The Next Doctor
7 June 2013 at 19:45 #12006Anonymous @
@bluesqueakpip – I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again: you are the poet, and I am the mechanic. 😀
Didn’t you just think her answers were far more cagey than necessary? That is why I could never be an actor myself. That kind of lying – especially when you know such interviews will be replayed ad nauseum once the announcement is [finally!] made – is sheer effrontery at its best.7 June 2013 at 19:47 #120077 June 2013 at 19:48 #12008Anonymous @
WilburManot – are you for real? Nice trolling 😆 Erroll Flynn as a so-called ‘real man’!
“My 2 sons feel the same and my wife, who is also a woman”
… are you implying that your sons are female?!
Thanks, I needed a laugh this evening as much as if not more than last night.7 June 2013 at 19:51 #12009Anonymous @
@pedant – sorry, I wasn’t impugning your issue with a female Doctor; I thought you raised an important point. To wit, that we have seen all of @juniperfish ‘s Doctorish character traits already in River Song, and it caused me to think what an enormously difficult task The Moff has with writing a female Doctor who isn’t simply a retread of River.7 June 2013 at 19:59 #12010Arkleseizure @arkleseizure
I imagine somebody’s already said this, but I haven’t had time to read all the posts, but the thought just hit me: The Doctor was revived in Let’s Kill Hitler by River giving him her regenerative ability. If he has his regenerative ability from River, then his next incarnation being female would make sense. Otherwise, eleven male Doctors, five male Masters, four male Borusas and two female Romanas? No. A sudden sex change could be nonsense.
Even River had three female regenerations, which makes me think a random regenerative sex-change is even more silly than I had before. But if he’s using River’s remaining regenerations, then it would make sense: her next incarnations would be female, so now they’re his, they still are. So if the next Doctor is female, then I would accept it, provided they use an explanation like that, and not just “because it is”.
To conclude: if the next Doctor is a woman, then I want a good in-universe reason to justify it. The few throwaway lines we’ve had so far are not good reasons. River would be.
I still don’t want Sue Perkins, mind.7 June 2013 at 20:00 #12011
I am not sexist, but I must say that, if the next Doctor is a woman, I will never watch another episode of DW. My 2 sons feel the same and my wife, who is also a woman, is in complete agreement with us.
O RLY?7 June 2013 at 20:05 #12012Anonymous @
@pedant – don’t feed (i.e. directly link to) the troll! 😀7 June 2013 at 20:11 #12013Anonymous @
Arkleseizure – you’re exactly right, an in-universe reason is absolutely important. No tokenism, no ‘just because we can’, no pandering to ‘current cultural sensibilities’, no throw-away dialogue of past episodes.
If a definite hook can be found – like your positing of River’s regenerations infusing the Doctor – then that is what could and should make sense. And that kind of logic allows for a female Doctor to regenerate into a male (and thence into a female) ad infinitum – because we will always have River’s regnerations brewing in the mix. It doesn’t even require female-to-female regenerations, or any other gender-to-gender combinations; because the brew is always stirring.7 June 2013 at 20:27 #12014
@Shazzbot – to be an actor is to be a professional liar. As the old acting joke goes:
Sincerity is the key. Once you can fake that, you’ve got it made.
And truthfully, JLC’s interview technique might apply equally if someone else has already been cast. So long as she keeps firmly in mind that Matt is now the previous Doctor, the actor (m or f) under contract is the current Doctor, and that she has no idea who the next Doctor is, her conscience is serene. 🙂
Another good reason for a female Doctor (in-story). The Doctor has been constantly informed that his future is ‘dark and terrible’. The Storm, the Valeyard, the Beast. And that future has been consistently described as ‘he’ or ‘his’.
With the appearance of John Hurt’s Doctor, there’s now the suspicion that this future is as close as his next regeneration. When the Eleventh Doctor regenerates, it would be his twelfth regeneration – exactly the time when, it was said, he would become the ‘Valeyard’.
In Journey ttCotTARDIS the Doctor realises that they need to disrupt the timeline to stop everyone dying; he needs to make sure he doesn’t put his hand to his face. Possibly he might realise that, to make sure that the ‘dark and terrible’ future doesn’t happen, he needs to disrupt the timeline again – to make sure his future is not ‘he’ and ‘him, but ‘she’ and ‘her’.7 June 2013 at 20:45 #120157 June 2013 at 22:47 #12022
Crazy Captions 8 requires your considered input…7 June 2013 at 22:55 #12023
…as we all hope, the next Doctor is of the male gender…
Is there anything else you can confirm that we all hope?7 June 2013 at 23:04 #12024Craig @craigEmperor
@WilburManot Please give me a reason not to delete you in 24 hours time.
A cogent argument would be be preferred. If I don’t get one, you’re dust.7 June 2013 at 23:42 #12028Anonymous @
Reluctant as I am to feed das Trolle, would a female Doctor really be enough for you to stop watching? Without giving said actor a fair chance at the role? And you really consider that reasonable behaviour? No wonder your alleged children seem a trifle confused.8 June 2013 at 00:01 #12031
A feminist who doesn’t want a female Dr? A considered argument can be found here:
Ms. Budd has a point, though maybe it’s more about a general problem with all of our male heroes?8 June 2013 at 00:13 #12032Miapatrick @miapatrick
re: troll, I’m tempted to assume this is an attempt at humour, given the Rock Hudson/Captain Jack comments. The problem is, this ‘humour’ has rather homophobic aspects, i.e. the ‘joke’ that the next doctor should be a ‘real man’ from a persona that apparently has no idea of the men in question’s sexual orientation, hinges on an irony that someone would consider those actors to be ‘real men’. Being gay doesn’t make anyone less of a man or a woman. So, in my opinion, the joke fails, and makes the earlier Flynn comment also distasteful, given the statutory rape allegations, allegations of Nazi sympathies, the fact he was probably referring to his suggested bisexuality only makes it worse.
I think his alleged children, as well as his ‘also female’ wife should be worried. But again, I think this is a persona, and a joke. One in very poor taste. Considering the role the feeling of discomfort plays in humour, it’s all the more significant that the joke is also unfunny.8 June 2013 at 00:24 #12033
That reminds me – Troll Hunter is a great film but be sure to watch it in Norwegian (not the dub)…8 June 2013 at 00:39 #12035Anonymous @
@wolfweed — thanks for the link. Quite liked that and I think that part of me tends to agree. Both The Doctor and I suppose Sherlock offer a male role model that rather flies in the face of the more geezery types that are more prevalent at the moment….8 June 2013 at 00:43 #12036
25 minutes in, you can find a (rather daft) little chat about who should replace Matt in Dr Who.
Worth checking out, just to hear David Mitchell call William Hartnell ‘A doddery old twat.’8 June 2013 at 02:12 #12037
There’s a rumour going around that the BBC will announce the new Doctor tomorrow evening…
If it’s true I think I’d prefer it to be Domhnall Gleeson… He of Dredd & Black Mirror (& Harry Potter).8 June 2013 at 02:34 #12038
Here’s a clip of Domhnall in fetching attire…8 June 2013 at 08:45 #12039Craig @craigEmperor
@wolfweed Another great scoop for British journalism, another low blow for them as well if it’s true.
What happened to everyone keeping a secret for the fun of it? Or just because of ethics and good manners? Sometimes I wish life were more like Anna Karenina.
Still, I hope it’s not that smug twat Dominic Cooper, that may actually stop me watching. Saw him first on stage in The History Boys and haven’t been able to watch him since without thinking violent thoughts, and I’m a pacifist.
Sorry, where are my manners! 😀8 June 2013 at 08:53 #12040Anonymous @
@wolfweed and @craig — I think it’s a shame if the Beeb are doing it because they’ve been gazumped again. But part of me will be glad to put an end to the endless stream of increasingly idiotic articles on the subject (Paris Jackson anyone?). I don’t think the issue of a new Who has ever been the cause of such a critical mass of publicity as it has this time. I bet next time they’ll turn it into a talent contest where Colin Baker, Ian Levine and David Tennant judge the thousands of inappropriate hopefuls.
Can’t see it being any of the three mentioned in the article. They’re all too high profile I reckon and don’t strike me as if they’d be in it for the long haul.8 June 2013 at 09:54 #12045
Hey I suggested Domnhall Gleeson a while back. What with our new high profile site, you don’t think people have been getting their info from us?
Dominic Cooper does, I agree, come across as smug, plus he’s another who was in the History Boys. Surely they can look a bit outside of that cast?8 June 2013 at 10:18 #120468 June 2013 at 10:23 #12047
Ms Budd’s points are fatuous nonsense and factually inaccurate
A comprehensive rebuttal that doesn’t even mention Dr Who: http://aidanmoher.com/blog/featured-article/2013/05/we-have-always-fought-challenging-the-women-cattle-and-slaves-narrative-by-kameron-hurley/8 June 2013 at 10:26 #12048CraigNixon @craignixon
If they have to announce because they’ve een gazumped, I really hope Moff has just convinced a mate to pretend to be the new Dr and they’re just lying for the reveal!8 June 2013 at 11:57 #12050
@pedant I thought that Ms. Hurley’s piece was pretty good. Anyone who knows some true history will be aware that Womens’ contribution to the World has been disgracefully rewritten – and still it goes on.
Inequality remains but the imbalance is gradually improving – and it works both ways – for instance, men are becoming acceptable as nursery workers because one man took action & others followed. We are mostly sheep who follow & this may be an argument for positive discrimination.
Most plebs out there probably don’t know that a Matriarchal society was usurped by a Patriarchal one which has desperately clung to power by dismissing women as ‘the fairer sex’.
And when we say we don’t want a female role model who just acts like a male, we’d do well to remember that women were often more ferocious warriors than the men.
However, I think that Ms. Budd has a point. And I can’t find any factual inaccuracies. What are they?8 June 2013 at 12:17 #12051
Well, what do you know? Some journalist must have made that rumour up! What a shocking surprise!8 June 2013 at 12:40 #12053
That’s a relief (that it isn’t to be announced). It’s summer and the silly season may at least focus on Who.
To confirm this, in the land of you really can’t make this up, political polling company YouGov has completed some invaluable general public research into attitudes to Doctor Who, important traits for whoever gets cast, and just who is the least and most favourite Doctor.
Poor Sylvester.8 June 2013 at 13:10 #12055Anonymous @
@phaseshift — I doubt there will be an announcement today. But it won’t be because they haven’t found someone yet (Rule No. 1 and all that) but more because they’ll definitely want to milk all this free publicity the show is getting for a little bit longer. They’re now managing to raise the show’s media profile without having to do any of that trivial actually bloody doing something for the anniversary year business.
Bearing in mind that they won’t be able to keep anything a secret any longer once the cameras start rolling in August, I suspect that we’ll get an announcement in about a month’s time….
But I really do want them to just get on with it. If I see another ‘>insert celebrity whose name has just popped into journo’s head< set to be the 12th Doctor’ article, I shall thkweam and thkweam….8 June 2013 at 13:21 #12056
A majority of Britons and half of women
@phaseshift – I’m not British! I’m just a woman!
You really can’t make it up, can you? 😆8 June 2013 at 13:37 #12057
once the cameras start rolling in August
I’m more interested in the point that they’ve allowed Matt Smith to have that very drastic haircut. Either they’re thinking a wig, or – bonkers theorising point here – is his Christmas Special appearance signalling a drastic change? Either in the Eleventh, or that he’s not playing the Eleventh? So that they saw the haircut as part of a ‘character-based costume change’?
Hmmm… bonkers theory coming up. That buzz cut could be easily adapted to an American style crew cut. Did Rory and Amy adopt their grandson?
Matt Smith’s been consistent in stating that he’s booked for the Christmas Special, so one thing we will see in August is if he’s in any of the location filming. Or if he was doing a Rule One by meaning that he appears in the regeneration sequence at the beginning. 🙂8 June 2013 at 14:48 #12060
Brilliant isn’t it? It’s even funnier that I got to the results through an article in the New Statesman that profiles the choices by political affiliation (wrongly in some cases).
It’s at that point, and I quite understand where you are coming from @jimthefish, that you realise that this is pure media silly season. Politics is slowing down for the recess, the weather is hitting those unheard of temperatures of the mid-20s and the media goes “bat-shit crazy”.
Last year they rejoiced in a State silly season with the Jubilee year and Olympics, this year is Doctor Who! I was going to write a piss-takey blog post on the results of the survey pointing out that 31% of the nation having an opinion makes it officially more exciting that who gets to run our police forces (low 20%), and the 1999 European election (29% turnout).
Then I realised it would be a lot of work, and I’m feeling pretty warm and lazy.8 June 2013 at 15:29 #12062
this year is Doctor Who!
@phaseshift – put it this way: if Jenna Coleman isn’t the new Doctor, then I really hope her agent is on the phone getting some extra money out of the BBC. Because the poor woman’s just found herself ‘the face of Doctor Who’ until the new Doctor’s announced. And the leak means that the gap between ‘previous Doctor retiring’ and ‘new Doctor announced’ is going to be several months longer than they hoped.
She is going to be doing a lot of interviews.8 June 2013 at 16:46 #12066
Yes – I think it will be going above and beyond the call of duty for Jenna at the moment and until the next Doctor is announced.
I watched her meeting with the Queen yesterday and was astonished when she said that the Queen was just about the only person who hadn’t asked her who the next Doctor would be.
Mrs Phaseshift had to remind me that, as a die hard fan, she would have been briefed on such an important matter of state during one of her regular meetings with the Prime Minister (“I regret to inform Your Majesty that black smoke still rises above the offices of BBC Cardiff….”) 😀8 June 2013 at 22:29 #12070waltzinblack @waltzinblack
Im setting up a Facebook page to vote for Richard Osman to be the new Doctor. At 6’4″he would be a great Doctor.9 June 2013 at 01:30 #12077Arkleseizure @arkleseizure
@bluesqueakpip: I have to say this, and please don’t be offended, but I really hope you’re wrong about JLC. Don’t get me wrong: I think she’s great, but I really want a new face to be the twelfth. Male or female, just as long as it’s someone who’s had no part in Doctor Who before (or a minor one at most). This is purely irrational, I admit, but the memory of my childhood being ruined by Maxil being promoted to Doctor still haunts me. I really don’t want it happen to Clara too, not least because I don’t want to be able to blame her if it goes wrong. I’d rather Strax.9 June 2013 at 09:35 #12078
@arkleseizure – nothing wrong with wanting the next Doctor to be someone new and exciting. I will be fine with anyone who isn’t a white male with floppy brown hair. If the next Doctor is a white male with floppy brown hair, he’s going to need to be bloody good – that said, Matt Smith convinced me the second he stuck his head out of that crashed TARDIS. 😀
On the bright side – if my bonkers theory did turn out to be a case of ‘even a stopped clock is right twice a day’: Commander Maxil’s job was to shoot and arrest the Doctor. Clara was born to save the Doctor. 🙂 It’s a much better omen.
I’m not sure it’d be a ‘promoted Companion’, though. Going off into bonkers theoryland: the story arc would be that, this time, the Doctor has unwittingly become their own Companion. If you think about it: adventurous, wants to travel, willing to leave everything behind to go off on possibly dangerous adventures – the Doctor does have exactly the kind of character that you’d look for in a Companion. All you need is some kind of weird circumstance where neither their past or future self knows that ‘future-me’ is the Doctor.
Or, the Companion taken on board is a mirror image of the Doctor – Clara-from-Blackpool is a Claricle and Clara-Prime is and always was a future Doctor.
From the point of view of JLC’s casting – if she did turn out to be the next Doctor then, given that this arc is clearly part of a regeneration sequence, it’s been planned since she stepped onto set. So in that case, one of two things happened.
One: they were looking for a female Doctor and hid it by officially casting for the new Companion.
Two: they were genuinely looking for the next Companion – and when JLC walked in they said ‘she’s not the Companion. She’s the bloody Doctor’.9 June 2013 at 18:17 #12089
A little bit of Rory Kinnear, who’s so definitely the next Dr, that the Bookies closed their books…9 June 2013 at 18:28 #12092
Hmmm, I’m coming round to the idea. In a reverse of my position earlier on, perhaps not being ‘lead man’ material might be a good thing. It’s a bit tiring having the companions/assistants swooning all over the place.
It’s odd because last time I was convinced that the Moff would go young and cast someone like Ben Whishaw. Indeed he did go young, but cast another floppy-haired young actor. Although I’ve not posted this name before, the last couple of days I got it into my head they were going to cast someone like Rafe Spall, ie an acting son of a more famous actor. Instead it’s looking like Rory Kinnear.
If only I could get my predictions a little bit closer, I’d be down that betting shop…9 June 2013 at 19:54 #12098Juniperfish @juniperfish
I was coming round to @bluesqueakpip‘s theory that the next Doc is indeed Jenna Coleman and starting to get excited about it.
But, now @chickenelly ‘s Rory Kinnear clip has given me pause (damn you, you top-hatted bird) because it does seem credible Moff’s mate and writing partner Mark Gattis is shaping up as “most likely” for next showrunner The Crimson Horror was really good Who. And Kinnear has positive previous form working with Gattis…
I did see their version of HG Wells and enjoyed it, although Gattis is a better writer than he is an actor methinks.
Alas, I still regret the throw-away possibilities of Oswin-Dalek as a companion. Imagine the Doctor sitting down to boiled eggs and toast in a little café somewhere, Oswin Dalek cracking the shells for him with her sucker. Pandemonium breaks out (naturally), the Doctor brushes crumbs off Oswin-Dalek and tries to reassure all the petrified folk he hasn’t lost it, but explaining that all he sees is a pretty young woman in a red dress doesn’t help (of course).
I suppose it could get old quickly, but it could also be full of fun and pathos.
“A Time Lord and a dalek walked into a bar…”
OK, it’s fan fiction… <retires under a rock>9 June 2013 at 22:09 #12101Lula @lula
The news of Rory Kinnear has made its way to the States–but the source is The Telegraph, and I’ve no idea of their reliability. Would it be similar to The Sun? (Aka The Enquirer over here, which is complete crap!) Or is The Telegraph a legit news source?9 June 2013 at 22:47 #12102
The Telegraph is one of the broadsheets here in the UK – that is not a tabloid like The Sun. A bit like The Times, although ironically that paper is owned by Rupert Murdoch who also owns The Sun. It has a right wing viewpoint, as opposed to the Grauniad which is left leaning.
Generally the stories are legit in the Telegraph, I can’t recall the paper ever getting sued over stories they’ve run in the past, but in this case I have no idea. The report is beginning to appear in the other UK papers (ie The Independent & the Daily Express) but these are clearly taken from the Telegraph too.9 June 2013 at 22:54 #12103Miapatrick @miapatrick
@juniperfish– I think the many many possibilities of a Clara-Dalek companion is probably one of Moffit’s gifts to the internet. It’s right out there now- not quite, but a whisper away from cannon. Almost as though he had the idea, decided it wouldn’t quite float for the official program, but really liked it.
I personally think the doctor would avoid ordering eggs around Clalek, (as I have randomly decided to call her,) because ‘that’s the sort of thing that sets her off’. And any time he declares ‘nobody dies’, its not a mission statement, or a fate tempting expression of hope, but more an instruction to Clalek. ‘Nobody dies’ (cross glare) this time.’9 June 2013 at 23:00 #12104thommck @thommck
Just have to stick my oar in and say there is no chance in Gallifrey that Rory Kinnear will be the next doctor. He always plays the straight man/civil servant types.
It is hardly an inspiring choice for the next Doctor.
The Telegraph are obviously loving the fuss they’ve caused from their made up story which has no substance whatsoever.9 June 2013 at 23:29 #12105JWalker @jwalker
I read something online–and I do wish that I could remember where it was so that I could give proper attribution–which stated that while the argument for a female Doctor is an understandable one, and worthy of consideration, the fact is that The Doctor is one of the very few action adventure heroes out there who consistently attempts to solve his problems in a non-violent manner, and is therefore an important role model for young men in the face of the massive numbers of “Let’s punch/shoot our way out of this situation” male heroes out there.9 June 2013 at 23:38 #12106overunder @jamesunderscore
Last time I saw Rory Kinnear in something, he was buggering a pig in an episode of Black Mirror. I’m not sure I’d ever be able to get that image out of my head if he was the new Doc’.9 June 2013 at 23:39 #12107ScaryB @scaryb
@juniperfish @miapatrick Rolling on the floor at “Clalek”!! (and the idea of her and the Dr going into a teashop (is that similar to a bull in a china shop?). Cracking eggshells with her plunger indeed!)
They’d better come up with something damn fine to be better than that 😉
Re the Telegraph etc rumour – this time last week the Sunday Times was leading on its front page with the story it was going to be a woman! The fact that Ladbrokes have closed their books on it has given the Rory Kinnear story a bit of credibility (leaks from the BBC anyone??) and all the media know that a Dr Who story is click bait so no harm to them in running it.
It’s certainly an unsual alleged statement from “our source at the BBC” along the lines that RK would be perfect choice and he’s considering it. Kind of undermines anyone else as automatic second choice if RK declines.
Whoever it is will be amazing! No matter what they’ve done before.
PS @phaseshift Laughed at the stats you posted yesterday – good example of a bad survey – esp the question that suggested approx 20% of people thought it was important the Dr is English actor. Comsidering that 2 of them have been Scottish!10 June 2013 at 00:00 #12110ScaryB @scaryb
@jwalker Re the Dr should stay male because of a lack of non action-hero male role models – that angle’s been taken by quite a few commentators in the media. Although you can apply the same argument in reverse – there are so few female role models, esp in science/scifi/action fields. Girls have traditionally had to do the “gender-bending mind switch thing ” (copyright @juniperfish) in order to idenitfy themselves as the Dr (or most other lead characters in action drama/sci fi). That again is tied in with being male as being aspirational and being female something to be looked down on (tomboys OK, boys doing female role-play is “sissy”) ie it’s OK for girls to do it, because they will, but you can’t expect that boys will imagine themselves as a female character no matter how inspirational – see Juniperfish’s longer post above (#11994). Maybe the Doctor needs to become hermaphrodite to satisfy everyone.
Or maybe TV & film cos could commission more dramas with a variety of role models!
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