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12 December 2023 at 02:13 #74971
The Doctor cuts 8…
Definitely need a full and thorough analysis of the potential meaning behind the cards chosen. And I’m sure we are in the right place for that đ
Actually, that was my only real quibble with this ep – I was expecting the games, such as they were, to be more cerebral, with puzzles or logical conundrums to be solved, rather than physical challenges to be overcome. Or maybe a mix of the two. I guess throwing a ball around on the top of a tower was more visual, but even so.
12 December 2023 at 01:43 #74970I noticed this line from The Toymaker: âI made a jigsaw puzzle of your past â did you like it?â
We know the flux stands, revelations about The Doctorâs origins and the genesis of the Timelords stand. But I wonder about this. Is this a little seed that can be used when needed?
This is a good spot. There was also the Toymaker’s comment about toying with the Master, which made my ears prick up for a similar reason. I wondered if it was RTD2 planting a soupçon of an allusion of a hint of a rebuttal to some of the past aspects of DW he’d like to change.
12 December 2023 at 00:46 #74969Thanks. Is that the Evil Dead spinoff / continuation? The ED movie scared the bejaysus outta me when first I saw it, although I was pretty young at the time. ED II didn’t have the same impact, although I clearly remember the scene with the detached hand that was trapped under a bucket with a pile of books hastily applied to ensure the thing (!) couldn’t escape. The topmost book being A Farewell to Arms. Great joke.
12 December 2023 at 00:42 #74968I guess it’s consistently inconsistent. Good to have something in life to rely on…
And, regarding your mention of Mel earlier, I’d maybe expect her to feature again somewhere – otherwise it seemed a bit of a shoehorn. Maybe a UNIT spin-off with Donna also, in an episode called Code Redhead, or something.
11 December 2023 at 09:33 #74959The Black Guardian is another good call for a recurring BG villain.
The Key to Time was one of the earliest DW series that had a through thread I think. Maybe the earliest? There was also the 3rd Doctor’s Master series but this was rather more loosely held together. More of a theme I think, but let’s go with it.
The first Doctor’s The Chase maybe an even earlier threaded series? I’m not all that familiar so will defer to the greater knowledge of the Forum hive mind on this one…
11 December 2023 at 09:26 #74958Sarcasm
Definitely. It called back also to Davros’s rant (that word again) at 10 about the Children of Time, and how the Doctor made them his weapons.
11 December 2023 at 07:12 #74953@scaryb et al
I think there are 3 options for RTD2’s / 15’s Big Bad:
1. Something new.
2. Something from a non-TV version of DW (similar to the Meep)
3. Something from the classic series.
I don’t think it will be 1 (just a gut feeling), 2 has just been done, so that leaves 3. My guess is it will have to be a big villain that’s not been used in NuWho so far. I’m going for Omega.
11 December 2023 at 06:30 #74952whatâs stopping RTD from revisiting this idea over and over again? Is this going to be a recurring thing now, with the Doctor âsplittingâ like an amoeba every time heâs mortally injured?
I guess the answer is nothing, but I suspect it won’t happen again, for a while at least. Could be wrong, probably will be.
And, talking about Bi Generation: until the modern era the regenerations were often….inconsistent: 4 to 5 being a prime example here with The Watcher, which is almost a reverse bi-generation if you think about it (two into one does go in this case, it seems. Then again, the moment had been prepared for).
What Raimi movie is that btw?
11 December 2023 at 04:57 #74950I admit to some reservations when I heard that RTD and Tennant were returning – my concern being that the show was in such deep trouble that it could only be saved by bringing the band back together. And that bringing the band back together is never as good as the first time around.
However, I think it’s all worked out very well, and I liked the bi-regeneration (Bi Generation?) as it moves the show on into a new era. Let’s not forget also that Steven Moffat had great difficulty in killing off characters: Clara, Amy and Rory and even 11 all died-but-didn’t-die-really on his tenure. And then there’s River who died in the first story we met her only to have her whole story told out of sequence. Point is: all showrunners have their favourite characters and sometimes struggle to let them go. The writers are fans remember and we also sometimes struggle to move on.
I do wonder if RTD was making this point (a bit) in the “Well that’s all right then” puppet sequence in the Giggle. Probably me overthinking it again….
11 December 2023 at 04:02 #74948The only thing I really want to see is Tennant saying âI want to goâ,
Allons-y is close enough I guess….
11 December 2023 at 01:13 #74945Two other random thoughts:
1. After the bi-generation and the clothes share, it occurred to me that 14 had gone commando. Strange the way the brain works.
2. Tonally, I thought the scene with 14, Donna et al a bit off. The, frankly, unmitigated horror was too much for me, and I had to turn away for a moment. Cauliflower Cheese! <shudders>
11 December 2023 at 00:16 #74944He might become the Curator.
This is interesting. Someone else said this to me, and I went away and thought about this for far longer than is healthy. That would mean that 14 at some point regenerates at least once and can – potentially – choose his new face.
My assumption was that 14 wouldn’t be able to regenerate again, but maybe it’s another bifurcation (“bi” again) in the Doctor. My initial thought is that I’d prefer it if he couldn’t regenerate again but there are some interesting possibilities if he can. Needs more (!) thought.
And…I thought Kate L-S comment (during her rant) about not trusting people who use a wheelchair and can also stand was actually a terrific bit of that scene. It also showed people can be differently abled in lots of ways, so think before you rant. Loved that the standing up was foreshadowed in the Meep when she crossed her legs – it’s almost as if RTD2 has been thinking about this.
10 December 2023 at 23:41 #74943A bit late to this party, due to Timey-zone, Wimey-zone stuff. I only watched this Sunday morning (my time) and was then out at the theatre in the evening, so didn’t get the chance to post before now.
And I’ve not read any other comments, so apologies for any repetition. And apologies for any repetition.
First off – I really enjoyed this. From my perspective – everything’s relative right? – I thought the specials improved as they went along. The Meep was a bit meh (The Mehp?), and the WBY I thought was terrific. I admit to some pre-viewing concerns about this ep, mainly because of the title “The Giggle” didn’t fill me with inspiration, but my fears were allayed in the first 10 minutes.The Toymaster did go full Prince Ludwig from Blackadder @ps1l0v3y0u, @phaseshift. But showed his sinister side with that âsunnier climesâ comment. With the excellent âI was born in Cheltenhamâ as the response.
And this tone continued: some social commentary mixed in with some good jokes. My favourite: after Kate L-S was restrained and her inhibitor restored and she started apologising to everyone for her rant, except to Donna / Mel for the âgingersâ retort. There was a fairly subtle look that Donna gave to Mel just at that point which topped it off beautifully. I love things like that.
RTD2 was clearly on a crusade regarding the lack of tolerance in society, (someone should invite him here to show him itâs not all bad), and he certainly doubled down with the bi-generation. I thought there was a thunderstorm here in the early hours of Sunday morning (when the ep aired in Aus), but now realise it was part of the internet cracking in two.
Anyhoo, I shall now go and read the comments from you lovely people, and may post again once I’ve ordered my thoughts.
7 December 2023 at 01:55 #74834All shiny and clean too!
Nice to be back somewhere civilised…
My recent post on the WBY forum about Louisa Harland, got me to a-thinking about Irish Folk Tales. I’m sure there is some mileage for Who in a “Celtic season” leaning on the traditional Irish Fairy and Folk tales. There be Fairies / Fae, Giants, Ghosts, Gods and Tir-na-n-OG (Country of the Young, that age and death have not found).
I’m no expert, and I’m sure @juniperfish, @miapatrick et al will have a considered view. Interested in everyone’s thoughts on this.
6 December 2023 at 02:47 #748276 December 2023 at 01:38 #74826I would hope that’s not true, and would be a bit shocked if it were. Hopefully next time they will get it right. It would be nice to see Louisa Harland (Orla from Derry Girls) in the TARDIS…
But I’m getting off-topic. Any further Chibnall rambling by me will go under @jimthefish Chibnall retrospective blog.
6 December 2023 at 00:27 #74823<p style=”text-align: left;”>@JimTheFish</p>
Yes!Not your standard Hollywood fare…
I’ll search out the DVD version for the extras. Thanks
6 December 2023 at 00:21 #74822I think if it’s a good story, the casting will quickly become a non-issue and, if the story is poor, the casting then becomes a stick to beat the writer / showrunner etc.
That was one of the problems with Chibnall’s run. He had a huge opportunity to use the Doctor’s gender change and tell some different stories / from different perspectives, but it didn’t happen. What a waste.
5 December 2023 at 23:15 #748194 December 2023 at 23:30 #74798the Toymaker is just the kind of guy who finds adopting foreign stereotypes hilarious.
Well, he is the “villain”. It reminded me of this from Blackadder II:
Blackadder:
Oh, yes. We are proud of our comic serving-wench voice, aren’t we? Just because we can say ‘Zur’ instead of ‘Sir,’ it seems at all social gatherings the tedious little turd who keeps putting on amusing voices.Prince Ludwig:
[miffed] BE QUIET!Blackadder:
What else have you got in your astoundingly inventive repertoire, I wonder? Aaah, a brilliant drunk Glasweigan, no doubt. An hilarious black man: ‘See you Jimmy, where am dat watty-melon?’ Oh, fabulous. I can’t wait for your side-splitting poof, and that funny little croaky one who isn’t anyone in particular, but is such a scream. And most of all, I like the one you do all the time, the fatheaded German chamber pot standing in front of me.The Doctor back on the Elizabethan court but with Blackadder, Nursey, Melchett et all. Now that’s a crossover I’d like to see…
3 December 2023 at 10:42 #74751And agree with the mavity/gravity wording @miapatrick and the Doctor’s salt-vampire superstition concerns @juniperfish . There is something going on….
At last! I’ve written a post without any tpyos!
3 December 2023 at 10:24 #74750Terrific.
Creepy and funny, and with a hesrtstring tug (Wilf!), which is always makes for a good Episode.
The bit with the Doctor “skateboarding” the TARDIS towards Donna made me actually laugh out loud.
3 December 2023 at 06:07 #747482 December 2023 at 05:57 #74729<p style=”text-align: center;”>@devilishrobby @dentarthurdent</p>
There’s also a steelbook of the Colourised Dalek “movie” they showed on the BBC on the 23rd November.They are generally Blu-ray or 4k (so higher quality than a dvd), and often have extra art on the inside cover. Plus some extra content on the disks, but not always.
They do look great and seem to have come to prominence in recent years, mainly I think because people were not buying the plain DVD when a stream is available. So they are now verging into the collectable territory.
I’ve just ordered the 60th and aforementioned Dalek steelbooks (my first ones) as a bit of an indulgence. They are popping up everywhere atm – Disney have released a steelbook range as part of their 100 year celebration.
2 December 2023 at 05:48 #747281 December 2023 at 11:52 #74721No one says âLondon Townâ from day to day.
Where I’m from (not London), we used to use the expression “I’m going out in Town” or “going up to Town” when this in fact meant going into the city, so it’s not as uncommon as you might think.
I’m a little surprised people found it so jarring – it’s not as if someone said “Cor lummy, that’s a right pickle and no mistake”, which is certainly in Mary Poppins territory.
1 December 2023 at 10:38 #74719And one comment on the terminology (@miapatrick may be interested):
There’s a British song from the 1940s called “Maybe Its Because I’m a Londoner” that contains the lyric:
“Well, maybe it’s because I’m a Londoner
That I love the London town”So “London Town” is British English it seems.
Unlike the “cover my six” line that, along with “I’ve got eyes on….<person / thing>”, immediately indicates a US (influenced) writer.
Happy to help…..
1 December 2023 at 06:36 #74718Good to be back – I’ve been away cleaning the bath. It’s a big job, and you know how it is when that last bit of scum won’t go. Thankfully I managed to get Iain Duncan Smith out of the door eventually.
To the episode:
A bit of a curate’s egg for me. I got a Christmas special vibe from it, and they are not my favourite eps. Caveat: I’ve only watched it once, and – weirdly – generally prefer eps. on a second viewing.
Good to see the band back together. Some good humour, and some great visuals. New TARDIS is a big plus, although very bright. I liked the new Sonic Wand functionality, although wondering how outlandish they will go with it, and how much the stories will be driven by previously unknown sonic abilities.
The plot was a little bit underwhelming, and the resolution was classic RTD handwaving and vibes. I’m thinking of this as, essentially, an hour-long expositional episode before the real fun starts.
I have to say I was somewhat concerned when I first heard the RTD was returning and then Tennant – it seems like maybe the BBC had pressed the panic button. My concerns are allayed atm, although I would have liked 14 to be less like 10.
I’ve seen lots of comments elsewhere that fall into two categories: “preachy rubbish” or “best episode ever”. My 2c: I thought the non-binary, non-binary, non-binary bits felt pretty natural, if not a little clunky in places. They served the story though, and that’s a big plus for me. And, I think there is a huge relief that we are not in the Chibnall era now, and I suspect the some of the collective praise is reflective of that. (actually that was more like my 1.5c). As expected, it’s good to get some nuance on here.
A couple of Qs:
Was that Avengers Tower thing the new UNIT HQ?
I may have missed a bit, but didn’t Donna talk to 14 about his regeneration prior to her knowing it wasn’t 10?
30 November 2023 at 09:08 #74711Hello everyone. Apologies for the long gap between postings. I’ve been cleaning the bath.
19 July 2015 at 06:34 #41275For all the (potential) writers out there, the BBC have announced their window for drama script submissions:
We have just announced the dates for our next Script Room for the submission of unsolicited scripts in the Drama genre.
The Script Room will open on Monday 7th September 2015 at 10am and close at 5pm on Thursday 24th September 2015. **Please note that no late submissions will be accepted**
Good luck
30 March 2015 at 12:34 #39311I didn’t realise so many writers frequented these boards. Very happy to give you both feedback; I deal mainly in scriptwriting but a lot of principles are the same. DM me if you want to.
On a broader note, I think my idea for a forum written Who ep could work. Not sure about the mechanics of it, but I am sure we have the knowledge and talent. Perhaps a call for ideas on the Fan creativity area? 2-3 lines summary to start, with a vote for the most promising and then a short precis of the full script? Not sure how it would work after that, maybe one person could run with it and then take feedback?
30 March 2015 at 07:55 #39302@purofilion
Thanks.@donnanoble has made a smart move in asking for feedback, no matter how nerve-wracking that can be. Part of writing is accepting positive feedback, as is re-writing. A lot of re-writing.
I don’t mind the re-writing part so much bit generally have 3 or 4 scripts in various stages on the go to keep it interesting. Funnily enough I am waiting for feedback on one right now.
@jimthefish
I checked out Writersroom for submissions. Currently doing comedy but drama is TBD, in the autumn.
Also looked at Amazon Studios, most interesting thanks. Again they want comedies and children’s shows which I am not working on right now (unless I can squeeze some jokes into my WWII drama). My feature is kinda taken. Kinda. I will take another look though.30 March 2015 at 05:37 #39299How short is the short story? 10 pages, 20?
In the opening, you need to set the scene pretty quickly – maybe in the first 10% of your story, so 1 or 2 pages. Exposition.
I’m not really getting a sense of either the place (where, when) or any of the main characters (who they are, what drives them). In DW terms think of the pre-credit sequence, although TV is fast paced and economic.
I see there is a threat but you need an incident that will set your story off on it’s narrative path, the Inciting Incident.
You have chosen a difficult medium, with the restriction on length. Maybe send through an overall story outline and then we can see where you are going. Hope this helps.
What is the competition, out of interest?
27 March 2015 at 02:53 #39245Many thanks for the geographical info, it certainly makes for interesting reading. Pretty global coverage, although I am disappointed at our lack of penetration in Outer Mongolia but I recognise this is probably down to lack of local infrastructure.
And don’t give the script a second thought. It was good of you to offer as, like you say, RL. You have much more important work keeping the forum running.
26 March 2015 at 04:53 #39219Just for interest, can you publish a geographical breakdown of the members on this site?
Perhaps that data is easily available to you already, or you ask the forum to provide details, unless this breaches privacy guidelines of course.
24 March 2015 at 00:06 #39151Many thanks for the info. I was not aware of the Amazon Studios option.
Last I checked, Writersroom were yet to announce the drama window, but it likely late summer, early autumn.
Radio is really interesting and I have written scripts in the past. Quite a lot of work in adapting an existing TV script but, you are right, it is more accessible.
I had a notion that this board should develop a Who script -it’s a rich seam of knowledge and creativity after all – but I am not sure how the mechanics of it would work. A great USP too – a Who script written by a Who forum.
23 March 2015 at 23:14 #39147Hi again, @whisht
Yeah, well the script is for television, so generally can send to Production companies or, if you have an agent (I don’t), send it to them and they can find a place for it, or not.
Because of the nature of this script, it would really only be a good fit for the BBC, which means I will submit to their Writersroom when the drama window opens.
There are a couple of smaller Prod Cos who have worked with the Beeb, so they may be options.
From a commercial standpoint, it wasn’t a smart move to write something so specific as it limits where it can be picked up. But, as the adage goes, write what you are interested in, don’t second guess the market.
The script would work as a one-off or as a recurring drama, which is a plus.
All that said, the chances are slim but I have one movie script and 3 other tv scripts in various stages of development right now. Keeps me busy…
23 March 2015 at 09:17 #39130Hello and good to meet you. Yes, I posted quite regularly up to the 50th but then only sporadically on The Guardian website, getting disillusioned as time went on. IMO this forum is much better in terms of knowledge and discussion.
I don’t think that the US necessarily has a different Who-view to the UK, but it is interesting (to me) that a significant population in the US is so enamoured with DW and they may bring another perspective.
@purofilion
Yes, I did post around a year ago, prob a bit longer. Only been in Aus for 3 years and almost had to leave at the end of last year, due to visa issues and broken promises. Sniff. On the plus side, I managed to update my script, based on a DW obsessed internet forum ( @craig may remember), and am much happier with it now. A few more tweaks and I should be ready to submit.
23 March 2015 at 05:34 #39124@purofilion
From what I’ve read of your posts so far, I’d disagree. My own tactic is to read the discussions and, if I can contribute meaningfully, do so. Otherwise (and usually) it’s just daft jokes.
I have been away from this hallowed place for some months now, it’s good to be back, especially as there are more of us in this time zone. For a while it was just me and @janetteb on the night shift. Quality, not quantity obvs.
23 March 2015 at 05:23 #3912323 March 2015 at 05:07 #39120I think we can put the whole Doctor-Jesus debate to bed with this one quote:
“He’s not the Messiah, he’s a very naughty boy”
Seriously though, keep it going, very interesting and engaging.
10 March 2015 at 10:39 #38683Not much happens in episode one, of course. Itâs a five-parter so itâs taking its time with the set up and we get lots of nice character work
The advantage of this of course is that we we are invested in the secondary characters, so we care what happens to them. One advantage of the slower pacing of the BG show, a disadvantage being the sometimes plodding nature of the stories (eg The Silurians).
10 March 2015 at 10:26 #38682@janetteb  Many thanks. I did venture onto the other place a few times (aka Guardian Who Forum) in the last year but became pretty disenchanted in the end.
On the plus side, I managed to redraft (several times) and expand my script about, of all things, an internet fan forum. Pretty close to final version – now I’ve just got to figure out where to send it.
9 March 2015 at 12:21 #38654The Third Doctor ep “Doctor Who and the Macc Lads”
9 March 2015 at 12:11 #38653Hello. Apologies for being offline (afk) for so long but last year was a bit of a CU Next Tuesday. RL got in the way.
4 December 2013 at 01:50 #22227It seems odd to me that Smith is the only one to suffer memory loss. Then again, different regens deal with the war differently?
The memory loss was foreshadowed in previous eps (as @geoffers pointed out). I’m reading something into that – it’s what we do right? – for the Christmas ep.
Agree re Silence and loose ends btw.
29 November 2013 at 07:43 #21966I thought the only people who said “Yikes” anywhere was the cast of Scooby Doo. You Americans. Jeepers. đ
Good posts btw.
29 November 2013 at 07:39 #21965GI shenanigans you say? That would explain it. I seem to remember memory loss from another ep though. Could be Moffat playing a long game.
The question should then be: will the ongoing memory loss have any impact on the regen ep?
I guess Clara’s seen it all so won’t be as frightened as – ooh I dunno – a dirty old man đ Matt looks really really pissed off.
29 November 2013 at 02:10 #21954Thanks, but don’t mind me, just messin’.
I just hope that a multiple enemies story is up to it. 45 mins is just not long enough in my view, especially for a regen ep. To be fair though, that would have meant Moffat writing two movie length scripts back to back, which is a lot of work. I would have helped him out – if he’d asked. IF HE’D ASKED!(Oh Steven, oh Steeeven, are you there…..)
Oh and @scaryb – btw – the bath was full for the 50th and not just water. Half way through, the Dowager decided to climb in. She’s a lovely lady but it was a bit of a shock when she asked me to scrub her back. She’s got that many creases though, I should have ironed her instead.
29 November 2013 at 01:58 #21953Moffat isnât just a showrunner and writer, heâs a Doctor Who superfreak, so I could imagine him re-watching old episodes or audioâs, and looking for little plot holes or discontinuities that inspire him to do new things
When NotD was broadcast, I remember having a debate with someone on the G blog about just this. Moffat has pulled a blinder here – it effectively allows him to explain away any of the old incosnsistencies or, as you say and evidenced by @wolfweed‘s post re Unit dating on tDotD blog, Moffat can indeed explain stuff away.
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