Spoilers for the episode are now flooding twitter. Time to hide in a cave until Saturday night.

    cavey

    #59493
    wolfweed @wolfweed

    One more for the road…

    #59496
    janetteB @janetteb

    the argument that Susan cannot be brought back because new viewers won’t be familiar with the character doesn’t really wash. Any writer worth their salt, (and as a writer S.M is worth is weight in saffron) can introduce a character in such as way as to explain that character to a new audience. After all characters are introduced in every episode and if the writer is good, which they mostly are, those “red shirt” characters come alive. Ever since the reboot it has been established that the Doctor had family. He refers to being a father on more than one occasion. He has “Dad skills”. The Doctor’s family has become a little bit of a Chekhov’s Duck. Plenty of characters from BG (before gap) Who have been revived in AG Who. Rassilon for instance. Kate Lethbridge-Stewart for instance is a strong and interesting character in her own right but incidentally the daughter of a favourite BG character. Also these days, given the ready availability of old stories many new fans have watched the first story at least.

    If Susan does return then I would expect it to be in the Christmas Special however rather than in the next two episodes. I expect we have a lot of dark stuff to come, or maybe “bright” would be a better word thinking of the trailer which I finally got to see today, clinical, hospital, nightmare kind of bright.

    cheers

    Janette

    #59503
    MissRori @missrori

    Yes, I don’t think Susan will arrive sooner than Christmas, unless there’s a reeeeeeeeaaaallllly dark twist in this finale.  There’s just too much going on as is — 2 Masters teaming up with 3 generations of Cybermen, the Doctor having to stop them from conquering the universe, Bill’s Cyber-conversion and what becomes of her from there (She becomes a superhero?  Doctor clones her a duplicate of her old body?  Power of love cures her?  Doctor does a mercy kill?  Doctor turns back the clock for her?), Nardole’s fate, probably resolution of the mystery of the Heather Creature, possibly some major revelations about the Master’s doings between “The End of Time” and Series 8, Missy’s final redemption or fall, the Doctor facing a decision in extremis one more time, and whatever leads into the Christmas episode.  Add to that the fact that Part One is mostly just Doctor, Missy, and Nardole trying to rescue Bill, Bill waiting for him ala “The Girl Who Waited”, and establishing the Mondasian Cybermen backstory and the Saxon!Master’s presence, and most of the big action is clearly being saved for Part Two.

    Radio Times has a more detailed summary and cast list of “The Doctor Falls” up now — the Doctor is specifically determined to save the few remaining humans on the ship, including the Samantha Spiro character, from being converted into Cybermen.  (Looks like only four of those souls get to speak, which doesn’t bode well…)

    #59505
    wolfweed @wolfweed

    I know I said I was going…

     

    The old ‘Disappearing Wikipedia Cast Credit’ trick is being used again. This time saying that Richard Mylan is the new Doctor.

    mylan

    ‘Fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can’t get fooled again.’

    #59507
    Sjk1000 @sjk1000

    My money is on Peter Capaldi and Michelle Gomez switching. Capaldi would make a stupendously magnificent Master, Gomez a brilliant female Doctor, despite me never ever thinking a female Doctor would work. Is this why they both said they’d leave the roles at the same time, yet Capaldi is still in the Christmas special after the regeneration

    #59508
    Nick @nick

    @sjk1000

    Hi there. I think most of us are under the impression the regeneration happens in the Christmas special. Do you think its in the final part of the series ?

    #59509
    Sjk1000 @sjk1000

    @nick

    On Jo Whiley’s show, or Graham Norton’s, can’t remember which, I’m sure Capaldi said that he would be appearing in the Christmas special and that would be post-regeneration. He wouldn’t explain how that would be possible in the interview.

    #59510
    Devilishrobby @devilishrobby

    @sjk1000 that’s easily explained they just do some kind of conversation that they did with Clara. Where she had a conversation on the tardis phone with Matt Smith at the end of the first episode with Capaldi where he persuades her to stay with the new Doc.

    #59511
    lisa @lisa

    @sjk1000     @nick

    I saw that too and for me it means he starts to regenerate at the end of “The Doctor Falls”

    My hunch is that the Xmas episode will be another ‘dreamlike’  knock off again minus Santa.

    Probably the beginning of the regeneration in the 12th episode and completing it at Xmas?

    Same director and writer thru episodes 11-Xmas so there has to be definite  continuity

    but they said also that its going to be a different sort of regeneration.  So maybe the strategy is

    I think  to keep everyone hanging on for months instead of it all happening instantly?

     

     

     

    #59512
    blenkinsopthebrave @blenkinsopthebrave

    @sjk1000

    My money is on Peter Capaldi and Michelle Gomez switching.

    That is a great idea! I have long been hoping that Michelle Gomez would become the Doctor (perhaps because The Doctor does not save her, and his parting gift is to give the new Doctor her appearance in memory of their friendship) but your idea of an actual switch is inspired! Whatever they actually do, I cannot imagine it could be better than that.

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