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28 September 2015 at 19:54 #43722
Some preliminary thoughts:
I am wondering, too, why the Doctor didn’t retrieve the sonic when he went back.
Laughed out loud at “the only other chair on Skaro”. Oh Moffat. Stealing your own joke from The Curse of the Fatal Death. (That had sewers in it too. Must been nostalgic that day 😉 )
@blenkinsopthebrave you know, it COULD be that the Doctor told Davros about Gallifrey still being out there knowing full well he’d try to find it. Maybe he’s manipulating Davros into helping him find it.
@bendubz11 you missed a hybrid: half human half Time Lord in the tv movie. I’m kidding. I’m KIDDING! Pretend you didn’t read that.
One more: I’m quite sure the Doctor wouldn’t let it happen, but… wouldn’t it be awful if he really can’t get her out of the Dalek, and the rest of her time with him is really her insIde it and she dOesn’t know it? And ultimately she ends up in the Assylum thinking her name is Oswin. Ok, forget I wrote that, too. I wish my back space key was working. :O
28 September 2015 at 15:14 #43702@blenkinsopthebrave. Ah, thanks. But no! Keep yourself hatted. I was not the first to suggest the hand mines would be the target.
However, I am pleased to say I retained my zero percent average in predictions. That the Doctor’s compassion is what made Davros who he is because he resented living. Totally not! Lol.
25 September 2015 at 13:43 #43407Aw shucks, thanks. 🙂 But I can only enjoy it until tomorrow when I turn out to be wrong again. Lol
But Moffat’s Doctor DOES say to the Weeping Angels that you never ever put him in a trap “if you value your continued existence. ”
Of course he may have been bluffing…
24 September 2015 at 18:48 #43363Thank you so much for tracking that down.
Pity it’s such an un-bonkers thing, though. 😀
For a second I thought I had something!
24 September 2015 at 17:34 #43357Could have been a Gallifeyan Wedding Anklet. 😉
Not sure what, but just think I saw something there.
I’ll try to find a link to a screen shot.
24 September 2015 at 16:24 #43354Can someone more clever than me find/post a screen grab of Missy getting zapped by the Dalek?
I want to say I saw something outlined around her ankle. Like a hidden vortex manipulator?
23 September 2015 at 15:25 #43309@blenkensopthebrave
Interesting point. Though he has done such things in the past. The Vervoids for instance.
Need to rethink it.
But I’m not sure it changes the larger point: by whatever means he saves Davros, his (Davros’ s) resentment for it stands.
23 September 2015 at 15:20 #4330823 September 2015 at 15:18 #43307Regarding the Confession Dial. (And I’m finding the parenthetical “of Rassilon” to be hysterical, btw):
I agree that the line is more likely a pointer in the dial. Like it’s counting down to something.
However, I would like to offer a Moffat-esque use of “The Doctor’s Will”
Not will like a death document. Will like desire, wish, or power. Like “my will be done”. It is a device to do his bidding in some way.
23 September 2015 at 15:10 #43305Regarding Missy’s flippant “I’m back”:
This is a cheeky Moffat joke. He has said in interviews that he used to love the way the Master could die horribly one week and be back the next with nothing more than “I escaped”.
He’s doing a little homage to that.
23 September 2015 at 15:06 #43303I’ve spent all this time reading just to get caught up! What great thoughts here, everyone!
Regarding Boy Davros, I want to agree with most everyone to a point and then diverge wildly.
Of course the Doctor does not go back to kill the boy.
Yes he exterminates the handmines instead.
However…
THIS is just fulfilling destiny as it always was. As Davros always remembered it.
Davros survives, thanks to the Doctor. He lives to go on to fight in the war, to become horribly mutilated, to see his planet ravaged.
That act of compassion, in Davros’ view, was the cruelest thing he could have done to him! Rather than letting him die quickly and mercilessly.
“Davros remembers” what the Doctor did to him. He allowed him to live that awful life. Curse his compassion!
17 September 2015 at 13:22 #42774@purofilion
BTW, thank you. However, so far not only have I never been right, I’ve not even been close! Lol.
I take comfort in the fact that here the theories truly are more insane than what’s actually happening out there. 🙂
17 September 2015 at 12:59 #42773@purofilion
The idea that the Tardis might be the one that’s possessed and turned against the Doctor is actually pretty chilling. I may not be able to sleep tonight. :O
Another thought that occurred to me is that the Doctor may be one step ahead of them. (Quelle surprise!)
He is making sure Missy gets that disc, which she says is his last Will and Testament. But what if the Doctor KNOWS she’s working with the GI? It may be a trick on his part.
16 September 2015 at 23:31 #42756I’ve been wondering about the Great Intelligence a lot lately, actually. Re-listening to the Prologue (several times.)
He qualifies as someone the Doctor has known for a long time, and has always been an enemy.
It is also reasonable for the Doctor to say he doesn’t actually “know him” that well.
He does not need to be reintroduced to Nu’er Viewers.
Consider the comments in the Prologue:
“But I don’t like you” — “That’s why you can trust me.” = Don’t trust someone you like.
“You can hide from your enemies but not your friends.” = If someone is going to get to you, it would be through a friend.
“Has something happened? Was it recent?” – “Yes.” = Something profound has changed and it is compelling the Doctor to do something very rash. So something (someone) he care’s about a lot.
We know the GI has a connection with Clara already. (Three times.)
We know Clara has a connection with Missy. She was the woman at the shop who saw to it the Doctor found Clara.
Why was Missy keen to do that? (The “I needed someone controlling” was a weak excuse). But what if Missy is working with the GI?
= The GI is working through Clara. Maybe has recently possessed her?
= Don’t trust someone you like / Hide from your friends.
16 September 2015 at 13:47 #42746[Sigh] you’re right, of course. I keep forgetting how old everyone else isn’t.
I suppose the same will hold true for the idea that the Doctor will run into Maxil sometime this year. wouldn’t it be great if THAT was the first face he saw when he finds Gallifrey! 😮
15 September 2015 at 19:28 #42703Just had one of my weirdly random (or randomly weird) thoughts:
So Reece Shearsmith has been cast in an episode. And no, I don’t think he’ll be playing the Second Doctor.
But he WILL be part of the explanation for the Doctor having the face of someone from his past.
He’ll be playing Salamander.
14 January 2015 at 15:22 #37308@bluesqueakpip Funny I thought about that exact same thing right after I hit Submit.
Same goes for Matt Smith as Mr. Clever in NIghtmare in Silver.
But… in those cases it’s same-actor-different-character. I think it would be a different dynamic.
Totally agree on wanting to see 12 meeting Caecilius. Unfortunately I doubt it will happen.
14 January 2015 at 13:27 #37306Whew! Wow. 🙂 I was thinking way more old school multi-Doctor. You know, where they just annoy one another.
I thought what would be a cool twist would be the fact that CapDoc explicitly states that he hates himself, so who better to have to work with than himself?
And then ultimately decide “Hey that guy’s not so bad after all”
13 January 2015 at 20:56 #37290Hello Gang!
First time in the sofa (and I must say it’s quite comfy). I had a mild brain aneurysm of an idea and thought I’d inflict it on you, if I may.
Would anyone like to see a multi-Doctor episode where both Doctors were Capaldi?!
After all, if he was going to meet himself in another time, who says it HAS to be a previous regeneration?
P.S. Retro TV just played Brain of Morbius, so I’d be al for including that in a discussion.
5 January 2015 at 13:20 #36977@IAmNotAFishIAmAFreeMan
Explained in-story. Just a few moments of sucker-face passed (except apparently for Clara, where it lasted however long ti took the Doc to Tardis his way to her).
Ah yes. I guess I did forget to account for sucker-face-time. 😉
2 January 2015 at 18:41 #36842Oh my! Due to a vacation and a mis-scheduled tivo, I am way WAY behind in viewing, reading, and responding. Still… here goes:
You have a horror movie called “Alien”?! That’s offensive. No wonder they keep invading you!
Santa took everyone “home”. Was really hoping the Doctor would wake up on Gallifrey. Even if only to find it was still a dream.
The sleigh riding started to feel a bit time-filler. Just a bit.
The reference to “Alien”: If only the remark had been made by the War Doctor. 😀
It’s a wonder that no one’s ever walked in and said “Grandma! What a big sucker you have on your face!” 😛
Am I dreaming? As someone who tries to tinker with lucid dreams, I have found one thing that helps me answer that question: Try closing your eyes! For me anyway, when I’m dreaming, I can’t!
More later! Off to digest the Wonderful Pages of Bonkers before me.
15 December 2014 at 14:19 #36216Interestingly, just a few episodes later, The Mutants (I’m watching them in sequence in Retro TV) they raised this very issue with human colonists basically disregarding the rights of the native population.
I almost wonder if they didn’t discuss the issue internally after Colony in Space and decide to tackle it head on.
11 November 2014 at 13:17 #35345@barnable re the Doctor’s cracks on the Universe
I know. <sigh> It’s just the first time I felt like a crackee. :p
11 November 2014 at 13:15 #35344I’m voting for “Zygood”! 🙂
10 November 2014 at 17:31 #35260you might be referring to those wacky red states ? 🙂
Indeed. One of which is currently my home. However, I too rely more on the crossing of fingers than the folding of hands.
Also, I like your catch regarding the ‘smell’ of Osgood but if she did smell like Zygon wouldn’t the Doctor have smelled that too ?
Hmmm…. Good point. However, Who’s to say he didn’t notice and chose not to say anthing? 😮 Might be worth a rewatch just to pay more attention to his facial attention when he sees her….
10 November 2014 at 15:29 #35254Can only make one comment that hasn’t already been made:
I don’t want Americans here. They’ll probably start praying.
OMG! Is that how the world sees us?! :O I need to move!
P.S. Osgood as Zygon Osgood? Easy peasy! Missy specifically remarks on her smell! Zygon!
7 November 2014 at 01:00 #34895@bluesqueakpip
Because they both think the electronics are being tapped?That’s what I’m wondering. Just now sure how it fits in. Maybe the whole wifi/taking people over thing?
6 November 2014 at 13:27 #34861Post-its:
I still think it’s no coincidence that both the Doctor and Clara are using no-tech methods of working out some kind of problem.
I suspect the answer to the post-notes is the same as the answer to the chalk boards.
Why the non-electronics?
5 November 2014 at 18:39 #34801The scene with Clara standing in the middle of the road with traffic (apparently unconcerned with her being there) struck me as odd at the time. And more so in hindsight.
Maybe this is a future Clara. Or a projection of Clara, but standing at a time BEFORE the accident. Preparing to prevent it, ala Rose with Nine.
5 November 2014 at 14:55 #34787@janetteb You are correct. The Doctor states explicitly in The Sea Devils that he and the Master were very close friends once.
4 November 2014 at 12:50 #34730Actually that could work too! Orson could be a re-downloaded, edited Danny.
4 November 2014 at 11:09 #34724Capaldi himself reprising his role as Caecilius
oooh! That’s why his hair went flat. They filmed those scenes afterwards. :O
4 November 2014 at 10:19 #34720@geoffers
timey-wimey, indeed! are you saying that tennant doc originally left the family behind, and lots of things were different, but that capaldi doc has taken on the face, to tell himself that he needs to go back and save that family, to right the timelines?Yep. That’s it!
the only way that would work, is if there’s a tennant guest appearance coming up, where capaldi doc tells him he has to go back!!
That would be awesome indeed! However, it could also be done with a bit of clever editing. And of course Capaldi himself reprising his role as Caecilius with a different reaction to events.
4 November 2014 at 01:47 #34706@fatmaninabox
I’m a bit confused (not a new experience 😉 ) but I’m pretty sure The Doctor did save Caecilius and his family!
However, there’s no escaping the fact that there have been an awful lot of references to fire. Is it possible that The Doctor saved the wrong family?Sorry. I missed a piece of it: The history WE know is the one where the 12th Doctor has come back to ensure they get saved. The ORIGINAL history (that we didn’t know about) had him leave the family behind.
4 November 2014 at 00:17 #34695Bonk!
Moffat did not lie. The Master has not returned this season. Missy is not the Master.
The whole season has been a delusion of the Doctor’s.
He’s still in the midst of a post-regeneration trauma.
1) I have made a lot of mistakes, it’s time I did something about that.
2) A giant, flaming beast.
3) Who frowned me these lines?
4) Am I a good man?
5) Examine your conscience
6) I am not a hero/I am as real as you are.
7) Listen. Someone is trying to tell you something.
8) There is someone else in the universe with your face.
9) Rescue the Teller. Guilt. Self-hatred.
10) Fire.
11) Skovox Blitzer. Fire.
12) Save the Earth or the Moon Egg? Choices, guilt. Trembling earth.
13) Someone is trying to reach the Doctor.
14) Lava.
15) Cremation. Fire.
16) The dead do not come back.
17) You can change history.The guilt is that the Doctor saved no one from the eruption of Pompeii. His new face is telling him who he should have saved. The guilt is compelling him to right a wrong, to change history. To go back in time and make his former self save Lobus Caecilius like Donna said.
3 November 2014 at 22:44 #34688@spider
Aha! Utter bonkers theory: Danny is Adric!Dang it! [Fill in the Blank] is Adric is supposed to be MY schtick! How did I miss that?! 😛
3 November 2014 at 22:42 #34687That would certainly be “for the dads”, as the euphemism goes, since all non living inorganic material would be rendered invisible by the Dark Water, so all we would see would be skin.
And eyes.
Big, big eyes.LOL! My what big eyes you have, BadWulf
3 November 2014 at 20:54 #34671Colony In Space:
Couldn’t find a better place for this as I didn’t see this epp in the BG section. So here goes:
I watched this episode recently and something occurred to me. You have the mining corporation being evil and trying to take over this planet that is being colonized. And the colonists trying to hang on to their new home. They bring in an adjudicator (albeit a sham one thanks to the Master) to decide the correct fate of the planet. All the while struggling to deal with the “primitives”.
And all the while no one – not the colonists, not Jo, not even the Doctor – mention the most pertinent fact to the question. The planet already belongs to someone!
The answer should have been “Both of you get off. The current, native population owns the planet”.
Did I miss something there?
3 November 2014 at 19:59 #34668More thoughts:
. A lot of reference to burning in this series.
. When did the Doctor come to understand that Clara’s telepathic run of the tardis took them to Danny Pink? The last I remember he thought they were in Clara’s past. And Clara didn’t mention who the boy really was.
. @arbutus And yes, I’ve been thinking about the The Bells of St. John as well, strong similarity there with the uploading concept, and even Danny saying, “I don’t know where I am.” Oooh! Good catch!
. Missy was previously seen interacting with the “dead”. Yet here she is on the “outside” very much alive. (I think. :O)
. Could the Dark Water tanks have anything to do with the repeated mention of Clara’s ability to hold her breath?
3 November 2014 at 18:08 #34653@drben
Also, when I mentioned to my wife the “THREE MONTHS” thing and @spider ‘s theory that she’s pregnant, my wife shook her head and said “nah, she’s dying.” (As in, three months to live.)
This would add additional resonance to her scene about how Danny’s death was “boring”. Imagine traveling all through space and time and then being told that you’ve got, say, inoperable cancer?
This is my new bonkers theory for the Christmas episode. Bring Kleenex.Wow! And I thought my version of Clara’s end was rough! Though it’s hard to reconcile that with her finding Danny in what she thinks is the after life and not just saying to him “Hang on, I’ll be there soon.”
I have a (bad) feeling that what will happen at the end of next week, after the Doctor has saved the day and reunited the happy couple, Clara will start for the Tardis for another adventure and the Doctor will block her way. He saved Danny because he did owe her one. But she betrayed him and (despite what he said in this episode) I think he will tell her they’re through.
ETA Although your version does make sense of her line “You’re the last person I will say this to.”
3 November 2014 at 17:00 #34647Random Thoughts in Not Particular Order (Some of which I see other eaglery eyes them mine have spotted:
. Loved about every second of it
. Post-it notes. More low tech list-making. Like the chalk board.
. Clara had something dire to talk to Danny about, then abruptly changed her tone. Still feels like we’re missing pieces of time here.
. Opening the Tardis with a finger-snap. You know, to me its always felt like that was a sort-of “remote control” like with a BMW door lock. You can open it with your hand, but you still need the physical key in your possession.
. Dream Inducer, eh? Like so much of what’s been going on feels dream-like…
. Missy is the Master. I was on the edge of my seat like everyone else when I heard “Which Timelord?!” And yet… and yet… Why does it feel like not quite enough Moffitrickery? There’s another rug under us ready to be pulled out.
. Missy must not be the woman in the shop.
. Yes, I choked up, too when Danny’s last words were “I love you”. And yet… and yet… He actually was not able to prove he was who he said he was…
. St. Paul’s doesn’t need a perception filter. The Mistress’s Tardis could easily envelope the whole building and then take on its shape. @blenkinsopthebrave, yep you got it. 🙂
. The emotion Delete Button is strikingly similar to the device used by Miss Kizlet in The Bells of St. John. Hmmm… wifi… hmmm… Clara was uploaded.
. Clara pregnant. THAT’S what she had to “just say” to Danny!
27 October 2014 at 19:39 #34222Yes, he did mention 2016. I wondered about that too. Might it also mean that there is a possibility that we might re-experience those two years somehow?
Could be. There have been two mentions of Earth’s future that maybe “won’t be”. And I have had an odd feeling like none of these things have been “really” happening.
More mentions of the round things, too. Lots of circles here.
Like we keep getting glimpses of being inside a Tardis in the grip of a Dream Lord….
27 October 2014 at 19:16 #34216Did the Doctor specifically mention 2016? Are we two years in the future?
This would be in keeping with the several comments about incidents which occured “ages ago”.
21 October 2014 at 13:30 #33947One moment I don’t recall seeing mentioned which tickled me no end was the Doctor’s little wonderfully out of character Happy Dance after successfully moving the Tardis off the tracks. 😀
21 October 2014 at 01:37 #33928@purofilion First off, best wishes and hope you’re doing better.
that Missy is in his head rather than corporeal? Great idea. But then, the ipad tech… which leads me to think it is a real place. Also the author voice containing Seb suggests interactions beyond Missy therefore my vote is for corporeal but, as you suggest, it could be in the Doctor’s head (too…).
I am inclined to agree that she’s a real person in an unreal place. Observations like “Missy is Mister Clever” is more brewskier than bonksier theorizing. Along the lines of Tasha Lem is Adric. Not always at my most serious. 😛
20 October 2014 at 19:58 #33912Ok, my next Bonkers thought is hatching:
Missy is short for Mister Clever.
The Cyber-Planner from Nightmare in Silver. Still inside his head.
20 October 2014 at 19:48 #33911Noticed a lot of people on other boards remarking on PC’s hair undergoing changes throughout. Short while he’s trapped in the Tardis. Fluffy when he’s outside.
Hmmm…. continuity error? Or the Doctor from different periods of time….?
20 October 2014 at 16:16 #33907Some Random thoughts before going Bonksy…
1) Missy seeing through the Doctor’s eyes: No, then she should not have been uncertain about how the HFM died.
2) Line I loved not yet mentioned: Clara (to Danny): I’m helping him find his Auntie. Doctor: Not techinically lying!
3) Using the sonic to signal the train to stop. Cue the Red Setting!17 October 2014 at 19:43 #33695I loved “Soap”! And… wait!
One of the characters in it was “Danny”. A reformed gangster.
Ah HAH! We are on to something here….
:p
14 October 2014 at 15:32 #33551 -
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