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1 November 2014 at 23:44 #34474
Yes – I think it it’s sad that the crew couldn’t possibly get away with something like that these days. I still think that Earthshock managed to deliver genuine “holy crap” moments for its time. I can certainly remember discussing them at school the next day with the few people who I knew were still watching.
While I’m sure you may encounter me in the future, I’m afraid you’ve lucked out. If I had known of this potential for sure, I think I would have organised a Doctor Who Forum Calander for Charity.
Imagine, such adonii as @craig, @jimthefish, @fatmaninabox, and others such as the enigmatic @thekrynoidman strutting their stuff for charity in a dress. Personally, although I realise that the voting public would have marked me down to “Missy February” – Shortest month for you dear, I like a dress. It’s airly – it can be much lighter than a suit and much more versatile. I think I could have found many forum members willing to become a Missy for a day for the relative comfort.
Perhaps one for another year, eh lads?! 😉
1 November 2014 at 22:25 #34458The only downside, of course, is that the Cybermen reveal wasn’t a reveal so much. You can’t get away from it when you are filming exterior shots these days of course, but how awesome would it have been to approach that episode without knowing a thing about this episode. To have that X-ray water drain to reveal the cybermen?
If you could have pulled that off – Earthshock territory.
1 November 2014 at 22:18 #34454Is it really bad of me to find that roll-on-floor funny 😆
It’s pretty evil of us to laugh, but what the hell. We like it. And, in the grand tradition of the internetz, that is the important issue.
Superlative acting by Capaldi as ever – “Do you think I care for you so little that betraying me would make a difference?” being my favourite line.
Oh -you’re good. You’re spendid. You could control your merriment to record the actual dialogue around that point, rather than my own sad efforts. X
A local fancy dress store has a Mary Poppins outfit available for someone of 6 and a half foot tall! This is even more hilarious. I can imagine a future Who convention when this will become a thing. As Strax said when resurrected in that DVD short – “Excitement. With dresses! Count me in!”. 😀
1 November 2014 at 21:27 #34444…but what a brilliant episode?
Danny Dead, introduced to the sublime experiences of the promised land by Seb, who allows him to forget by pressing a DELETE button. Because, in the afterlife, you should always should be a choice of your own hell.
Loved the entrance to Clara in this one – Jenna grim, determined, almost snarling at the Doctor to do his biz – and the Doctor’s reaction – “Do you really think I’d think so little of you?” I can’t wait the finale.
The revelation that Missy is the Master? It’s inspired casting, says the man with an avatar of Roger Delgado. I’m sure, in his own afterlife, he’s laughing his head off himself. What a glorious creature.
Also – it gives me a wonderful opportunity for cross-dressing in the future.
What is not to love here? Apart from ME! Cross-dressing. Frankly, you’d be appalled.
1 November 2014 at 21:12 #34436I think the young people have an expression.
LOL.
OK – Missy wasn’t the best choice – your actual anthopomorphic personification of Death, but I think this one is going to run and run. I’ve laughed so hard, with ribs aching that I really dare not go near some forums for fear of heart attacks bought on by laughter.
Some people are really going to hate this.
1 November 2014 at 18:28 #34420@thecrackinthewall
Did you know that Alan Moore has encountered demons?
Given the amount of psychedelic drugs Alan has consumed over the years, I’d suggest he could legitimately claim to have met Demons, God, Flying pigs, Papa Smurf, fairies, and can probably conduct a 4 hour conversation with the vegetables on his plate over Sunday Lunch. It what makes him so remarkable. In terms of LSD, I think he may have gone further than any other living being.
Alan in quite firm in his beliefs. Believe nothing I say – try it for yourself.
Well, if he lives in Northampton, he’s bound to have encountered some sort of eldritch abomination – it comes with the territory.
Oh God, yes. As someone who spent some time there (Weekend visits – I was allowed to escape, and can I just say that if escaping to Milton Keynes is an attractive option, a place is possibly in dire trouble) during the late 80s I was convinced that Northampton, its one way system and wider environs were, in some timey-wimey way, responsible for Dante writing his vision of the Seven Circles of Hell.
What a place. Anyone would need drugs. 😀
I don’t know if either of you saw him on Stewart Lee’s Comedy show, discussing his research into William Churchill being an actual pig? The man is truly a legend.
A link to the video. Warning – contains Alan Moore. May frighten some small Children, but mainly frighten actual adults.
1 November 2014 at 00:33 #34399Oh dear. Another late one for me, come in for some light conversation to cheer me up. Something to get me even more excited for the finale.
Perhaps not.
@pedant @thecrackinthewall
I strongly urge you to take a step back from your keyboards at this point. In fact, I’m going to insist on it. The exchange remains, and I’ll look at it again tomorrow, when the big old red button of deletion doesn’t look quite so tempting.
Any further provocations and I’ll cheerily ask @craig to delete both of you.
30 October 2014 at 13:57 #34310Excellent idea to gather musings on the finale. I’m sticking with my wish for Missy to be the idea of Death, or rather the Guardian of Life and Death. I think it fits in well with the series as a whole, and I can’t help thinking that the consequences of that new surge of life in Time of the Doctor would make an excellent story.
I’m really interested in what kind of structure we’ll get. This is the first double-part finale we’ve had since Series 5, Smith’s first series and The Pandorica Opens / The Big Bang were really different in approach. I also think that final episode was really where Matt Smith presented all the facets of his Doctor with that standout scene with his bedtime story to young Amelia. I think if you consider the mad imagination of The Wedding of River Song and the epic fanboy thrills of Name of the Doctor, you have to hand it to Moffat – he really isn’t predictable.
I do have that familiar rush of blood to the head.
30 October 2014 at 11:15 #34307‘We are the Life that Prevails’, fitting in with Dalek Rusty’s Road-to-Damascus moment of ‘Life … prevails.’
Absolutely – I think Rusty’s revelation may have been SM writing the mission statement for this series. While I’ve dwelled on Missy being Death, most of the stories are about life and the desire for it – in some cases unlikely things striving for life. Life and Death have that joint relationship, and need balance. Maybe that balance has become skewed.
I had a bit of a flashback with this episode to something I read as a student – Alan Moore’s wonderful run on the Swamp Thing. I have therefore picked my old copies up, and have become entranced, yet again. It really is astonishing work. I may have to put up a blog post.
I think the wonderful CGI of the city under the green did it, and there is a section of the run in which Swamp Thing lays siege to Gotham (bringing him into conflict with Batman). As a plant elemental, he’s practically a god and the de-facto “Voice of the Trees” for the DC Universe. I half expected him to lumber up.

I wish someone could tempt Moore to an episode of Who. I have no idea what the result would be, but the man has an outrageous imagination.29 October 2014 at 22:37 #34293Massive apologies – The thing about my work-life balance at the moment is it seems loaded against internet comments. Which is unfortunate. I’ve had another rewatch of the episode tonight, and I came away liking it an awful lot more.
I think there is an immediacy about certain episodes – they play to your expectations. I think the last two definitely did that, and I can’t fault Mathieson for giving the audience what they wanted, but I do welcome alternative voices with their own vision of the Doctor. I think FCB produced something under direction, which IS more of a character piece. Largely though I think the characters are supposed to be observed as the “People in charge” (I know – it’s hilarious isn’t it?”)
There is quite a lot I didn’t get to say, so a rewatch has helped to put back those original thoughts. I think Maebh’s sister had come back from the dead, which I obviously expressed. The main reason though is the wolves and Tiger. The Doctor came to the obvious conclusion that they’d escaped from the Zoo. The Doctor, in SMs run, is allowed to make up stuff on the spot. It’s curious that the camera (in the sleepover scene at the start) lingers over the children sleeping under stones with the Wolves above, and then pans to a Tiger (all stuffed). Have they, to the viewer “come back”. The forest is filled with Predators – which track people, from their start.
I think the abrupt end to the episode, revealing the lost sister, is leading up to something. Like the Wolves, the tiger, the egg-moon, the myths, I think these are random occurrences of Life, breaking through. I shall explain more in another post.
A couple of references to wars sprang to the forefront. The Voice of the Trees claims “we have grown above the mass graves of your wars”.
The Doctor (when claiming that forgetting is a power at the end) suggests that “if you remembered, you’d have no wars…..or children”.
I go back to Remembrance Sunday…remembering the dead, wars and the potential for rebirth.
29 October 2014 at 22:08 #34292..But as I didn’t watch anything beyond Clara’s debut..
But here you are, boring me already. Go away…watch this series, the one you’ve been commenting on, the ONE WITH CLARA, and then report back.
Christ. Possibly on a bike. Tell you what. Stop attempting to bait people – come and PM me direct, and explain that last comment in your oblique way. Talk staight. I live in Yorkshire. We likes it like that.
Phaseshift XX
29 October 2014 at 21:55 #34291Glad to see you, if only for a little while. I’m sure you are aware you are always welcome in this peculiar “Promised Land”. PM me if you have any problems.
All the best.
26 October 2014 at 00:13 #34124Only one choice for me, and an old favourite (it’s bound to be somewhere on the previous pages.
“Come closer and see,
See into the trees…”With lots of nice pictures of trees. The Cure always finish a concert with this track, and it always changes from year to year and between actual performances. A bit like a real forest, it’s never quite the same twice.
25 October 2014 at 23:58 #34119As far as the science goes – it’s exaggerated, but the points are very, very real. Deforestation directly reduces the biosphere’s capacity to absorb, reflect and convert heat. If you want to survive a devastating blast, the inside of a forest is where you want to be – plant tissue can act as a highly efficient absorbent – the Tunguska reference was well made. If that air burst event hadn’t happened where it did, and all those trees were not around to take the blast, the radius could have been far wider.
Direct radiation itself is absorbed in a number of ways by the gaseous atmosphere. In particular, the reason that Oxygen (O2) is converted to the highly energised Ozone (O3) is through the direct interaction with specific wavelengths of energy from the sun in the upper atmosphere. The Ozone layer then protects us from other wavelengths in the UV range which are destructive to most forms of life, including plants on prolonged exposure (in particular it oxidises soil).
I can’t particularly fault the message of this one. Trees are about the most useful thing on the planet.
25 October 2014 at 22:41 #34110I really want to watch that again. Initially there was a sense of disappointment, because – has there ever been an episode without that much obvious menace? I possibly felt like Philip Hinchliffe being delivered the first draft of Deadly Assassin (where the Master wasn’t a Monster) – “All this politics is all well and good, Bob, but where the hell are the scares? Where’s the Monster?!”
The monster, that isn’t really a monster, is Nature of course, which we all have a difficult relationship with. We all love it, but apparently we can’t wait to get away from it to live amongst tube stations, cappuccinos and statues that may be weeping angels. 😉
I think the really interesting things are the links to the ongoing story. People who aren’t particularly interested in that are really not going to like this episode, but the evolution in the characters in the key – the revelations about lies, deceit and adventures in the Tardis. Loved some of the exchanges in the TARDIS with the kids. Especially them all suddenly wanting their mum on being offered a ring-side seat at a once in a lifetime stellar event. Yes – my nieces and nephew could get a bit weepy after a long day out too.
Just to add to my thoughts on Missy being an actual Death – in Terry Pratchetts Reaper Man, Death being distracted and not foing his job gives an unusual opening for life. Things really begin to get fecund in a big way. Also – just on the Tarot cards front, I think we now have card images for The Sun (19) and The Earth (which is often represented by a tree and its roots) (21).
And it seems the lost (and perhaps dead), are starting to return. Just in time for an annual event.
Time to carve out that pumkin head? You know it makes sense.
23 October 2014 at 12:31 #34025Welcome. @idiotsavon made a link to numbers occurring throughout the series which are multiples of 11, and 22 and 55 are more examples.
I think it’s interesting, and may play into the fact that the soldier motif is leading us to the end of the series just before Remembrance Sunday. The armistice for the First World War occurred at the eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month. Multiples of 11, if you will.
23 October 2014 at 12:27 #34024I’ll echo others and say there were some great links there. Mathiesons blog is very entertaining, and I love a couple of the stories – his joy about Janet being his first “Doctor Who kill”, because he loved her work in The Singing Detective, for example.
On the TARDIS weight, the only time I can remember a figure being put on it was in the Tom Baker story Full Circle. Romana tells Adric that the outer shell weighs 5×10^6 kgs – 5000 metric tonnes. Which seemed ludicrous because I remembered UNIT soldiers manhandling it. 😀 I think that Romana had picked up the Doctor’s habit of airily proclaiming things as fact, when he’s making them up on the spot, at this point.
I kind of like that the TARDIS is very variable. In mass as well as inclination to get the Doctor to his desired destination.
23 October 2014 at 11:58 #34023As we’ve been discussing Series 8, we’ve had a few mentions of how difficult it must be for writers to anticipate how the new Doctor will work. I guess that doesn’t just go for TV as this Guardian interview with writer Holly Black reveals.
Her Book – Lights out, is an addition to the eleven doctor short stories by famous writers released last year, and is an addition for Doctor number 12. It’s quite fun with her talking about what she had to go on, and her relief at being to edit once she’d seen Deep Breath.
That entire range is being released again for all 12 Doctors, and I love the limited run in a slip case. Each of the novels have jackets that really are jackets . Gallery of them all.

Cover for Lights Out.
18 October 2014 at 22:45 #33754It’s an obvious one for flatline, dealing with 2-d creatures coming into our world:
Can I just say – I really didnt rate this track by AHA on release. I nightly sit through a marathon on current “hits” on commericial radio. This came on as an outlier at the end of the hour two days agom and I almost wept with relief. Cheers Boys!
18 October 2014 at 21:45 #33736You know – since Steve Moffat took over Doctor Who this is only the second officially Doctor lite episode they’ve done?
I think that this facr could be lost is down to both the script and the performances by Jenna and Peter. A confection that knocked thoughts of what was arbitrarily a similar story to the horrid Fear Her into a cocked hat. The aim of the lost – their intentions and aim were avoided. We may pick them up later – but they remain the lost.
So many interactions worthy of mention – Lovely to see Chris Fairbank as the officer class of his “troops” – “they we’re human scum, etc”. A lesson that we (and the Doctor) cannot select who lives and dies.
I agree with @juniperfish though. Those lines :
“..thank goodness – wasn’t I a great Doctor though?”
“You were an exceptional Doctor Clara. Goodness had nothing to do with it”Was THE killer line, and something to savour with Capaldi’s delivery.
Well done Jamie Mathieson – a cheap one and an expensive one. Can we have him back?
Again –lots to savour on the rewatch. 😉 I’d agree that for the more serious watcher, this may have become mandatory. For the BBCs digital strategy, that’s probably good news.
18 October 2014 at 14:08 #33709Sorry – lots of posts followed and I had limited time.
I agree, in that I think when you look at the writers who came out of soap, you get the feeling they were almost programmed for arcs, development, social relevance, and so the list of writers and what they went onto (Jimmy McGovern! Russell T, !) shouldn’t surprise, but always does.
I agree with the point about Buffy – it was the easiest sell to the TV crowd. Buffy had been a surprise hit (for BBC2) in their evening showings. “It’s a bit like Buffy” is easier to say than “Imagine old Doctor Who, from Cartmel, with trappings of Pat Mills/Alan Moore comic works, with lashings of the spin-off novels you’ve never heard of”. Jane Tranter once struggled to put the actors who played the Doctor in order on screen – it would have been a bewildering sell for her. “A bit like Buffy” – she could tell her bosses.
I was interested by Joss Whedon’s influences, and it’s peculiar that he’s referenced people like Chris Claremont’s run on X-Men in the late 70s/80s. I think the comics writers, like Soap, were writing continuing narratives. Claremont, in particular, was one of those writers whose success was in combining the rough and tumble of comic books with the character interactions – arcs. Again, I think he would have been accused of “Soap” tactics. But it was amazingly influential and, ultimately, successful. When you look at certain storylines in US comics (such as Tony Stark’s alcoholism) you realise that the desire for aspects of social realism in US comic books (burdened, even as it was at the time by the Comic Code Authority) probably influenced a young Whedon a great deal. In many ways, I think comics on both sides of the Atlantic honed that mixture of the fantastic and the mundane well ahead of other media. Perhaps that’s the reason that TV, 20 odd-years after the fact, is looking at the comic books for inspiration? The generation that were influenced by that storytelling are becoming more powerful (and prevalent) in the industry? It’s an interesting question.
To expand, and take in @blenkinsopthebrave ‘s excellent points about the innovative nature of the work in the 50s/60s, the writers were working hard in a medium trying to establish itself. Everything was to play for. You had an older generation of writers like Nigel Kneale, Malcolm Hulke, who influenced a subsequent generation. – Robert Holmes loved, and took influence from Kneale, Hulke became Dicks Mentor. By the eighties, you had Eric Saward, a big fan of Doctor Who, and was a pupil of Holmes, worshiping Doctor Who and his mentor’s work. His work became very self referential under a Producer who encouraged it because – it was what the fans wanted (apparently). He wanted to write a sequel to Tomb of the Cybermen. It’s what he grew up with. By the late eighties, the writers had been influenced not only by love of Who, and its alternative iterations in comics, but other shows. The diversity had expanded somewhat. I think that evolution of generations, the desire to reflect what you grew up with, may explain why early 80s who seemed a little bit stilted and socially stuck.
Just floating an idea, but it has a certain attraction.
17 October 2014 at 09:22 #33680I’d rather be more impressed by the flounce if you had made a previous issue of the kiss. You never have. I’d see this as creating a problem for effect, because you didn’t like my comment to you earlier.
Feel free to do whatsoever you wish.
17 October 2014 at 09:21 #33679I agree with @janetteb. In some ways, distancing the story from the real world can make it easier to make difficult points about the world.
Star Trek, I think, made a number of decisions in it’s initial run that did resonate. The kiss between Kirk and Uhura is an obvious one. Having a Russian crewmate (with hilarious accent) in the middle of the cold war another. Some of the actual storylines are pretty pointed (if a little “hit you over the head with the message”).
When the remake of Battlestar Galactica ended, cast, writers and crew were invited to a panel at the UN to talk about the underlying themes of the show – conflict between philiosphies, human rights, etc. There is a report about it here.
“Human Rights Deputy Director Craig Mokhiber lamented that even the utopian ideal the United Nations was formed around was considered, by some, science fiction. “We look at it in a different way,” Mokhiber explained. “It’s true that we are an idealistic organization… but we are focused on international law and diplomacy to settle disputes. We don’t see it as utopian, we see it as the only reasonable alternative to what inevitably would be a horrific dystopian society.”
17 October 2014 at 09:19 #33678Ah – Z-cars. I’ve only seen a couple of episodes in retrospectives. I’d love to see more. I think the episodes may be lost now, but I remember that Who producer Barry Letts appeared in the show for a while in one of his acting roles.
17 October 2014 at 09:18 #33677Thing is, I can remember similar concerns being expressed in the 2005 show about the various issues surrounding Rose. Do we really need to see her mum? God – now it’s her dad. I got a bit exercised by some of the criticism of Father’s Day when it was shown. Boring soap opera, some called it, when I thought it was a very good character piece about the impact of death on a life, and probably said more about Rose than most of the preceding episodes. I think you can only decide at the end of a companions run whether they (and their storyline) has been successful.
To me, I think Clara has been pretty consistent, and it doesn’t feel forced. I rewatched the “Impossible Girl” storyline in order last year – starting with Belles to Name of the Doctor. Then I watched the product of Name of the Doctor, the Claricles in Asylum of the Daleks and the Snowmen.
Take a look at the Claricles – Oswin, uber confident, perky, controlling and can spin a yarn. Living a double life in her Dalek shell with an imaginary world. Look at Victorian Clara, uber confident perky, controlling and living a double life as barmaid and Governess. And lying to her employer to hide that fact.
The story on the one hand is repeating in certain ways. I don’t think this is really out of the blue.
16 October 2014 at 19:20 #33626Yes – that move to a more frequent weekly showing certainly saw a desperate shift in tactics from what I understand. My mum (who was Lancashire born), and her fellows in the “Mum Mafia” in our street used to amaze me by standing in the street discussing last nights events in the 70s and actually talking about characters as if they were real people, that they knew. A precursor to the “watercooler” moment perhaps, before watercoolers were widely available. 😉 Your comment actually reminded me that Paul Cornell (Father’s Day/Family of Blood) once summed up RTD approach as “The Lonely God meets Kitchen Sink Melodrama”. It was pretty apt.
Yes – that was outrageous of me. I have given myself a stern talking to, and agreed with myself to self moderate to something less offensive. I have therefore replaced the offensive statement with:
“knee-jerking homophobic fuckwits”.
16 October 2014 at 16:08 #33622Some interesting points on the Soap Opera front. It’s not a term I can really equate with criticism for very specific reasons. I think it must have been levelled at virtually every writer of a franchise I’ve followed internet comments on. @bluesqueakpip may have a better grasp of the Whedonverse than I do, but I’m sure I’ve read criticism of Angel on this front. I’ve certainly read it for shows like Fringe, Battlestar (as @jimthefish mentioned) and Farscape.
I’ll attempt to explain why I object to it as a criticism, which will require a really long post. In it, to summarise, I’ll talk:
- A bit about UK soaps;
- A bit about why I think Doctor Who failed in the 80s;
- A bit about why I think the relaunch succeeded, and continues to.
I don’t really like Soap Opera, but I’m sure I saw loads of it when I was growing up because my mum followed them all. Weirdly, long before they became internet groupings, I’m sure she could be classified as:
A fan “It’s not as good as it used to be when [Insert character Name] was in it”;
A Shipper “I can’t believe she chose that toe-rag instead of [Insert character Name]!”
A Bonkers Theorist “He’s acting suspiciously around her. I reckon he’s her long lost son. She let slip she’d had an affair about three years ago.”
These observations were relayed to me while I was doing my homework. And waiting for something good to come on so I could switch to avoiding homework. For international readers, UK Soaps, or continuing dramas are the usual bunch of archetypes with interlacing storylines attempting to keep you riveted as they go through the trials and tribulations of life. Don’t think Dallas or Dynasty, or tele-novellas in Latin America. For the UK, Soap has traditionally dwelled in the ranks of “ordinary people” or “the working class”. Indeed, for years during the 60s and 70s it was the only time you’d regularly hear a working class accent on someone in TV. They owed something to the Angry Young Men school of scriptwriting, who wanted to keep it real. Well, as far as TV would allow them to go anyway. For the people and politicians who ran TV were largely of a Socially Conservative mindset.
When Doctor Who was born it was in the midst of the real changing times of the sixties. I share @blenkinsopthebrave s view of those listings in the content @pedant linked to. It was an unusual experimental period, but a Soap, Coronation Street, really did own the TV at that point. I think society looked ahead. Satire was rocking, experimental humour and drama was in. The future looked good, and a show like Doctor Who which occasionally held up a mirror to the future, and the past was a fantastic idea. The characters, in their buttoned up way, seemed to reflect a spirit of adventure, as Hartnell put it. It was in the air. In the 70s, Who adapted in terms of introducing socially relevant storylines and Satires of its own. In depressed times, it gained new devotees and companions who were aimed to be attuned to the liberated times. Didn’t always work, but the differences could be stark, especially when you had a Script Editor who would accommodate an actress who was willing to make her points (See Liz Sladen, Louise Jamieson and Lalla Ward).
When the 80s happened I’m not sure what happened to that spirit of adventure. Yes – the stories could still entertain, but I don’t think they adapted to changing times. The show, socially, seemed stuck in a rut. In fact, you could argue that female characterisation took a step backwards. Doctor Who was still the adventure, but seemed stunted. Looking backwards, instead of forwards.
In contrast the Soaps were having probably their most successful decade. There were a hell of a lot of boundaries broken in soaps. First homosexual kisses for both male and female characters. First open discussion in drama of the HIV/Aids problem – all on TV before the watershed. Doctor Who’s regular complainer (and possibly chief recruiter), Mary Whitehouse, was therefore otherwise occupied with their immorality, and it took a big effort to poke her a sufficiently pointy stick with Vengeance on Varos. It seemed desperate because it was, and it backfired, as it was ill-timed.
The show, I think, was starting to look a bit dated socially. If you looked at the support characters that were coming through, where was the connection? The real spark?
At the end of 87, we got Ace. Although internal TV conventions made Sophie Aldred be the most well spoken social misfit you could wish to meet, she was boisterous, with sparks fully ignited, and allowed to grow. You had an arc. You had a mystery surrounding her. She had problems with her mum. Unfortunately, the show had been placed opposite the soap Coronation Street and although it struggled against that magnificently, that was a one horse race in the end. A shame, because that in that brief period, Andrew Cartmel tried to inject elements that would be critical in 2005.
We hadn’t seen anything like Ace in Doctor Who since, well at all. Unless you read the comics. A decade before she joined 7, the Fourth Doctor had partnered up with Sharon, a black teenager from an industrial town who said “Flippin Heck!”. What a rebel! 😉 Pat Mills, the writer, said the inspiration had come because he’d been asked to look at a comic for Grange Hill. A Soap – for schoolchildren. This was about 25years before a black character actually strolled onto the TV TARDIS for the first time (Mickey Smith). The comics were always well ahead of the show. It was a much more relaxed social environment.

When Doctor Who went off air, Soap Writers were consulted by both the New Adventure (7th Doctor) and Eight Doctor Novels for new female characters. In protracted sessions they’d draw up a profile for companions. Their history, likes, dislikes, temperament, etc. A crib sheet to start the accumulated story of their adventures with the Doctor. Jacqueline Rayner revealed in the introduction to the recent re-release of her book, Earthworld, that Colin Brake, an experienced soap writer, was drafted to “shape” the companion introduced in the book, Anji Kapoor, British Asian, and a bit self absorbed. Because characters should have traits you could disagree with. It made them more human.
And so it was Russell T Davis who brought the show back. Russell T, who scripted and storylined soaps in his career. Who’d immersed himself in the spin-offs, the comics, the novels and introduced the elements he thought the show needed. The ones that critics rave bought the social relevance back to Doctor Who. It didn’t really need Buffy, as the pieces were really all in place. But I’m sure a reference made the job easier for some in those TV circles. The social relevance, the satire, the messages and banging the drum were all back. About time.
So – as much as I really don’t rate them I have to hand it to Soaps, as for much of the period that Who was in the doldrums, they hit their stride – challenging social conventions and annoying Mary Whitehouse and her ilk. I just wish, during the eighties, that Doctor Who could have adapted in a more lightfooted way to the real issues of its audience. Shown as much bravery as the Soaps did on occasion. They forged a relationship with the audience which I think has been tested since the networks decided to broadcast them almost daily. There are only so many ludicrous storylines you can come up with for a conventional working class street until even the prospect of a moon-egg becomes more feasible. Doctor Who has become that social challenger again, and it is lovely to read outrage from the knee-jerking homophobic fuckwits over a lesbian kiss in Deep Breath.
Thanks Russell for reintroducing the “Soap”, if that is what this is. And keep it up Steven. 😉
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This reply was modified 11 years, 10 months ago by
PhaseShift. Reason: Change in phrase - Knee jerking homophobic fuckwits replaces complained about phrase
16 October 2014 at 15:23 #33620I hope you enjoy it. I remember you were a child of Seven and Ace, and you may find things you remember from other serials being referenced in it. It has a big reveal concerning Ace.
It’s really unusual to find a version that’s spliced together on the DVDs (some of the earliest VHS releases you won’t remember – but they tried to make them feature length).
They’ve done special editions, and Mark Ayres has revisited the soundtracks on more than a few of the Seven adventures to good effect. I think in this case they had the added bonus of a Director who wanted to revisit it as well, and it’s quite nice to have a “Director’s Cut” placing the deleted and extended scenes into context. Having the original as well, it’s just a very nice bonus in the package, but you really need that 5.1 system to get the best out of it.
@jimthefish – yeah it has rushed by. I wanted to get the episodes sorted with a few weeks to spare because I can see the back end of the series being speculation bonanza, with an associated post-mortem period for Series 8.
I just wanted to float the possibility of additional AG episodes to see if some good suggestions came up. I take @bluesqueakpip s point actually that something from Series 8 may well make a good reappraisal if certain themes are still being discussed, and thanks @scaryb for the Vampires in Venice suggestion. More Toby Whitehouse.
14 October 2014 at 09:34 #33538Earlier this year one suggestion we made was that, having looked at the two “Big Beasts” of AG Who with Russell T Davies and Steven Moffat retrospectives, could we fill in the gaps with themed episodes that took in, very loosely, the themes the BG selection played with. So Curse, with its play on Vampire myths and faith, what would your selection be?
Just to start the ball rolling, I’d throw out:
The Unquiet Dead – Victorian unearthly phantasms and Charles Dickens having aspects of what he believes challenged. Quite nice as it’s an unofficial Chistmas setting.
The Impossible Planet/Satan Pit – The big beast of the bad, with something claiming to be Satan challenging the Doctor’s beliefs.
The God Complex – Almost inevitable for Curse of Fenric. Mythical Minotaur in an episode all about how faith can change.
Can you think of any other goodies? We don’t specifically need a story per Doctor, just good ties, I think.
14 October 2014 at 09:25 #33536The Greatest Sylvester McCoy Episode Vote in the Galaxy – Result!
OK – Collating and reflecting on the votes received, I think we have a clear winner for our choice of Story containing The First Scottish Doctor.
It’s actually pretty apt to reveal it after we’ve seen Mummy on the Orient Express as well. The first victim terrorised by the Mummy on the train was played by Janet Henfrey, one of that exclusive little club of older character actors who managed to appear both before and after the Gap.

Yes – before facing the Mummy she played the formidably dour Miss Hardaker, facing down Vampires in THE CURSE OF FENRIC.
Curse got the most votes of our choices, but thanks to everyone who made a preference. Final tallies were:
Story (Episodes) First Votes
Second Votes
Remembrance of the Daleks (4 x 25 minute ) @phaseshift The Greatest Show in the Galaxy (4 x 25 minute) @arbutus @mudlark @purofilion @bluesqueakpip Battlefield (4 x 25 minute) @wolfweed @jimthefish The Curse of Fenric (4 x 25minute) @janetteb @purofilion @bluesqueakpip @whisht @scaryb @jimthefish @phaseshift @arbutus Survival (3 x 25 minute) @janetteb @mudlark @scaryb We’ll show between the end of this series and the Christmas special. Usual routine, with available review material, but I’d strongly urge you to have a look at the DVD for this one.
The BBC has it for £5.25 and Amazon for £6.10. It actually contains two versions over two discs. The episodic “as broadcast” feature we’ll be covering, but also a special edition in film form, which includes 10 minutes of additional McCoy, some lovely touches to the film quality and visual fx, and best of all, a special update of the soundtrack to full 5.1 sound by composer Mark Ayres. Extracts of which were used for the McCoy sequence in last years Proms. Loads of special features as well, which is nice.
13 October 2014 at 02:10 #33477I’d just like to echo others who have mentioned the naming of the beast as “The Foretold”. To me, it obviously immediately brings to mind prophesy or knowledge of the future. Thinking about it, and this series, I kept coming back to the thought “Signs and Portents”. As in end times, the apocalypse.
The reason for this, I’m sure (and I’ll beg the readers indulgence here) is probably down to Good Omens – a book by Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman (we have a who link people!), which is actually going to be dramatised by Radio 4 in December.
For those who haven’t read it (place your order now) it is the comedic take on “The Omen”. The antichrist is born and through a series of misunderstandings isn’t fostered by the US ambassador. He’s fostered by an accountant in a rural village. Adam grows to puberty and the massed ranks of Heaven and Hell await the Signs and Portents that he will bring to signal the apocalypse. Adam’s powers manifest as he’s exposed to the good natured local eco-witch. The signs come forth, but not quite as expected, as they’re fuelled by his very natural childish imagination and his latest reading material.
It’s genuinely laugh out loud funny (with an excellent cameo by a pathetic almost-Dalek), but there are echoes of the signs throughout this series. You have the myth of Robin Hood in larger-than-life (as was the Dinosaur) reality. You have an improbable creature that has echoes of the Phoenix hatching from the moon. You have the dead walking (the Foretold). I’m not sure if this really adds up to much but I keep being dragged back to it. Do we have a “Four Horsemen” yet? I suppose Missy is Death, and you could call the Blitzer the personification of War. Should we keep an eye out for Famine and Pestilence (in Good Omens, Pestilence retired testily muttering something about penicillin. His replacement was Pollution, who was just getting into his stride).
So – if you have a better knowledge of the various Apocalypse scenarios than me, is there something here. Are the things we see “Signy” and “Portentous” enough to be signs and portents? Are we approaching the end days?
* Good Omens – the radio serial has some good early casting with people like Mark Heap and Peter Serafinowicz Louise Brealey, Phil Davis, Mark Benton, Colin Morgan, Paterson Joseph, and Josie Lawrence .
13 October 2014 at 01:56 #33475Many thanks to @serahni for the intervention. @GothanCelt – I was pretty specific about my criticism – However you feel about this series, episode, whatever – please do not call the Gods Of Who to your aid.
Assuming that someone involved in the show will automatically share your worldview is just daft. Full stop. I’ve seen it on the Guardian (our original home) and other forums (which I check out to look for potential problems).
People summoning of the Gods of Who (Peter Capaldi – subdivision) usually seem to refer to:
Having been cast:
“Capaldi is no fool. He’ll sort out Moffat.” (Translation: I really don’t like SMs run. Capaldi is bound to conform to my view. He’s a fan. Just like me.)
“I hear stormy language and disagreements are apparent on set”. (Translation: I really don’t like SMs run. Capaldi is bound to conform to my view. He’s a fan. Just like me. I read a spurious rumour from someone who hears voices in their head. He obviously hates what he’s been made to do.)
On Broadcast:
“Capaldi should storm in there and talk some sense into the writers (scripts/music/A Combination of the two)”. He should shout at the director and stare at the Editor until he makes it all better.
“Capaldi deserves better” My ego suggests I could write a better script. It would be ace, and win a Hugo!
“Capaldi deserves better” Imagine Peter Capaldi working with Philip Hincliffe as Producer? Wouldn’t that be great!? It would be, unless you ignore his hatred of the idea of the Doctor as an “Intergalactic Eunuch” and embracing the more “Soap Opera” elements.
Have I left any out?
13 October 2014 at 01:48 #33474I’m really torn on this. In some ways I agree. I think we live in a age where I think the collective storytelling – the myths and legends, are often overlooked for more current pleasures. In some ways I think if the links were intentional they could be stronger. BBC4 used to strand programmes after DW Confidential (back in the Day) when you’d get a prog on the period of Versailles for Girl in the Fireplace, for example. Another on Van Gough for Victor and the Doctor. After the first Cyberman two-parter in 2006 I remember they showed “Parallel Earths, Parallel lives” a documentary about the origins and potential of the Parallel Earth theory. It was that kind of thing that let you explore ideas.
On the other hand – I well remember the hamfisted approach to mythology that the BG years occasionally took. I remember watching Horns of Nimon and cringing because it’s such a literal look at the Theseus and Minotaur Story (IN SPACE!!) that you just want to kick something. I think the current philosophy of taking the oldest stories that exist, absorb (and occasionally subvert) is probably preferable. It’s less demanding on my glands. 😀
And I’m glad I summoned some small joy. I have a new conundrum for you and other fans of mythology to follow. On the END OF DAYS!
12 October 2014 at 09:29 #33423Capaldi needs to put his foot down and say ‘this isn’t good enough’
Putting aside your own displeasure for the moment, can you possibly live with the fact that you can’t speak for Capaldi? He looks like he’s having a whale of a time. He was a big fan of Matt Smith’s era He likes the type of storytelling that SM is doing. He’s living his dream. His dream may be your nightmare, but there you go.
If Danny and Clara are in future episodes, I’m not going to watch them.
Continuing characters. Ongoing story. So – Bye! Can I take this opportunity to thank you for resigning your viewership at us? It’s been very special.
12 October 2014 at 09:25 #33421I only mentioned it to set you off! 😀 I know you’re far more knowledgeable on that pantheon than I am and was surprised you hadn’t taken the opportunity. How I loved the Osiris parallels you pointed out throughout the last series. Please continue because I can’t get enough.
12 October 2014 at 08:13 #33419Sorry for the absence. I posted a quick comment on the G (lending moral support in amogst the hate watchers) and then lost my internet connection. Which is still a bit wiggy.
It’s funny that we talked about potential successors to Moff once. I suggested that one of the benefits about Toby Whitehouse (whose name was oft mentioned) was that he had his own associated writing team from Being Human, and some of the were pretty good. I actually mentioned Jamie Mathieson in that context so it’s great to see him turn up with a stonking contribution.
I think this fulfilled a long standing desire for me. The Doctor has often been asked (in the BG series) what he is a Doctor of. His usual response was “practicaly everything” but I’ve always thought it would be funny if he responded with something really obscure and faintly embarrassing. Intestinal parasites fulfils the dream!
The Mummy was great visually. Far stronger than many interpretations have been in TV. Another soldier, and one who, from appearance, has gone “beyond death”. A bit of an echo of the Doctors condition.
After all the shite that has been spoken about “celebrity casting gone too far”, I thought Frank Skinner was great. Foxes was great. That combo and the general bonkers feel of the episode. Orient Express. IN SPACE. WITH A MUMMY!! Made it feel like a Chrimble special in the best ways.
What is it about the Egyptian mythos that captivates so much? In the confused interpretations of their pantheon of gods, the bonkers theorist will surely be rewarded by looking up Isis, who first came to our attention in Rings of Akhaten (which also featured a mummy).
Then it was because one of her symbols was a sycamore leaf (Clara’s). The Sycamore being the tree that demarked the lands of the living and the dead. She was the protector of the Dead. In historic times the “Isis” canopic jar was used to preserve the Liver of the dead. Whether you liked the colour or not. There are a fair few other references that surround her which fit the current “mythos” and which I shall bore you with at a later date when I have both time and a more stable internet connection.
11 October 2014 at 16:22 #33353I remain amused by A Good Man Goes to War’s detailed discussion of River’s conception – without once using the word ‘conception’. Tone, you know.
Oh, agreed, I’m sure that entire sequence between the Doctor, Vastra and Dorium should be taught as a masterclass in “getting away with it”. An entire conversation about sex, which includes the line:
“I am trying to be delicate. I know how you can blush”. With Dorium’s very earthy laugh to counterpoint it. I’ve seen young teenager’s laugh at that line, presumably because it mirrors their parents oblique conversations whenever the subject of sex hoves into view.
I’m sure that one of the things that must have appealed to RTD when he was reading SMs first scripts was that lengthy metaphor for sex – “Dancing”. He must have laughed his head off.
I think you can look at the marriage in a number of ways. It was remarkable than it took almost 50 years to have a married couple in the TARDIS, and given that Amy’s relationship to River was one of the firmly established “facts” when SM cast her, I think he knew he’d have to proceed very carefully. I think the BBC are in a pretty weird situation – caught between actually reflecting society and a number of very vocal pressure groups that can cause headaches. I think it would be a minority of viewers who would actually have a big problem IF Amy had found herself pregnant while unmarried, but the self appointed moral Guardians can cause enough trouble.
Save it for the fight over the lesbian marriage relationship between two sentient species, one of who happens to be a lizard. That’s a much easier one to fight. 🙂
11 October 2014 at 11:18 #33351Personally @purofilion, I think @thommck is quite right on this one. It can be really easy to pick isolated scenes as evidence to back up a glib assertion (such as Amy and Clara are “indistinguishable”, when @thommck has focused on the characters over the period.
I think Amy is peculiar one, and the scene you’ve selected from Beast Below is really an outlier. SM wanted to tell a particular story with that one, and it’s actually the one episode he wishes he could write again. Throughout that series Amy is largely “Brittle” and “Defensive”, possibly due to the damage to her upbringing the Doctor did (the psychiatrists). I’d say she mellows in her second series, and her relationship with Rory does induce more natural empathy in her (as she infects Rory with some of her impetuousness, perhaps). Clara is a really different kettle of fish.
I don’t really want another “pregnancy” story line but I like the concept of Clara trying to fulfill what she thinks her predetermined fate is. Things with Danny/Orson have got to backfire or twist somehow surely?
You may laugh at the reason, but I don’t think a pregnancy is on the cards. I think a desire to tell that story was the distinct reason that Amy and Rory were the first married couple to travel in the TARDIS. It may seem laughable in this day and age, but I think the BBC would want to pick it’s battles with it’s enemies sensibly. The biggest “family” brand on a public service broadcaster “Promoting” (as the Mail, Politicians and assorted fruitloops would call it) “Immoral behaviour? Senior BBC people would go into meltdown.
9 October 2014 at 16:49 #33302Anyway another theory time, I don’t know if someone mentions this yet but at the beginning of the episode when Clara and Doctor was discussing about Woods, he said ” that was ages ago ” and didn’t seem like he remember her, but we don’t know how long from the Caretaker’s episode date to Kill The Moon’s date and as we know, Doctor is a time traveller, which means he can travel a long time for months before this Kill The Moon episode start
It’s a good point and is worth dwelling on. In Listen Clara asks the Doctor “how long have you been travelling alone” as he’s talking about creatures under the bed and talking to himself.
The decision (and it must be conscious) by SM to make the latter part of Amy/Rory and the entire run of Clara see them be based at home (with day trips) makes for some delicious possibilities. Their meetings may not, exactly, be in the same order. Hence in Listen, Clara relates a comment that Courtney made about her face during her dinner with Danny (“it’s too wide, so I’m distracted”). The Doctor makes the same joke later, but as if he’s recalling having been told it. Perhaps, subjectively, Listen occurs later in the Doctors Timeline than say, this episode.
After I suggested this on the G blogs during series 7a, the observant and marvellous @chickenelly worked out that for the Doctor, he may have slipped away, bored by the wait in Power of Three, met an earlier version of Amy and Rory and had their adventure in A Town Called Mercy. It was to do with the props that dressed their apartment, and it was completely brilliant. And, I believe true.
The reason that Doctor 12 and Clara may be baffled by each other is that they are not experiencing the same story in the same order.
6 October 2014 at 09:55 #33130Just dashing in to wave hello to @jimthefish
Definitely one theory (although admittedly not the most popular one) is that the moon is an asteroid that got sucked into our orbit at some point.
Absolutely. In fact, it had rather been discounted since the moon shots, but that didn’t stop Doctor Who from making the wandering planet theory the basis for The Silurians (it’s why they entered hibernation and overslept). I rather think that was the point of the line – it may not be scientific, but it’s a “thing” in the Whoniverse.
Just on the moon, what’s quite nice is that it is egg-shaped, but we look at it from the tip of the egg, as it were, so it looks round. The bulge was formed when the moon cooled after it’s formation with the earth. It points towards us and over time has self corrected its spin and rotation so as it moves closer to and then further away, it keeps the current face (the heavier end) towards us.
There is a detailed project gravity mapping the moon at the moment, and I rather think this sparked the poetic interpretation we see in the story.
5 October 2014 at 00:35 #32986OK, before bed. One for the author of Modern Tribes.
Because, as the serious journalist she wishes she was, that column was filled with despair. I love Doctor Who. No apologies. This Modern Love. Bloc Party. Possibly epic.
For this evenings episode. I;m sure we could all name a track with “Moon” in the title. An American Werewolf in London made a thing of it. From the 80s, the second track I had a snog to (I was a teenager – I kept count!).
The Killing Moon.
5 October 2014 at 00:05 #32982Yes, when it was floated that Time would see some sort of resolution to the regenerations issue I was pretty firmly of the opinion that he shouldn’t seek it. It seemed to go against the Doctor’s past philosophy (that immorality was for fruitloops, and self interested people) full stop.
Thinking beyond that, about the afterlife, and the challenges that brings is something else. I think every deal needs a price and the reluctance of the Time Lords the extend their gift must make the drawbacks …. significant?
4 October 2014 at 23:18 #32979Aaarghh! So many times I’ve said this in this series.
I need another rewatch. It seems a cop-out, but I was like this in Series 6 and only Steve Moffat can leave me like this. Which I assure myself is A GOOD THING. I enjoyed it, although tired and I want to see what comes next (which is a five star rating in book).
I’m looking for certain pointers, and will have to rewatch again. I’ve made a rare incursion to the G to explain my own theorising, but will attempt to expand on it (with possible thanks to @juniperfish and her links to Santa Muerte)/
The Doctor had gone beyond the lifespan his species intended him to. We saw that in Time of the Doctor. I wouldn’t expect SM to ignore the possibilities of that scenario, and I think he’d playing up to it. The few Time Lords we’ve seen who have had extended life (Rasillon, The Master) were a bit …well …odd. A tendency to wear their underpants on their head and proclaim themselves masters of the Universe. You know the score.
So what happens to the Doctor, and what could possibly change the debonair, charming, Roger Delgado to Anthony Ainley and John Simm as they circumvent the afterlife?
I think there is a theme here, and it’s something to do with how we are remembered. It could play into the notions we’ve seen so far (and the anniversaries approaching). We are the accumulations of our actions, our impacts on others, for good and bad. I think that’s what the potential dates at the end of the series are about. A humanist once said that we are the sum of our impacts on our fellow man. We are remembered by them by the good and bad influences we bring. This is our legacy.
Are you a good man? Depends upon the summation of your impact on others and what they do, doesn’t it? That’s legacy. And legacy can only be evaluated after the fact. After you’ve stopped living.
4 October 2014 at 16:19 #32951Oh – Many thanks. I think the thing about my current schedule (working a fair few evenings and nights) is that I’ve become thoroughly disconnected from what is on TV, in Autumn, when everything comes back. I seem to have missed every TV moment that people are talking about for about 7 weeks.
I’m delighted that HIGNFY is back, as I had absolutely no idea. I shall seek out the inevitable repeat, and set the record button!
I’m pretty good at Shortcrust, which MrsPhaseshift (rather enviously) puts down to having cold hands, which may also have been your Mum’s trick as well. Apparently poor circulation has a benefit! If you can keep your hands a couple of degrees cooler, it “smears” the lard and marge onto the flour rather than absolutely melting them onto it, and that’s the big difference. She recommends refrigerating the flour for people who aren’t naturally part reptillian. 😉 When you’re rubbing, keep it to short periods, and refrigerate again if necessary. The expansion of the smeared fats (rather than absorbed) during cooking gives it that light texture.
4 October 2014 at 09:46 #32928Morning all. Just before I nip out for chores ‘n’ stuff, a couple of links from the G, if you haven’t seen them.
Loved this little quiz “Who said it Doctor Who or Doctor Seuss”. General fun, but it strikes me there are good messages in both, with some interesting parallels.
Catherine Bennett has an occasional series on Modern Tribes, and this week she’s looking at Whovians (a term I’ve never been in love with).
Anyway, it’s all very knowing, with elements of truth, etc, but the central premise that there is a consistent train of thought on anything in the 50 year of Doctor Who is laughable in the extreme. It would be like juggling Piranha fish underwater. They’ll have the skin of yer fingers in seconds. Catherine should have cast a look at Dan’s blogs for research.
As a tribe, we’ve got more ongoing feuds than an entire hillside of hillbillies.
4 October 2014 at 09:35 #32927OK – little bit of politics, but this made me laugh my head off. It’s a work of genius, but you can’t help feeling sorry for cassetteboy, the producer. The hours of footage from the recent Conservative Convention he must have sat through to produce this. I only saw “blink and you miss it” coverage in news highlight programmes, and I felt like topping myself.
Warning – does contain swearing. But it’s a Prime Minister swearing, so it must be OK! 😀
4 October 2014 at 09:31 #32926I’ve picked up a few bangs and scrapes myself with this work. I genuinly buggered my knee by walking into something concrete. That’s the thing about small furry animals. Apparently they are scared by light, and I need it to see. With someone as inherently clumsy as me, absence of light is a guarantee for disaster.
Glad you’re reaping the fruits and nut of your labours though. One of the benefits of living in a semi-rural environment and staying put is that I planted some twigs when I first moved in, and we now have our own copse in the back garden. Straight from the tree, apples are incredible.
We perhaps need a cookery corner. I’m a bit lazy on pastry, I use a really basic shortcrust for both savoury and sweet pie bases, which works for me. If you’ve got some sharp apples and like pork, try making your own apple sauce. Heat some butter, add in some sugar and chopped pealed apples adjust it till it’s simmering and cover. The apples will soon break down and you can mush them easily. Stir it to a puree and adjust the flavour with a little more sugar to taste. Tastes fantastic.
2 October 2014 at 14:11 #32864Thanks for the link to that article. It reminds me of a podcast that the Splendid Chaps in Oz did last year looking at depictions of Religion and belief in Who. It’s well worth a listen.
I actually followed one of the links in the article to the profile of Malcolm Hulke. He’s mentioned in the article as being of a left/atheist persuasion (which indeed he was – he was a member of the Communist Party until the invasion of Hungary mid 50s when he left the Party). It’s a casual mention, seeming to be used to confirm that of course writers like that would bring their own agenda to the table.
It’s a big assumption. In actual fact, when he novelised his own stories he actually injected Relgion into them when they’d been removed by his Script Editor, Terrance Dicks. His novel of Colony in Space (the publishers preferred “The Doomsday Weapon”) The Doctor introduces the leader of the colonists to the bible and the concept of a burial ceremony (the future explorers having been dehumanised to a certain extent). Reading the book is a bit of a revelation to the leader, and leads him to sacrifice his own life for the greater good of his flock.
He was actually a really good lefty writer, not instinctively discounting stories and philosophies but immensely distrustful of Government, Corporations and organised Religion. Structures, as it were.
It’s also interesting that one of the stories touched upon is Curse of Fenric, which is leading by a country mile in our vote for Sylvester McCoy. It might be interesting, as the “afterlife” aspect is coming though to look at that story in conjunction with a number of new stories we haven’t covered. A mini “faith” season between the end of this series and the Christmas Special.
Oh, and we should have T-Shirts printed! “The Doctor Who Forum Yorkshire Posse”.
2 October 2014 at 14:07 #32863I actually went to medical school when I was a young thing and managed a year and a half before leaving because the word “empathy” had not entered the classroom.
Hah! Yes, you seem a bit too interested in people to have that career. 😉 I don’t know if you’ve ever come across it before, but Radio 4 did a comedy series “Struck off and Die” which is occasionally repeated on 4extra. It was fronted by Tony Gardner and Phil Hammond (who writes as “MD” on NHS issues in Private Eye). It was hilarious on the issue of empathy in particular.
I think the dialogue was: “Yes, we only take the smartest and brightest into medical school. Privately educated mostly, with the social skills of a plank. Students who devoted themselves entirely to study to get the best grades. Then we work them harder still, to remove any traces of warmth, empathy and basic understanding of their fellow humans. In the final year we give them a one hour optional tutorial called “how to care” to make up for this. People who opt for it are marked down as GP material. The others are encouraged to look at Surgery as an option. “
The shows included a variety of Vox pops with actual medical students answering questions on their aims, aspirations and attitudes to medicine, which were absolutely mind blowing in certain cases. Well worth seeking it out, if only to confirm your views.
I must admit a lack of knowledge on Santa Muerte with the exception of a couple of mentions in American genre TV (X-Files for one) where it perhaps inevitably didn’t translate well. If you have any interesting links I’d appreciate them.
1 October 2014 at 22:22 #32839I guess you’re not stuck on a miserable commuter train out of London in the clammy drizzle then!
Nope – I’ve always felt that London is a fine city, demanding a lot of admiration, which also goes for the fine citizens who commute in and out of it.
To really admire it I’ve found it beneficial to stop a safe distance away from it. Yorkshire is perfect. I can really admire London from Yorkshire. I’ve also found it prudent to not burst my bubble of admiration by visiting too often, and therefore stay away for very very long periods, until I can’t avoid it anymore.
As Mark and Lard once commented on their BBC Radio 1 afternoon show, “If you’re stuck in that massive traffic jam around the M25, we’d just like to remind listeners that they can have a much better quality of life in Barnsley.” 😀
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