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@arbutus – what Cath Annabel said!!

🙂

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this thread is fantastic!
I just find it really interesting hearing other people’s stories in terms of Who, as its been such an influential show both at a cultural level (new words like “Dalek” and “Tardis”) as well as on a more personal level.

Thanks for sharing @belshazzar , @fuzeelogic , @gtbi @whofangirl-73 and @dont-blink-2 (and everyone else!)

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Hi @bfinch – just wanted to say that I have some sympathies with what you’re saying.
That basically Clara and 11 had a flirtatious relationship (at times) but that 12 put an end to that (indeed he realised that it was time to stop that).
So – Clara will feel put out. She may even feel ‘betrayed’ to some extent (in a ‘where is my best mate that I kinda fancied?’ sort of way).

And 12’s behaviour is very different – he’s confused, he’s rude and it takes Clara quite a while to see that he’s essentially the same person.
But does that mean she’s a bad person? Not really in my opinion. “Shallow”? I was going to say “No more than any 20-something” but I now think that that would be unfair on people in their 20’s!
She was having fun with an attractive guy who was returning her flirtations in a completely ‘safe’ way (ie he’d never do anything about it). That changed at Trenzalore where her emotions were put through the wringer and then changed again in the regeneration.

But that’s just my opinion – and I agree with you in that it has made for great drama (whether the character is likeable or not).

btw – have you been to the Memories thread yet as I’ve just been back over there and have read some fabulous memories of the show and its always interesting how people have come across it!

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@danmartinuk – just to add my thoughts to many here; I’m for one really grateful that you run a fun blog on the Guardian that is unfortunately populated by commenters who probably don’t read what you’ve written.

And by that I mean the posters who don’t reference your post, but simply want to run into a bar and yell their ‘thoughts’ as loudly as possible (“worst ever… Moffat can’t write… Clara is terrible… blah blah blahhhh”).

And I have to hold my hand up and say that although I do read what you’ve written, I give up the BTL stuff due to it not having anything to do with either what you’ve written or what I’ve watched. And I’m hardly someone who’s drunk the kool-aid and has no reaction of ‘meh’, but I find the level of reaction here to be far more insightful and make me re-think what I’ve watched.

And at the very least have a laugh.

But I’ll try harder and see if I can inject something back over at the mothership.

But only if you include more music!

😉

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I know I’m late, but also just wanted to say I’m glad your brother’s getting better @phaseshift

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ok – Bonkers theory!

Danny has been taken back to the Nethersphere, but it is collapsing and when it does he will truly ‘die’.
Clara manages to find the solution of pushing him into another dimension in order to survive.

This other dimension will be Flatland.

Clara will decide to leave the Doctor and her family and join her beloved in Flatland.

Where she will finally be forced to talk to him straight.

🙂

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@apopheniac – yes, but that’s because I shave my head.

Otherwise – sparks!

zzzzztttc-htst!zzzzzttttttt!tttzzztzttch!!chchttzttzsttattzttttz!!

😉

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@bluesqueakpip – ha! Hiding behind that “they just need to give the role to the best person in the audition” rubbish.

We all know the truth – and that is that the Doctor will NEVER be ginger.

Fandom will never accept it.
I mean – imagine Amy with a ginger Doctor – you can’t. And that’s because it would be unnatural and wrong.
How could we have two gingers on screen interacting – if the actors are within ten yards of each other, the static electricity interferes with the studio equipment.

And that would mean no ginger companions! No Amy, no Mel! No Donna (admittedly dyed).
We’d have to tear up tradition after tradition for no good reason just because someone’s “ginger quota” hadn’t been met by the European Court!

They’ve tried testing the waters with 10’s “no, still not ginger” and fandom was in uproar, howling in protest. FACT.

Viewing figures fell year on year that season just because viewers had heard the Doctor might be ginger. FACT.

So no – we all know what the real agenda is here and fandom will never accept it.

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There was a conversation (by others) before this episode about the Tarot.

Seems clear that the Doctor is the Fool (or “idiot” in a box).
Which was always the likeliest option I think!

😉

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A few new posters here and just wanted to say “Hi”.
I shouldn’t pick people out (as I enjoyed all the posts!) but that’s a great first post @belshazzar !
If any of the new people want to pop over to the Memories thread to introduce themselves, then its always welcome!

In terms of Death in Heaven – I enjoyed it but I wonder if the slight underwhelming feeling some people had was because it actually played out logically from what was set up in the previous episode.
There were no new plot twists or new bits of info. I enjoyed it, but it wasn’t “bonkers” as such.
mind you I’ve only watched it once last night, so maybe i’m wrong!

and poor old Osgood (with tie, scarf and trainers) {sniffle} :`(

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WOW

What I really love is the way Moffat plays with the audience (“ooh, you thought Missy was an avatar… or Rani or.. oh and you thought Clara was the Doctor…?)

BRILLIANT!

😀

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“ha ha ha!” are the exact words @scaryb I squawked when I saw your reply to @thekrynoidman ! Excellent!

Always liked Blondie though only listen randomly nowadays.

Only a few hours before the episode, and I may have to watch it tomorrow morning!

so… some songs that I found on my hard drive based on Death.
Annoyingly by bands we’ve had plenty of, but methinks that are liked by many so I won’t let it stop me! 😉

Death is not the end
(and only by looking for the video do I realise its a Dylan song! There’s a whole thread in that – “songs I didn’t know were covers”)

Death of a Soldier – particularl n this weekend.

The Knock – Drums of Death (UNKLE)
As a title, seemingly fitting for The Missy. Or Master. Well, there’s knocking, so depends if the regeneration of Missy still hear that.

Love is Stronger Than Death – The The (again). But in terms of a title it has meaningfulnessingness.

But (obviously?) this is the one that gets embedded because (Biblical) Death isn’t in the title as its more about the Biblical Resurrection…

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@burrunjor – if I get you right, you’re saying that there can’t be a female Doctor, because if they continued with the current dynamic of the Companion being the moral compass (“one who cares”), then that would be a male role and the audience would think its sexist.

I have some sympathy with this, except that the role of the Companion is not set in stone. In BG Who the Companion wasn’t the moral compass at all.

So with a female Doctor OR with a male Doctor its up to the writers how they treat the Companion. And its up to the writers how they treat the Doctor.

And hopefully they aren’t sexist and hopefully the audience isn’t either.

As for the Hamlet comparison from Jimthefish – if there hasn’t yet been a ‘famous’ performance by a woman, that doesn’t mean there can’t.

But I don’t think you’re being sexist btw – I think you’re worrying about the possibility of sexism (which is fair enough) – I just don’t think you should worry in this instance.

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ok – medication kicking in….

Bonkers theory – Dr Skarosa won’t be an evil Cyberman!

No real reason to think that other than ‘wouldn’t it be neat if s/he’s been imprisoned in his cybersuit and tank, imploring Clara to release him’ (or breaking out but not attacking though we think it might).

nah – she’s in peril!! 👿

But Seb’s gold pin… deliberate to protect him from the Cybermen? Or has Missy managed to figure out how to prevent the rather unfortunate massive debilitating influence of a metal on such a destructive creation? Or is she happy to have such a fatal flaw to keep control?
and will it be used by an ex-soldier (again)?

Nah – its far too small. I mean, they’d have to be tiny…

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aw @spider (and before @Purofilion ) thanks – actually I instantly regretted that post as I ended it sounding all po-faced. I meant it, but still, thought I came across as holier-than-thou.
But thanks, you’re kind

@bluesqueakpip – yeah, I know, I kinda squee a bit with the gang’s all here moments.
Thinking about the Mummy, the obvious is to think phasing or teleporting or whatever but what I forgot to say was that the solution was a codeword – “I surrender”.

The codeword against Cybermen might be 3 words – “I love you”.
Re-connects all that tiresome emotion… but they’re somebody else’s words now…

hmm… 3W….

oops – quick edit to add –

“I love you” is when Clara is completely truthful.

(probably!)

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So, while I’m still sober (its been a long week and I’m self-medicating with a few pints of rest)…

I was idly thinking “they’ll need to break those people out of that nethersphere… hm, now who have we recently met who was able to break into an impregnable vault and hack into the system…? and will they need to minituarise to get in there…

Have all the preceding episodes been ‘dry-runs’?

Will they need a golden arrow (though Moffat’s done a “the gang’s all here” before so maybe not all of them will cameo).

Has anyone else got an urge to see Vastra and Missy to square off? Or even Jenny, but the haughtiness of Vastra, insanity and glee of Missy and both of them with cutting remarks… yum yum!

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Well, with Little Red Riding Hood this song always springs to mind.

It was on a mixtape from a mate and I *think* it was the first time I knowingly heard Robert Wyatt (I’d heard Shipbuidling but didn’t know his name I don’t think) and unknowingly heard Ivor Cutler (possibly the best way to start that kind of adventure).

Apart from the title (which is even more resonant than I thought!) I don’t think the lyrics can possibly be bonkerised into a theory!

😉

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Sorry – been busy but lurking-at-lunchtime (and breakfast!).

Noticed the recent poor level of trollisming and made me think that its not so different on different forums….

So, a Dr Who/ Arsenal ARSE template…

I’m a long time fan, I started watching Dr Who/ Arsenal during Tom Baker/ Liam Brady’s reign.

I’ve been a huge fan of Moffat/ Wenger for what he’s done – he’s really taken us somewhere new and laid the framework for the future, while making the last 10 years amazingly successful.
But…. but….

This last season has been the WORST I’VE EVER SEEN!

I’m sick of the false narratives, where relationships and narrative arcs are more important than individual episodes/ matches.
Why can’t a monster/ manager just be a monster/ Tony Pulis?!?

The companions/ players should be great together but are terrible. I guess there’s always been a bit of having an attractive companion/ player like Jenna Coleman/ Oliver Giroud but in this day and age its prehistoric and they’re merely there for the dads/ for the dads.

And don’t get me started on the overt gay agenda. Why must they RAM IT DOWN OUR THROATS?? This is a kids show/ afternoon match!!
All this kissing and jumping on each other after defeating the monster/ beating Stoke – its just disgusting!

Also this OBSESSION with defiling religion is sickening – why a whole season of a Lonely God/ Welsh Jesus??

Overall the acting/ playing this season has been appalling!! He’s managed to turn it into a soap opera/ soap opera.

Basically Moffat/ Wenger has destroyed my memories of childhood and everything I hold dear in the world – MOFFAT/ WENGER OUT NOW!!!!!!!!!!

Sorreee if for my bad Inglish – sorry as is me my language is not first Inglish*

 

 

 

* I REALLY hate this from trolls – I work with loads of people whose first language is not English and they always apologise, yet their English is always excellent (and embarrassingly I have no second language).

This troll-trait is an example where ‘winding people up’ actually hurts people (not only “people-I-won’t-meet”) whose first language is not English, as their earnest and honest ‘admission’ make them sound like trolls.

The real problem with trolls is that they kill trust between people – they make us doubt and suspect rather than approach new people with open minds.
As soon as Trolls care, they stop being trolls – and that’s why I don’t join in the troll bashing. Its part of ‘the game’ which only fuels it with a laugh and a wink. Instead I want to slap the fuckwit hard enough to shame the idiot so that they don’t want to do it again.

ah well, that’s enough from me – up the ARSE!

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@lisa – I actually had the same thought!

Basically, if The Master is on Gallifrey, he’ll know that the Doctor was given extra generations.
However, if he plots with the Daleks to escape the Time Lock (and if he managed to escape with Davros but tricked Davros into a Cyberman body… and my god, if they bring back Julian Bleach to play him, that will be delicious!).

But he knows he needs an army to harm the Doctor’s beloved Earth (and fill his army), protect him from the remaining Daleks and take over the Universe. And because its both grand, complicated and (Dick) dastardly.

Completely unrelated – Seb has a gold pin (of St Christopher?). Significant?

Oh and @drben – dark but very likely! Will this be Clara and Danny in Paradise at the end? Love and (yet) another couple in a closed-off world?!?

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but here’s a song from someone to a friend who’s died

very interesting album btw.

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although to be honest, I think that this track sums up where we are so far… ok maybe not, but I couldn’t resist the title! 🙂

“He’s a man, with a plan…”

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ok, Orpheus is a Classical theme but… hopefully not to bring the tone down, here are two Orpheus choons from my stash.

(bit muddy in terms of audio quality but can’t find another version from the album)

and

which is a bit more… or less classical. Or… actually more Classical…

oh, and yes, @craig I’ve done “Heaven” before (‘god’ knows where but after the Promised Land was first brought up) but even though I have it I still listened to the link again as its just such a great track! 🙂 )

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ooh (or “wwwooooooohhoooohooooohhooooooo” I need to listen to those Halloween tracks.

However, I’ll be obvious and put a couple up now:

and for a (ghoulish) laugh

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If Danny IS a PE teacher, and Clara IS really old….

what else that the Doctor has asserted has seemed incongruous this series (outside of Robin – and I don’t think he’s had any problems with the “stoopid-science”)? [apologies my brain’s a blank]

and what bonkerising would we make of just these elements?

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Ok – found some time this evening (night) and listened to all the great stuff people had posted (thanks from me let alone all the other lurkes out there hungry for great music!).

And, as I may have spotted a trend of post-ers posting to a thread and then next to the Spoilers thread, I’m even scared a little of reading an threads in case anyone inadvertently gives something away (easy to do and I’m just overly sensitive!).
So, I may lurk around this thread until the weekend (if wifi allows me to access it!).

now onto the great choons!

@idiotsavon – Hellbound Train! Bagpipes! WIN! ;¬)
(although always prefer a pipe with a drone… now, where was that wonderful piper Arbutus linked to…?

and Chuck effing Berry! wowowowow

ahhhhhh @phaseshift – you made me watch Aha all the way through for (probably) the first time.
I kinda sneakily loved it at the time for the drawings, but also the innocent pop (though even then I was getting too chin-stroking to “like” pop – stoopid me).
And of course you chose the Forest (I was wonderig who would and then I realised of course you would! ;¬) ) good video choice btw!

Apologies if I missed who @Anonymous is/was – nice track and a great link to graffitti!

@fatmaninabox – well, I basically saw the puppet and thought “oh god, some dreadful naff comedy track…” and then the fat beat kicked in (if you’ll pardon the expression).
thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyou!!!!!

@thekrynoidman – thanks for that King track – the orchestration (if that’s the right word) is extraordinary – mandolin(?), dry drums, damped-down yet ending in full throated singing, with lush strings.
And though I was never madly in to Dexys, its possibly better in hindsight (so much music was wasted on my youth!)

@xad4 – never heard of him before but was lovely and I think we all agree, we do miss HTPBDET. Shall raise a glass to the stars…

@arbutus – Black Flag! Henry Rollins is just a tad….. intense!
Cameo on Who for Mr Rollins….. 😈
and Tyger… not heard that before (haven’t yet got into Tangerine Dream…but expect to)

@purofilion with her Flatliners six-degrees-of-orchestration….

and (for both puro and arbutus) I always thought this an interesting and not too jarring political statement on the Boards of Canada album “Music Has the Right to Children” – out of context it might seem polemic, but tucked away on an album awash with nostalgic electronic sounds… it has a gentle poignancy.
(honestly a great album).

@craig – perfect! “Is in the trees!” indeed!

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oh – btw,

In Flatline the Doctor says that he’s a bit embarrassed that this species has powers over dimensions and that’s very much the Time Lords’ ‘thing’.

In the Forest of the Night, we have a power over Time (fast-growing and ‘decaying’ trees).

Its almost as if the powers of the Time Lords are being called to attention.
Now, I don’t think that literally this will be part of the arc, but maybe thematically..?

(oops I said that I don’t do “Writing” and here I go trying it on!)

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“I’m sorry; I’m so, so sorry”

Been away from this thread for far too long!

And now don’t have time to listen to all this great stuff!
And now that its a new week I won’t get chance till next weekend!
arghh!

ah well, just thought I had to post this one for Flatline.

A few reasons:
Graffiti – Bristol (not just Banksy)
3D – Robert Del Naja

Well, that just leaves Massive Attack (ok a band-name that could be for many episodes but…) and I chose this one.
There may be better ones, but I just thought that it could be Danny’s Theme (should he actually get to stand up and protect Clara in a later episode)

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I’ll throw my only-seen-it-once opinion on Danny & Clara into the mix just… well just because!

There’s probably a whole blog in Danny and Clara’s relationship (it’d also be catnip to the haters! 😈 ) but I think of Danny as being an ex-soldier going out with someone who is also doing dangerous and exciting things for the benefit of others.
He’s like a spouse to someone in the services (who was in the services themselves) – he knows what its like, he’s supportive. I don’t get that he’s trying to get Clara ‘out’. He’s more giving her support should she find that she’s been pushed too far and a heads-up that this could happen.

To be honest, he’s a bit of “The Impossible Boyfriend” in that he seems to understand her so well, yet be completely forgiving of her lying. He’s handsome, brave, committed to his charges, able to stand up to someone who has stared down monsters…. almost perfect if it wasn’t for a mystery giving him depth [aww…. sigh].

But does he see that she’s become addicted to the thrills at the expense of her responsibilities and personal values (the lying)? If he does he’ll want to get her out of the thrill-seeking, as otherwise she’ll put herself and others in danger.

One more hit…. [ahem]

As for this particular episode’s “he’s responsible/ he’s irresponsible” I think that it may be how the episode came out (I won’t say writing because as a mere watcher, I can’t tease out the writing from the directing from the acting from the…). He was required to save Clara, kids were required to be saved, running around was also required – I think he kinda ‘had’ to leave safety for the sake of the episode (even though it strangely didn’t catch fire in terms of tension).

Blimey – wrote waaaay more than intended! Its just that I’ve been lurking and really enjoying the ethics conversations as well as the relationship ones (maybe more than watching the show at times!).

Anyway, I think I’ll stick to Music as I’m probably better at that than writing or reltionshipping!

🙂

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Hi all – have been lurking all week (just haven’t had any time to post anything!)

Great theories from everyone and I love @phileasf ‘s theory. Clara’s lies have been a ‘thing’ all series – she’s been shown as being good at making things up. So a very believable theory!

Also Maebh (sp?) says that she heard Miss Oswald’s voice in her head, telling her to find the Doctor. Although I’d always thought Clara merely empathic, perhaps this is a(nother) instance of telepathy from Clara to a girl who is perhaps attuned to telepathy.

As far as this episode goes, only seen it the once this morning and…. hm. There were great elements – some of the kid’s acting was great (not something I often say!), some of the photography and effects were lovely, the continuation (unravelling?) of the story of Clara/ Danny/ Doctor was excellent (though Danny’s being exceptionally patient with her lying!).

I’ll go with the thoughts upthread that maybe it lacked tension, although threw in all the elements that could have been tense (lost in the forest, chased by wolves, tiger, Earth-in-peril). I kinda missed what the point of the deep-voiced Ancient Beings was (they weren’t the souls of trees or some life-force – though that distracted me thinking “arrgghh midichlorians!”).
But as I say, some nice bits to even out the bumps.

No one’s mentioned it yet so I’ll say that this week’s colour was…. orange. Yes, Agent Orange.

Deliberately didn’t see the trailer (I never do) so can I just say on behalf of lurkers who may be like me, thanks to everyone for not saying what was teased!

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Argh trying to type on a phone (though somehow appropriate with the conversation)!

Have we had the “they’re not being teleported, they’re being miniaturised” yet?

Little Miss Missy…

Good to see you back in fine (if drug fuelled) fettle @purofilion !

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Just thought that anyone interested in TV would want to know that there was a conversation on the Mummy on the Orient Express thread about soap operas and TV writers.

It may have begun around here but there may have been discussions before this (apologies, I’m not an archivist!)

I for one learned (am learning, but this link is for in a few months time if anyone stumbles through a “TV thread” interested in TV writing) a lot about writers.

Its one reason why I love this place – some impassioned and informed members.

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Soap a bad thing? A Bad thing??

I was too young, only saw occasional and disconnected episodes and didn’t understand the half of it, but even I knew that Soap was all kinds of good!!

Can’t believe it’s being criticised!

But thankfully, some people here like @phaseshift @jimthefish and @mudlark (and others on the previous page – apologies can’t find names) as well as @wordmuse ‘s points have written some interesting thoughts without resorting to simplistic ‘gag’ videos.

god I hate people that do that.

 

Now, what about all this stuff @thatoneguy has found??

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Perkins a bad ‘un?

Maybe – certainly the direction seemed to suggest he was (either because he was or keep us guessing). When the Doctor says to Clara “just lie to her” over the phone, its Perkins’ reaction we see. He looks a little shocked.

My bonkers theory?

 

I think he’s a future regeneration of the Doctor.

I don’t have my notes to hand (so many references to myths in this ep!), but when Perkins was asked to stay on in the Tardis, there were references to the Tardis ‘changing’ people to which I assumed they were referring to his face:

either as a regeneration as part of this story arc (future Doctor has come back to warn him of something he needs to change blah etc)

or

where the actor is allowed to come back, with a nod to Capaldi and he now ‘borrowing’ faces from their past.

 

hm, I haven’t been bonking much and I think this is a bit of a desperate punt on my part…

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oops – missed the edit.

I posted Walk on Gilded Splinters for (among other reasons) the line:

“Je suis Grande Zombie”.

which is close for a Mummy monster… (and without resorting to the Monster Mash I’m struggling with songs with actual mummies!)

🙂

 

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and here’s a far sillier connection (though not a silly song) for Mummy on the Orient Express (IN SPACE!).

 

Its a cover, but a great cover!

 

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ok, so as I was walking in to work this morning I heard two songs on shuffle that made me smile in a “I gotta put that one up”.

and for the first time evah I’m posting these from work (ssshhhhhh) even though I’m waaaay too busy.

anyway, here’s one for Mummy… which is more thematic (like the Should I stay or Should I go was) and possibly could be a song for a later (last?) show, as sung by Capaldi doc.

But it suits this episode as they were so explicit about it being the last time etc etc.

And you can never have enough Willie.

 

 

“How’s your new love,

I hope that he’s doing fine.”

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ooh – well there’s so much good stuff here!

Nice to hear some Clash, but @scaryb – bloody Brunelling brilliant! The Men That Will not be Blamed for Nothing are new to me (which is a shame)!

@arbutus – Band and Butterfield – luvverly!

As far as this episode I had a quick trawl through my iTunes and even after dismissing loads of songs that ‘weren’t very good’ I’ve got 16 tracks. But then again “train” is kinda popular (especially if you have any Johnny Cash albums which account for a fair few!).

So a couple of the unlikely and more if I can’t think of a good reason not to share.

This one isn’t really a favourite and to be honest I get bored a bit of the way through – however it is about a Gospel Train to Heaven… a “Glory-bound Train”

However I’ll embed this one as its slightly unusual (kinda) and certainly not one I’ve heard in years.

Heeeeeeeeerrrrrrrreeeeeee’ssssssss Johnny!

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We’ll I loved that one!
Saw it last night (away at weekend) and loved the tone, actors, monster – the whole thing.

And Capaldi even more solid in the role.

Don’t have much if anything to add.

Will watch again tonight and think of some tunes!

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ah @idiotsavon – it seems in your household Red Snapper divides opinion as much as Courtney (well, any child actor) does in being a companion.

Its definitely an anxious piece of music!

So now I’ll go all ‘radio’ and apologise if you’ve just listened to Red Snapper and are all in a bit of a tizz (even if you’re a dog); so…

 

 

“Here’s one for all you lovers out there…”

 

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Hi @doctorwhocraze465 – looking forward to the pics!

Hi @idiotsavon – like janetteb really enjoy your posts!
I’ve not done one of these sofa intros to myself and it’s probably a bit pointless now, but really liked yours as it was so straightforward.

I think we gave a number of teachers and lecturers here (though I’m not one!)

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Anyway…. she may not yet be a formal companion/ assistant, but in the rather random series of songs for companions – here’s one for Courtney (from the Caretaker)

This is from the album Prince Blimey which it turns out has some eerily Who-related song-names!

Maybe Moffat or RTD are fans…?

🙂

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blimey (that’ll be Prince Blimey but more of that anon) I’ve not been here enough and great to hear some choons!

I wasn’t going to post a ‘moon’ song, but loved the fact that others here did!
Never wrong to have some Creedence and Waits (nice @arbutus and @xad4)
So, obviously there’s a gazillion Moon songs, and I was reluctant to link to any more radiohead, but this one has a few references to stuff like cobwebs, president, Ark.
and its a bit of a lullaby (aawww).

But I weakened and rifled through my CDs and came up with this for the moon* – one of the few albums I don’t think I’ve linked to anything from before.
(*bugger all to do with the moon though!)

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Hmm, I don’t want to mis-remember but I think it was @juniperfish last year who introduced many of us to the fanfic notion of ‘shipping’.

Now we’re getting a Mistress Master (a la Major Major), with Autons discovering how to take over rubber rather than plastic.

A dark twist for the show indeed… The timeslot might have to be pushed back even later.

But loving the incompetence angle!

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@purofilion and @cryptonomica in I think the same episode Clara calls Danny a “ladykiller” as a bit of fun, but he reacts badly.

I think he killed a woman as part of his ‘bad day’.

Still haven’t rewatched Kill the Moon, but really liked how when Clara is with Danny on the sofa, he’s taken the role of a soldier’s spouse – understanding that their loved one has to be away in a dangerous environment, but providing stability and love when they’re home ‘on leave’.

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Eel, very early, head cold and still only seen the episode once so forgive me if some of this is dumb if contradicted by what is said in the episode!

Just wondering if the people being ‘judged’ are humanity.
The Doctor has a great line about how humans would spread across the universe, but he could equally have been describing a virus! Humans can be quite nasty/ violent.

Could humanity’s vote actually be something that means we’re not ready to go back to space.

We need to learn compassion – to care.

And could that be Clara’s future role? To stop gallivanting around having fun, and do the far more important work of being a teacher. Teaching kids/ generations to care.
If/ when she leaves it’s to do more important things than being with the Doctor.

Just a thought.

Oh, and is being President “special” – perhaps!
And another person taught to care.

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he he @juniperfish – I thought you’d be hoping that Missy gets to weigh the Doctors hearts against a feather…

😉

and @spider – that’s 😈 – I like!!

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Hi all – can’t believe I haven’t commented yet(!) on this one.

Have only had the chance to see it once (on Saturday night). I think my initial reaction was a bit like others (the sciencey-wiencey was distracting) but ‘enjoyed’ Clara’s outburst.

Perhaps the silly-science only stood out due to the naturalness of other aspects of this series (especially Clara and Danny’s relationship). But… having read all the comments and the ability of many here to come up with better reasons to make it more in-whoniverse-plausible, makes me think that either people here should be hired by the production team, or we’ll be pointed at as ‘those guys who come up with ways to excuse Moffat (“who must GO cos I stopped watching after the second episode aaarrrgghhh my childhood and ARSE!!“).
[ahem]

But in reality I’m appreciating this one much more after reading others’ insights into what’s actually happening (eg Clara not wanting to make the decision etc).

So, will watch again (when I get the chance) but mainly for the end.

But definitely feel that the Doctor is up to something. Whenever we see him he looks like he’s in the middle of something else – as if we’ll get an episode at the end which stitches together a number of episodes showing Clara or him ‘saving’ others or him setting Clara up for a decision.

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aww – I did have a small bonker (bonkerette?) but its now silly as @spider has reminded me of the (rather delicious) line:
“I do like his new accent though, I think I might keep it”.

Hey ho.

The bonkette?

Well, it wasn’t who Missy was, but what she is doing.

Basically she inhabits the Promised Land/ Heaven and what happens when you go to heaven – you get judged.
“Am I a good man?” – well, you’ll need to be judged. Perhaps by your actions (yee might know him and all that).
Anyway, to make a judgement upon someone, you often call witnesses.
Missy’s interested in the Doctor (perhaps if he’s cheated her by avoiding death), and is judging him by talking to those who died for him or around him. Though not the PC who can offer no ‘evidence’. He’s merely meeting a functionary in the Courts (perhaps who will judge his deeds).

Now how that all fitted with the Papal Mainframe (let it lie Whisht, let it lie!) or Missy-as-Matrix annoyed that the Doctor has avoided being uploaded by avoiding death… I don’t know.

And why a judge would want to keep his accent…? nah. Bonkers theory aborted before it could (ah hold on – wrong thread)

🙂

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ah – sorry to hear you’re not well at the moment @purofilion – hope you feel better soon.

@idiotsavon

both River and Amy turned to writing is also a nice touch. I would like it if that turned out to be a plot point. One of their books providing a vital clue or something.)

you mean like when Clara read the History of the Time War and said “So that’s who…”

(btw although many have assumed she’s saying “so that’s who gave me the phone number” what would be a complete blindside would be “So that’s Who” – but I’m just being silly)

🙂

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hi @idiotsavon (have I said hello before? Can’t remember, but really enjoy your posts/thinking/humour!)

as per your post #32895 I’m completely with you in that of course we could Google it, but that would kill all the pondering and where’s the fun and learning in that?

😉

I’ve no knowledge of drama except as an audience member, but all I can say is that I don’t know if the show is “drama” but at times its certainly dramatic! ;¬)

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