[Brewski @replies]

@janetteb

The woman in the shop is Susan.

I really want to see a return of Susan. But I don’t think she’s the woman in the shop. For one thing Clara saw a picture of Susan in the Black Archive but showed no sign of recognition.

For another, it’s just so not-bonkers-enough. 😛 I’m sticking with The Moment was the Woman in the Shop idea.

 

@janetteb

 

I am definitely with you on the “not the Valeyard”. I dislike the concept though I can’t comment on the execution as I have not seen the story in which the idea was introduced…

Trial of a Time Lord wasn’t all that bad, given the mileu they had to work in at the time. But… the notion that a future Doctor can come back to steel his previous regenerations? THAT is “even more insane than what’s actually happening”!

 

I doubt that Missy is either the Valeyard or The Rani though Moffat does recycle old ideas and give them a fresh sheen, so if Missy is the Rani she will be a very different Rani.

I am inclined to believe she is going to be a previously unknown character. But one thing I have learned from watching the MoffEra is that she is not going to be anyone any body has guessed anywhere.

 

@bluesqueakpip

It boggles for quite some time. After it’s finished boggling, I may have to take it for a nice lie down in a darkened room.

Lol at this! A mind is a terrible thing to boggle. Perhaps after its lie down you can give it a nice cup of alacri-tea

 

Currently I’m running with ‘female Master’ (finally out of the closet, hence the ‘boyfriend’ joke)

 

What’s the line from “Time Crash”?

10: Oh, the Master’s back!

5: Really? Does he still have the rubbish beard?

10: No! No beard. Well… he has a wife.

 

@arbutus

 

Absolutely agree re the Valeyard, I have no interest in going there.

Whew! Good. I am glad to know I’m in a safe place. 🙂 I was beginning to think I was the only one.

 

Except… the Doctor always said that he would have sensed the presence of time lords who still existed. Would he not have sensed his own granddaughter?

Unless…. she has been in a chameleon arch… :O

[Brewski @replies]

ScaryB

love the QE I as Missy theory – you nearly have me convinced

Lol, thanks! 🙂 When it comes to findings parallels, I love going for the absurd. I almost went with “Missy is Adric” again, but decided calling her Miss A was too much. 😉

Something else occurred to me: Now that there are leaked scripts floating around out there, the awful thing about bonkers theorizing is what happens if we somehow manage to be right! :O Would the mods have no choice but to remove our posts?

 

Re Journey Blue being a reference to traveling in the TARDIS. LOVE IT!!

 

@serahni and @purofilion I am equally convinced Missy is not River and do not want her to be. I am in the Love River camp and to be honest would not mind seeing her again. But I agree, you have to draw the line somewhere and end it. Parting is such sweet sorrow and all that.

 

Speaking of camps, am I the only member of “Please No Valeyard!”? There’s a story line I am okay with being done.

 

@thommck

Wouldn’t it be cool if we got another flashback/minisode that showed the first jouney Doc 1 ever took,

I was kinda hoping they’d do something like this for the 50^th, especially given that they’d rebuilt the original TARDIS console for AiSaT!

(@Drdai That is the docudrama you are remembering: “An Adventure in Space and Time” with David Bradley doing a brilliant job as William Hartnell)

On the other hand, I find myself torn between wanting to satisfy my curiosity about the back story and also wanting to hang on to the mystery that is “Doctor Who?”

And then we get those intriguing hints now and then. Like the Doctor telling the Dalek that at first he was nobody, just a man running away – and the name Doctor was just a name he gave himself. Until he met them. How did he put it? That he realized who he was: Not-Dalek. Something like that, I think.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@devilishrobby 🙂 yeah I like Moffat because he is so twisted.

And I love to find connections where they don’t exist.  I could connect up Leela with Lazarus.  (Always looking for a pair L.L.)

 

[Brewski @replies]

10 reasons why Missy is Queen Elizabeth I

(brought to you by tongue-firmly-planted-in-cheek)

1. Missy is a sly reference to her nickname “The Virgin Queen”

2. QEI clearly became unbalanced for being left at the altar and subsequently wore black as in mourning.

3. After her bloody encounter with the Zygon, QEI obtained the ability to shape-shift and took on the form of a psychotic Mary Poppins.

4. She is collecting others like her that she perceives were let down by the Doctor
5. Missy’s remark about the Doctor’s new accent was actually a dig at her cousin Mary
6. “The Promised Land” is a dig at QEII about Scotland
7.Missy’s tie pin has an image of QEI on it
8. QEI, having been stood up by her husband, The Doctor, annulled the marriage and downgraded him to “boyfriend”.
9. “Gatekeeper of the Nethersphere” refers to the fact that she isn’t going to let another man go where the Doctor did!
10. You have been mis-saying her name.  Since she is vigorously unmarried, she is not Missy. She is Miss E!

 

[Brewski @replies]

@thommck lol, ok I’ll buy that.  Though I still think they would have been pretty crusty.  :p

The Master’s screw driver aged the doctor enough to shrivel him up.  In the classic episodes he had a tissue compression device that shrunk people,  but as a way of killing them.

 

[Brewski @replies]

Ok.  Just did MY second watching and am ready to fire! 🙂

Missy reappearing definitely creeped me out! More on her later. (But don’t expect me to be very serious.)

Question: When did they get cleaned up after the protein bath?!  The climbed in the “bolt” hole, and one commercial break later they were nice and dry.
Danny Pink: is there some sinister double meaning to “Lady Killer”?
On the Doctor remarking about Clara not being young as a reference to her many lives. Right afterwards he does say her name…. many times.

@theatreguy In another life I go by “DramaQueen”. :p

I’m wondering if Danny Pink was a version of the dead brother –

Had exactly the same thought! Then I wondered if it was too obvious.  Now I see many same thoughts.  Hmm…

Oh and that Clara slap was felt all the way through time and space – another belter from Jenna

Hee hee! Yeah I flinched a bit myself at that one!

@scaryb

Another thought about Danny – wondering if he’ll follow Clara one day – into the junkyard perhaps – to find out what she’s up to with the old guy and the blue box.

Oooh! I love that idea. And while we’re at it, can we have the Doctor wander into the Chairman of the Governors office and say “I never forget a face.” And Ian say “Who are you?”

‘He was dead already, I was saving us’

Yeah, the first thing I thought was, “that is cold”. But we were promised a darker, less user-friendly Doctor. Tenant or Smith might not have said it, but Pertwee or Hartnell might have!

This Doctor actively encourages some people to sacrifice themselves for the greater good. And these people end up in Missy’s “heaven”. Hmmm.

Hmm, indeed! The last time someone pointed out this trait was Davros in Journey’s End. Hmmm….

@wolfweed

The anti-bodies looked a bit like (Dalek) ‘eyes’ and Clara’s shirt was covered with eyes…

Moffat does love his eyes! Lol… It’s like Hitchcock and birds! 🙂

@serahni

No good Daleks indeed; how deeply personal that is to you even if you don’t realise it, Oswin.

Oooh! Excellent callout!  She may not remember being a dalek (ultimately a good dalek, no?)  But she may have had a sense of it.  And more to the point, a sense that the Doctor should have remembered the dalek who saved him!

@bluesqueakpip

Oh, by the way, has everyone noticed that the rebel ship was the Aristotle?
Marcus Aurelius last week and in the 50th, now Aristotle. Both, of course, discuss the nature of a ‘good man’.

I did not notice either.  You guys are amazing!

@fatmaninabox

Pink/Blue names – notice that they’ve reversed the usual gender connotations.
Or what we think of as ‘usual’. The notion of pink for girls and blue for boys is a relatively new concept.

Said the blue man. 😉

@confusedpolarity

What was the Doctor trying to do? I believe he genuinely thought he could repair Rusty and keep him “good”; his reaction to the creature’s return to its natural state was as much disappointment as self-justification.

I must say, this is where the episode lost me, too. I’m willing to chalk it up to post-regeneration brain farts, but… If the Doctor was THAT confident that a Dalek can’t be rehabilitated, then I’m honestly disappointed that he didn’t a) Have a contingency plan already standing by in case the dalek did go nuts again, and b) Not wait so long before reacting. That moment of helplessness kind of bugged me.

@timeloop

The similar shot of heaven/the two streams facility

I’m going to be boring on this one and say “re-using an interesting looking location for filming”. Sorry. Sort of Bonked Out on that one.

That thing that leaked radiation reminded a few of us of the tears in time and space

Spotted that too. Also going De-Bonked and gonna say “I think Moffat is deliberately yanking our chains on that one” 🙂

Ok, well I think that catches me up for now.  Off the the Missy Theory!

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

Oh my aching click-finger! I just HAD to pick this week to be away on business!

 

Ok, I am going to start with apologies to EVERYONE for not replying directly, but it is 12 pages (ooh, irony!) I have a lot of catching up to do, so I’m just short-list my thoughts and move on to the next episode. (And then find a Missy page to comment on, if there is one.)

 

In no particular order:

 

1) I LOVE the bonking idea of Missy being and old Clara, but can’t actually buy it. She seems to be experiencing these events in the same order we are. So why would she say “I love his new accent” if she was an old Clara. It would have been “I LOVED that new accent.”

 

2) <Nitpick> Eleven complaining that he hopes 12 isn’t old. Huh? Dude, until your brief reset (just a few minutes before) you were all old and wrinkled and balding. From your perspective, a full head of hair – gray or not – would be a refreshing… um… refresh.</Nitpick>

 

3) “Don’t look in that mirror! It’s absolutely furious!” LOVE IT. Have rewatched just that line 4 times.

 

4) Vastra’s line: “Well then… here we go again.” Nice call back to The Brig’s comment when 3 regen’ed into 4.

 

5) The Woman in the Shop. HAH! Just a throwaway line, huh? SHE’S BAA-ACK!

 

6) Clara’s flashback to the students taunting her. I felt a little cheated there. I really LOVE how she handled herself in that scene and calling out the droid (Ok, I’ll happily go with Humpty). But I wish we’d been given that setup with her students some time before this. ANY time before. Preferably a brief scene in the previous season. But barring that as a flash back earlier in this one. It just came out of nowhere for me, so it seemed very forced and expository.

 

7) Matt Smith’s cameo. I am neutral on this one. It did not make me feel it detracted from the new doctor. And I get the purpose of it. Let’s face it, long-time-fans: How many of us wouldn’t have been thrilled to wetting ourselves if Tom Baker had made a brief appearance to reassure Peter Davison?!

 

8) One of us is lying about his basic programming. I have to go with others who have pointed out that the Doctor HAS killed. Humpty may have been lying, but the Doctor plainly was. Of course, that does not mean he did the pushing. I think that is one of those moments that was left ambiguous on purpose and always will be.

 

9) Clara finally accepting this new Doctor: just a bit of an odd moment for me. She spent most of the show not warming to him. Then she listens to 11 for a while. Then she still doesn’t accept him. Then she looks into his eyes. Then she accepts him. I felt like I needed just a little finer transition there. Like Clara hugging him and 12 saying “Was it something he said?” And Clara answering “It was something YOU said.”

 

10) Overall, enjoyed it thoroughly. Good, solid, enjoyable episode.

Thanks All!  Now off to the next one!

[Brewski @replies]

@fatmaninabox

I think it’s time for both a non-modern day and a male companion

I agree!   Only I think it should be Matthew Waterhouse playing Driccy, the evil N-Space counterpart of Adric.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@Whisht I LOVE it!  Much better than my idea: “Guys and Daleks”.

[Brewski @replies]

@fivefaces I love it when others are thinking the same thing at the same time! It’s always nice to know I’m not the only lunatic around.  😛

I think “Genesis” rewrote the original history a bit with the addition of Davros to the story.  But IIRC he just excellerated the mutations that had already begun with the war with the Thals.

I was imagining going back much further in time.  Before any war had changed them.  When they were still much more ideological.

One needn’t think of Nazi’s as ever having been artists and philosophers.  The Germany of the Weimar Republic was a pretty progressive place.  It was the rise of the Nazis that changed the German people.

I guess maybe I’m saying “let’s get a look at the Weimar Daleks”! 😀

 

[Brewski @replies]

Wish-listing again!

I have been watching the classics just to fill the void.  Specifically, I just watched the very first Dalek ep.  And it got me to thinking (and if this has already been done anywhere, someone please let me know!):

How about a story where the Doctor encounters the Daleks BEFORE they mutated?  Were they humanoid?  The original story says they were beautiful and artistic people!

Would the Doctor even recognize who they were?  And what if he did something truly awful – like inadvertently lead to their eventual mutation?

Thoughts?

[Brewski @replies]

@purofilian sorry,  you did indeed contribute some great bonkers stuff to that.  I should know better than to use my smart phone to reply,  as I wind up abbreviating my thoughts to much.

As for me, I’m really not creative in my own universe,  that’s why I’m grateful to participate in this one.

@kingofthemountain not just me, but a pretty involved discussion about that very subject.  You should scroll back to that posting number (or just click on it) and follow the thread.  Lots of wonderful insane discussion there.

[Brewski @replies]

So my idea wasn’t that tM would have created Clara, but that it would have used her to help the doctor by giving her the doctors phone numbe (BoSJ).

Hi @kingofthemountain.  I like the way you think!  Especially given that “great minds think alike” and all. 😉

See my post #24571

Brewski

 

[Brewski @replies]

@purofilion You are too kind(est).

This one isn’t a theory.  It’s on the dialog wishlist…

• Doctor: I thought we’d pop over to MET-a-BEE-lis Three.

  Clara: I thought it was pronounced Meh-TEB-a-lis.

  Doctor: (Shrugs.) Pa-tah-toe, pa-tah-toe.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@purofilion no, not a recording.  Live strobe lights that flicker 1000 times faster than a human blink.  So you can “see” the angels moving in what would look like stop-action motion.

[Brewski @replies]

@scaryb, your clip above made me think of a cool thing I’d like to see:

Weeping Angel Hunters!  You can track them,  watch their movements,  with strobe lights!

Like animating a movie.  😀

 

[Brewski @replies]

Oh!  And on the WishList side of things, I’ve changed my mind about the Master.  I’ve decided I’d love to see Patrick Stewart take on the role! :O

 

[Brewski @replies]

Hey all. Since I just had a wacky outside-the-box idea come into my not-blue head, I thought “what better place to share it? ”

Was wondering what would happen if the cyber leader lifted his mask to reveal the remains of the life form from whom he was created.  And it was none other than the head of Dorium Maldovar. :p

 

[Brewski @replies]

Since science fiction is generally contemporary issues placed in an alien setting,  I would love to see Drone Daleks!

Little attack mini-daleks the size of actual salt and pepper shakers.

(Sorry. Let my Americanism slip there didn’t I?)

 

[Brewski @replies]

@jimthefish Am toying with the theory that Capaldi might actually be both the Doctor and the Master in the upcoming series.

I have to sadly admit that I did not know you posted this theory before I did over on the wishlist page.

My hats off to you, sir!

 

[Brewski @replies]

I would like to now try to out-bonker my fellow theorists!

The Master will be played by……

Peter Capaldi in a dual (duel?) role!

[Brewski @replies]

@arbutus brewski, there’s (@purofilion’s) a third possible explanation for the Rose Tyler/Moment memory problem!

Hehheheh… I love this!  We get to come up with these terribly serious theories AND revel in the sheer nuttiness of them.

Kudos to both of these explanations!

 

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

Hi @purofilion.

Are you saying that the Hurt Doc should recall the exact events prior to changing into Eccelston, whilst he is the Eccelston Doctor and remembering the Clara/Tennant/Smith/Moment time stream? Or are you suggesting that even Tennant should have some residual memory?

 

Neither.  I’m talking about the period of time AFTER the War Doctor activated the Moment (and talked with her in a form that looked like Rose Tyler/Bad Wolf) and but BEFORE the time she opened the time vortex and caused him to meet up with his future selves.

Why does he have no recollection of THAT time?

[Brewski @replies]

Hi @purofilion.  Your answer has given me a lot to think about.   Now if I could just figure out what that is. 😛

@arbutus I started liking the notion of War Doctor not remembering because of his regeneration following immediately. But, as you say, that does not explain 10’s loss of memory.

“The time streams are out of sync”, and some confused thoughts about what that actually means vis a vis the dual time stream theory. I think that the period of time when the three doctors are together is the point of divergence.

I think this is the “generally accepted” answer.  And is the one (quelle surprise) that I have a problem with.  Here’s why:

If the time lines go out of sync at the moment an earlier Doctor meets up with a later one, then the War Doctor SHOULD have retained his memory of the events prior to that.  Specifically, his meeting the user interface to the Moment.

His memory loss wouldn’t begin until she pushed him into his own future.

That being the case, he would have to recognize Rose Tyler when he met her shortly thereafter.

Why did he have NO recollection his interacting with the Moment at all?  (And yet knew he’d used it.)

 

[Brewski @replies]

The Scene I Want to See:

Clara and the newly regenerated Doctor find themselves in the Whitechapel district of London in 1888, at the heart of one of the greatest mysteries of all time: Jack the Ripper.

The Doctor grandly declares that there is only one man who is capable of solving this mystery!

At that moment, an unidentified man, played as a cameo by Benedict Cumberbatch, passed between them with a polite, “I beg your pardon.”

Clara, after a moment of staring after the departing man says “Sherlock Holmes?”

The Doctor gives her a withering look. “Don’t be absurd, young lady! Sherlock Holmes is a fictional character. I’m referring to myself!”

 

[Brewski @replies]

Here is a multi-part question for my fellow theorizers. (Caution, the questions may contain some trickery):

1. Why did the War Doctor not remember the events in The Day of the Doctor?
2. Are you sure?

There may be follow-up questions.

[Brewski @replies]

@fatmaninabox  To be honest, despite RTD stating that ‘Mysterious Time Lady’ (henceforth know as MTL) was The Doctor’s mum, I’ve never believed that she was. I’ve always thought (perhaps bizarrely) that she’s a regenerated Donna.

 

Whoo!  Ya gotta love that for shear bat-poo bonkers!  We are all agreed that MTL as the Doctor’s mother is BO-RING!  I’m glad RTD decided not to make that explicit.  Or we’d have a helluva time twisting our way out of that! 😀

 

[Brewski @replies]

@arbutus I never found the idea of the woman being the Doctor’s mother especially interesting.

Agreed.  I really wanted her to be a Post Library Sort-Of-Regeneration of River.  One whom the Doctor recognizes as part of his past (since she is moving backward along his timeline) but NOT recognize later as River Song.

(This does not change the above discussion of The Moment being the woman who appeared to Wilf, since THAT would only have an image that was chosen by the Moment.)

[Brewski @replies]

@barnable Trying to answer, how Bad Wolf gave the number to Clara?, as “The woman in the shop”,  might unravel the whole two time lines.   We should have got the answer before the old time line ended, if Bad Wolf did it.  So now I’m going to have to change my mind on that (apologies @brewski ) and search for another possible “woman in the shop”.  The only one I can think of would be River.  Maybe Rose or Donna too ( Martha’s in UNIT) – LOL. I really don’t know?

No apologies necessary. 🙂  However, I might need some Clara-fication.  I do not see The Moment as being Bad Wolf in any way other than her outward appearance.  She (The Moment) was only using a form she thought the Doctor would recognize and feel comfortable with.  She was just confused about whether the form was from his past or future.

So how does the “real” Bad Wolf’s timeline have any bearing on this?

As far as the Woman in the Shop being River, Rose, Martha et al, well… those thought have been done to death it seems.  And in this land of whacky theories, its just a lot more fun to think outside the blue box.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@fatmaninabox I think it’s also likely that the ‘mysterious woman’ in TEoT was also The Moment – not the Time Lady on Gallifrey but the one in the twin-set and pearls that only Wilf could see.

This is an interesting thought.  The timing would be right (pun intended), since we know this is when the War Doctor has just stolen The Moment.  Also, glad you clarified that you mean only the vision seen by Wilf, and not the Time Lady whose form she took.

This could mean that the Time Lady is someone Wilf knows in HIS future, which is why The Moment once again took a form she thought would be recognizable to the person.  (But still muddling up the past/future thing.)

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

Hi @purofilion.  Thanks.

My original thoughts about Clara and the Clock Face involved a Chameleon watch.  (I posted that on the Fan Creativity forum recently.)  But I think most of that didn’t pan out.  (And was not entirely serious. 🙂 )

 

You are right about the form chosen by the Moment.  It probably would not chosen Rose since this had no meaning to her.  However, remember that Rose had no meaning to the War Doctor, either.   The Moment chose a form from the Doctor’s FUTURE.

 

It is still possible that the “woman in the shop” was the Moment looking like someone Clara will know later.

[Brewski @replies]

Hello again.
Been away a while, dealing with life-things and dreaming up other whacky ideas:
I have been thinking about what initially looked to me like a plot hole in tDotD. I was also rereading some of the theories around about “the woman in the shop” who gave Clara the Doctor’s number in tNoftD.

 
Now I want to combine these two things…

 
Here’s how it works: We see the Machinations of Moment as causing a change in the timeline. Events that had gone one way were changed forever when she brought the War Doctor together with 10 and 11. However, I say that CAN’T be the way it happened. If it did – if 10 had originally been left on his own in 16th century England — then he wouldn’t have let the Zygons get away with planting themselves in the paintings. And even if he had, there would be no reason for 11 to have FORGOTTEN about it. He (11) should have been expecting the Zygons to eventually break out sooner or later, and not so clueless when it happened. (BTW, putting of solving the Zygon problem until they broke out would have been a pretty lazy approach to stopping the invasion.)

 
No. This wasn’t a CHANGE in the timeline. The timeline was ALWAYS that the Moment brought the three doctors together. Therefore 10, rather than dealing with the Zygons as he’d planned, whisked off with the other Doctors to help stop the Zygons in the future and thus had no recollection of that part of the events.

 
Moreover, the War Doctor, having reached his decision during the Zygon/Unit negotiations, returned to the barn and USED the Moment to destroy the Time Lords and Daleks.  That’s what always happened.

 
What changed is Clara.

 
So here’s the whacky part: the Moment had done her best to convince the War Doctor to not burn Gallifrey. And failed! All the events after that, including the Doctor’s guilt and 9’s resultant demeanor, happened as we knew it. But… the Moment tried AGAIN, a different tactic. She picked a very special time and place. She appeared to Clara as “the woman in the shop” and gave her the Doctor’s number!

 
The Moment was responsible for bringing the Impossible Girl into the Doctor’s life. Knowing it was Clara who would change things, who would inevitably talk the Doctor(s) out of using the Moment.

 
The scene with the three of them, with their hands on the Big Red Button – THAT’s where the original timeline changed. Because Clara was now there to convince them not to do it.

[Brewski @replies]

Kidneys!!

Is there a renal theme here?  Is Moffat very organ-ized?  Or is it a case of bean there, done that?

I thought something sounded familiar, so I went back and checked.  Here is a snippet of the audition script for the 12th Doctor:

THE DOCTOR: Right then, eyesight. Not bad, bit blue. Ears – not pointy, right way up, more or less level. Face – well I’ve got one. Oh, no – French!
CLARA: French.
THE DOCTOR: I’ve deleted French! Plus all cookery skills, and the breast stroke. And hopping. Never mind hopping, who needs to hop. Ohh, the kidneys are interesting. Never had that before – interesting kidneys.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@arbutus Can I be president of your fan club?

😉 Provided you don’t eventually decide to beat me with it.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@bluesqueakpip   you do realise that some of the Eastern Orthodox Churches still have nudity in baptism?

I did not.  But it might be enough to make me religious again….   mmm…. nah.

The fact that this role means she’ll have to put chrism oil all over a very hot, very naked guy is, of course, completely unrelated to her enthusiasm.

LOL.  Holy Crisco!

 

[Brewski @replies]

Hello all.  Well, I realize this probably isn’t meant to be a poll, but I might as well toss in my 2 bits.

New companions, it would have to be Donna.  I can re-watch that pantomime scene when she finds 10 and laugh at it every time.

Classic: Have to say Ace.  How can you not love someone who’ll beat the crap out of a Dalek with a baseball bat?

And just to be clear, I have admitted elsewhere to being WAY off the bell curve by saying I actually LIKE Adric.

As far as worst companions go, I generally don’t like to get involved in that discussion.  There are always going to be characters who work or don’t-work for you.  And to bash on that is kinda unfair to the actors.

Now… having said that: can someone please please PLEASE steal a TARDIS, go back in time, and make Mel Bush go away?!  Honestly, to this day I have nightmares about a giant, bouncing, screaming The-Prisoner Ball.  {shudder}

 

[Brewski @replies]

An insane (and now obsolete) timeline for the Impossible Girl.
Sorry, this theory was already shattered by TNotD.  But I couldn’t resist posting it.
1 The First Doctor and his wife find themselves having to care for their granddaughter.
2 (What happened to their child is not part of this idea, but a good topic for another day)
3 The Doctor wants to name her Lily, but his wife adamantly refuses and finally agrees to “Susan” which means “Lily”.
4 The wife becomes aware that the Great Intelligence has plans to kidnap Susan.  She can’t explain it, and the Doctor knows nothing of this.  But she convinces him to steal a TARDIS and spirit Susan away (deliberately pointing him to one with a broken navigation circuit to make tracking them harder.)
5 The wife goes into hiding
6 At the onset of the Time War, the wife risks coming out of hiding to find Susan.  She must protect her from the destruction of all Time Lords by hiding her with a Chameleon Watch.
7 Susan becomes “Clara” who feels she was “born behind the face of Big Ben”, which she would if he perspective was the Chameleon Watch face!
8 When(ever) Clara dies, regeneration occurs, but in a different way because of the Chameleon Watch.  She re-forms as the same person in another time and place.  The universe brings together all the right elements at the exact right place and time, like a leaf blowing off a tree at precisely the right moment.
9 When the Doctor’s wife came out of hiding, she reunited with the Doctor to help him fight the Time War.  Their solution was that she would remain on Gallifrey while he applied the Time Lock.  Only they knew the vocal key to the Lock: The Doctor’s Name.
10 When Rassilon attempts to circumvent the Time Lock, the Doctor’s wife attempts to send a message via Wilf.  Later, the Doctor sees her and she is able to communicate wordlessly with him how to prevent the Time Lords from returning.
11 Later, the Doctor becomes aware that the Great Intelligence, who has pursued him several times, is actually after Clara and so discovers her secret.  He restores her to being Susan.  (Clara sometimes misplaced her Watch which she called her “mojo”.)
12 Susan immediately understands her mission: to free River Song from the Library by giving her one of her regenerations.
13 River regenerates into a form the Doctor knows now.  But didn’t know when he first met her.  After all, River’s future is the Doctor’s past.  River goes on (or rather back) to be what she always was: the Doctor’s wife. The First Doctor.  Susan’s Gran.  (Whom Clara mentioned having lost.)
14 The First Doctor and his wife find themselves having to care for their granddaughter.
15 The Doctor wants to name her Lily, but his wife adamantly refuses and finally agrees to “Susan” because she really couldn’t stand the idea of her granddaughter being “Lily Pond”.

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

@bluesqueakpip.  I can accept your explanation about the holograms being for Clara’s benefit.  Thanks.

However, I think the reason the early Christians were naked for baptism is because using clothes lines was such a pain in the neck and as soon as the dryer was invented they put a stop to all that nudity thing!

As far as the practical issue of nudity on prime time t.v., they would have simply blurred out the naughty bits.  So the question would have been “Mummy why are they all blurry like that?” and Mother could answer, “They’re just a little pixelated.”

@fatmaninabox you ARE a shady character!  But a rather fetching shade of blue.

 

[Brewski @replies]

Now it’s my turn to ask a question. This is regarding the hologram clothes and the members of the church of the Papal Mainframe:

At Clara’s turkey dinner, we learn that only Clara can see the Doctor’s hologram clothes. (Much to the horror of her father and delight of Hollow Gramma.) Because the hologram was only being projected on Clara’s eyes.

So… when they went to the Mainframe, did the Doctor adjust their holograms to project on all the church members’ eyes?

No. Because Tasha says “Thank you for your nudity.” And no one else questioned her saying, “What do you mean? They’re wearing clothes.”

So then, who was the hologram for??

And why later does Tasha say everyone in the church is trained to see through holograms? Does that mean they DID see holograms? If so, why did she thank them for their nudity?

And why did Clara say “Great” sarcastically upon discovering that they could see through her hologram? After all, Tasha thanked them for their nudity in the first place. What did Clara THINK they were seeing?

I think it may be less a case of Clara not having underwear and more one of the writer’s slip showing.

[Brewski @replies]

@purofilion ha 10 mins?  No, no it had to have taken longer!

All right, you caught me. 😉 Still, it was better than my first attempt: “The Alzariuses moper mouth”.

Hi @scaryb. And thanks!

@purplecup and @scaryb: re Dorian’s prophesy:

Not to mention how tricky prophesies become when you are dealing with multiple possible-futures!

For example: in one future (where the Doctor dies and is buried on Trenzalore) he may well have been compelled to answer the question. In the future we saw, a “different” Doctor, following a different time stream did NOT have to fulfill that other timeline prophesy.

There are, in a sense, two of them. A classic Pair o’ Docs.

 

[Brewski @replies]

@arbutus forgot to mention.  I’m actually a rare breed, one who LIKED Adric.  But your notion that Tasha is actually there to guard him from getting back did make me giggle… 😀

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

@arbutus Thanks.  I’m afraid I’m good for little more than bonkers ideas.

As for rules of fiction:

Prior to TTotD I read several posters on various sites who swore that “if they don’t honor the 12 regeneration limit I will NEVER watch the show again!”

But, um… if they DO honor the 12 regeneration limit (i.e. this is the last Doctor) you STILL will never watch the show again.  There won’t be one.

Or, to put it another way…

Dalek: (To Doctor, tied to a chair) Doc-tor. You will die. (Aims egg whisp) Bzzorp!

Doctor: AUGH! I’m dying! (Begins to glow). But now I am regenerating.

Dalek: Explain! EXPLAIN!!

Doctor: I’m a Time Lord. I can regenerate 12 times!

Dalek: Bzzorp!

Doctor: AUGH! I’m dying again! And regenerating!

Dalek: Bzzorp!

Doctor: (Etc. Repeat 10 more times)

Dalek: This is your last life Doc-tor! Now you will die for the last time! Bzzorp! Wait! What is hap-en-ing? You are not dy-ing! And you’re making my heat ray is des-troy ME! How can this be? HOW CAN THIS BE??!!

Doctor: Science Friction!

Dalek: (Vanishes in a puff of discontinuity.)

 

[Brewski @replies]

@purplecup thanks.  Of course, one could argue that she is some earlier version of River before she learned out to fly the TARDIS correctly…. 😮

@purofilion Without Googling (look ma, no hands!) I am going to guess whence we also get “purify”.

Alzarius teen uproot-role met Earth smash:

Adric, the boy from the planet Alzarius (in E-Space) was uprooted from his home world when he stowed away on TARDIS, crossed over to our universe, and ended tragically when the ship he was on smashed into Earth.

Ok…. it’s a lousy anagram.  But I only spent 10 minutes on it. :p

 

 

[Brewski @replies]

10 Reasons why Tasha Lem is Adric (in ascending order of absurdity)

10)  Adric is from E-Space.  The Crack in the Universe probably leads to E-Space, which is why Tasha is guarding it.

9) Both argued with the Doctor.

8) Both can pilot the TARDIS.  (Sort of)

7) Both were under control of the Doctor’s enemies as some point.

6) Tasha is against ageing.  She is actually a centuries old body trapped in a teenage boy’s mind.

5) Adric was a math genius.  As Tasha he’s a computer geek working inside a giant mainframe.

4) Tasha has known the Doctor(s) for years.  Since at least 1980 and the Fourth Doctor.

3) Adric was the first companion to hear the Cloister Bell.  Cloister is another name for the life of a nun.  Tasha is a Space Nun.

2) Schrodinger’s Act: Since there is very little data about Tasha Lem, and no data at all about her being Adric, we can view Tasha as simultaneously being and not-being Adric.  Moreover, since the characters are fictional – and therefore bound by rules of conflict, interest and irony – as the probability of Tasha being Adric approaches 1 / Infinity, the ironic twist approaches 100%.  Therefore, Tasha MUST be Adric because it would be SO unexpected.

1) “Tasha Lem, Mother Superious at Tranzalore” is an anagram of “Alzarius teen uproot-role met Earth smash”

0) And finally, Tasha Lem is NOT Adric.  But, it is fun to analyze and speculate and discover parallels perhaps undreamed of.  And ultimately fan-fiction is stranger (and much more interesting) than truth.

[Brewski @replies]

Hi @purofilion (Sorry, I’m going to have to look up how to properly paste the name link) and thanks for the kind words.

Nope, not from Down Under.  But you are correct about the meaning of “brewski” as a term even some of us Yanks use. 🙂  Of course here Christmas-time is cold so a cold beer would be too… aw who am I kidding?  The colder the better!

I am also not convinced we’ve seen the last of River and am would definitely love to see how she interacts with Capaldi.  I’d had a very elaborate story line all mapped out for her in my mind, unfortunately the writers loused it up by not using any of it.

Meanwhile, I’ll just toss a a VERY serious post on my thoughts on Who Is Tasha Lem…

 

[Brewski @replies]

Hello all.  Hope no one minds me jumping into this timely stream.

I’ll start off with a simple one.  (And note, I am a Big River fan and would love to see her back, but…)

One small observation, let us say, a possible continuity reason why Tasha Lem probably isn’t River.

When she takes the TARDIS to pick up Clara, we hear the sound of her landing it “with the breaks on”.   Would River do that?

Anyway… looking forward to join this.  I have some most definitely bonkers thoughts in my head to share…

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