[janetteB @replies]

@pedant I entirely understand why you would want to do that. Collectors can be every bit as bad as ARSE fans. Right now in a another corner of the internet which I visit regularly collectors of a toy I am a fan of are getting highly miffed because the company are re releasing old sets thus reducing the value of the original. The poor dears. Their collections may be worth less now that everyone else has the opportunity to buy those rare items at an affordable price. Another version of ARSE fan.

@Purofilion I made up my mind to travel when I was about four years old and to be a writer when I was eight. So I always knew what I wanted to do with my life, just never been able to work out how to earn a living. I fear the boys have the same problem.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@lisa I loved the Peaks District too and the Lakes of course and as for those roundabouts, grrr. It was the double ones and those that were only painted on the road that really got me. We have plenty of roundabouts here now but they are very standard, easy to negotiate apart from all those drivers who don’t know the rules regarding indicating which appears to be about 50% of the local population.

Heading way off topic though so I had better try and think of something Who related though I don’t suppose roundabouts are a problem for someone travelling by Tardis. ah, thought of something. Your mention of the Lakes reminds me that there have been no references to Carlisle this series. Maybe that was an in joke that no one else was aware of.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@lisa That is a lovely clip. Thanks for sharing. It seems to take place before Clara is snatched or maybe she is rescued?

I think “tube” refers to the Underground as LCD screens don’t have tubes. (I think anyway.) Tube could also refer to the container she is contained in underground or the tunnels themselves which may connect into some of the unused tube lines running under London. It is such a network of tunnels under London that I sometimes wonder how the ground supports the weight of the city. (Actually when I am in Britain I always feel as though the entire island is sinking under the weight of it’s human occupants and their concrete monstrosities, which is in fact almost what is happening only it isn’t humanity to blame other than for the rising sea levels of course.)

Sorry digressed a little there.

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

Can I have cider instead? A nice English scrumpy will do with crisps?

 

[janetteB @replies]

Sorry to hear about BoyIlion and the soccer team. Politics in sport can be very nasty. One of R.2’s friends was a keen player and stopped due to the team politics which was sad. It is so hard when they are distressed and you are powerless to help. That is how I felt this morning.

At least the teacher admitted to being at fault and apologised though I would really have appreciated knowing that last night. Front Office have not sent an email to say the work has been submitted after all. They never do.

I was just thinking yesterday about how tough life is for the young generation. They are under a lot more pressure at school than we were and there is so much more pressure to choose a career long before they have the maturity or life knowledge to make that kind of decision (I am still struggling with that one) complicated by the fact that they see family members in supposedly good careers that hate their jobs, and struggled to maintain a reasonable standard of living, despite having high academic achievements. Sometimes I think our boys know a little too much about the world. Too many over the table family conversations. They have few illusions.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@purofilion Yes. I really enjoyed Fringe and it has a surprising number of Aussie actors in it, most notably Anna Torv and the wonderful John Noble, a South Australian known mostly for his role in LOTR as Denethor. It does have a lot of rather graphically gruesome stuff but it is mostly justified by the story. There were a few “avert eyes” moments but the characterisation and stories were more than worth it. Early in the days of the forum there were one or two of us who desperately hoped to see John Noble in Dr Who. I think he is firmly settled in the U.S now though.

I am hoping to buy the DVD set of Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell this Christmas. And just to keep from going off topic too badly,, I would also love Dr Who to touch upon the fairy lore which is a form of alternate universe. (Fairy lore as in pre Spenser and Shakespeare)

(Wow just as I typed that there was a bright flash just above the screen then an almighty roll of thunder. Tropical weather here today.)

 

[janetteB @replies]

@torchwood3 Hi. Welcome. I agree that Eccleston is underrated. His performance was make or break really for the series as it was being relaunched. The first series would have failed and there would have been no more Dr Who had he failed as the Doctor. I did love his grin. Eccleston is known for playing serious and intense characters. The role was against type for him and I think some people struggled to accept him as the Doctor. Sometimes over familiarity with an actor can be a bad thing. I had only seen him in “Jude” prior to 2005 and so was able to enjoy his version of the Doctor and I thought he did humour well, partly because it did feel “out of character”. His Doctor was carrying a leaden load of guilt and loneliness but when he smiled the warmth really shone through. My favourite first series stories are The Empty Child and the Doctor Dances. I loved that moment at the end where he lightens up. The only off note about the first Doctor was his treatment of Mickey.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@jphamlore Read that this morning and was very excited about it. I loved the His Dark Materials books. The film was OK but Television can do a much better job of bringing out the complexity of a novel. Jonathan Strange and Mr Norrell really would not have worked as a film either.

Dr Who has had a few alternate universe stories, Flatline comes to mind. I really enjoy the multiverse idea, even if it is now essentially debunked by science. I would very definitely like to see a series where alternate universes are the key theme.

The TV series, Fringe, utilised the concept of alternate universes well at least in the first few series. I would be more than happy if Dr Who “borrowed” some of the concepts from that which of course are not concepts that originated in or are unique to that series.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

On the subject of that recurring nightmare of failing a Uni course due to not knowing about a deadline or not having studied for an exam, (I too have been subject to those ever since finishing Uni. Seems they are more common than the hand under the bed nightmare which I don’t recall ever having though  I was frightened of monsters under the bed after watching what may have been Dr Who.) we have just had a rather horrible real life “nightmare scenario”. Yesterday received an email from the school to say that R.2 had not handed up 80% of his Drama work and so had failed the subject which means failing yr 12. The work in question had been emailed in but SACE (education board) require hard copy and he assumed that the teacher had that in hand. Urgent emails were sent last night and phone calls were made this morning after a sleepless night. Took him out to see the teacher this afternoon and she had printed out the work but accidentally neglected to submit it, hence the email. However everything is now fixed and there are smiles here again. Now to get him studying for that Maths exam…

@phaseshift. I love that poem. Thank you for putting it up. Sad just how resonant it is.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark. I enjoy the historical nitpicking, especially when it is about Viking or Anglo Saxon periods. I would love to see Sutton Hoo, even if most of what is on show is replica. I noted the carving on the pillars in the hall. I tried recreating Viking style patterns a few years ago for my Christmas card design. (It’s back to Celtic again this year, mostly because I can re work old designs from previous years.) I think they used a recreation of an Anglo Saxon village for the episode. (adding a few characteristically viking ornaments such as the dragon heads on the buildings,) so I suspected that the carved pillars were “extant” and intended to be Saxon in style which isn’t unlike Viking carving. (I think).  I was disappointed that they did not show the Doctor and Clara taking the ride in the long boat but I guess that would have well and truly blown the budget and the boat in question would have been rather humble, a trader or simply getting from A to B kind of boat, not the war ship that most think of when they think Viking Long boat. Youngest son recently did a project on Viking ships and so listed all the (known) variations. Up in the Lofotons they still use fishing boats in the same style of original viking fishing boats. Really simple and beautiful. (especially when moored at one am with the sun a golden globe floating just above the horizon and water reflecting the soft purple sky.) And that is enough of my blathering for a night I think. (And I only have coffee to blame.)

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

An excellent episode. I am loving the two parters. The stories are more satisfying because they have time to play out. I also have a sentimental attachment to Zygons. I love the duality of shape shifting monsters. No one can ever be entirely certain about who is “real” and who isn’t. Even the Doctor might be a Zygon. I also wondered if there can be more than one zygon copy of someone. That raises interesting possibilities.

I doubt that Kate would have gone to a location known to be dangerous alone. I think there is more at play there. I also wondered if she is a Zygon.

At this stage the story is very much humans verses zygons. I expect we are going to see more of the peaceful zygon resistance next week. I like the suggestion made on the previous page, (sorry is late and I neglected to make notes of names etc as I was reading through) that the resolution should be that zygons are able to live on earth without having to hide their identity. It is Doctor Who. Ideal endings are allowed.

I doubt that the Doctor is one the plane. I also doubt that either Clara or Kate are dead though I would not put money on Clara being alive at the end of next week were I a gamboling person which I am not. I would not wager on her being dead either though. I am going to remain on the fence in regards to her fate and enjoy the story as it unfolds.

Enough from me for now.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@purofilion I am glad that you are out of hospital and hope that it is long before you need to return. Never much fun.

Jessica Raine was also excellent in An Adventure in Space and Time.

No left over Halloween “candy” here. I was positively snappy with the unfortunate shop assistant who asked yesterday if we were doing anything special for Halloween, pointing out that “trick or treating” is an American cultural invasion. I was narky because I had spent all day trying to coax the sewing machine into doing what a sewing machine is designed to so,  thanks to R.1, (the eldest son) requiring help to make a Halloween costume for a fancy dress party. GRrrr. I hate sewing and sewing machines.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

I quickly gave up on Torchwood for the reasons mentioned above. I preferred Sarah Jane Adventures, which being written for a young demographic just got on with the adventure with a lovely rapport between the young actors and Sarah Jane. Personally I thought it a lot more mature than Torchwood.

I agree @Purofilion that Gwyn would have made a lovely assistant, with that beautiful accent. I do love the Welsh accent. Oh and R.2. (second son in case that is getting confusing) has only the Math’s exam to go and that is his Dad’s department. I bow out when it comes to Maths. I really did enjoy helping with the Drama essays however. So much so that now I want to go back to Uni. And he too thought the school formal was absurdly priced and so chose not to go much to my relief. We promised to take him out to dinner after the exam instead. Much cheaper, better food and no speeches.

I was a bit confused about the second paragraph of your post re’ the numbering of series. Have I been getting it wrong? Well I almost certainly have. I have a terrible memory for numbers, (hence maths not being my thing) so usually just refer to them by the Doctor and companion. Apologies if that causes confusion.

@missy. I have said this before but having recently watched some Eccleston and Tenant stories, (seriously Eccleston as a “skin head”. Really!!) I am reminded that my favourite Doctor is always the one I happen to be watching. When it comes to companions however Donna was a definite favourite. I have liked aspects of all the other companions, Rose to begin with though over time she began to irritate me, Martha in Human Nature and Family of Blood I could relate to maybe because I worked in menial jobs in the U.K. but also  I think in part due to the writing of those two episodes, likewise Amy and Clara have had their strengths and weaknesses. Rory is probably my second favourite companion of AG Who.

Wow. Only five companions, (counting Rory and Amy as one as they were “team pond”) since the reboot. It seems like more.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

I suspect that they don’t really have much call for Sparkling Shiraz at The Fox Inn, it being rather more suited to our dusty climate so maybe I will drop in for a cider or an after dinner Drambuie.

Been busy of late so mostly lurking. Following all the discussion though  I am still struggling to keep up with the Woman Who Lived thread.

Happy Birthday @mudlark. Your comments on the Viking episode especially were much missed. Actually your post reminded me that it is my brother’s birthday next week and as he is currently “in town” I probably should do something to acknowledge it.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Just re watched The Terror of the Zygons and I was struck by the fact that they say their original planet was destroyed by solar activity or something of  that ilk. (It was two days ago and they were a tad vague about it.) It fits however with the later claim that that their planet was destroyed in the Time War. I also noted that the current Zygon costumes are somewhat improved and the Loch Ness monster has to be one of the worst attempts in the show’s history. And the ARSE fans complain about electric eels. I was also surprised by what was essentially a reference to Global Warming, in the 70s. The Doctor objects to the planet’s reliance on oil and suggests that it is time we moved on.

@ichabod  I too suspect that this two parter will see the departure of Clara.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

I too have been thinking that there might be a series with no companion but temporary companions. In a way the Girl Who Lived was testing that. The Doctor has enough friends scattered through time now to have plenty of recurring companions. Would be nice to see Bors resurrected too. By using a mix of recurring characters and one off companions I think it would be quite dynamic. (Was talking to the local Dr Who fan club Pres’ last night and he said that Capaldi is having “the time of his life” playing the Doctor which was nice to hear.)

@Purofilion Wasn’t Bernard Cribbons lovely. I missed him as much as Donna whom R.2 and I were just discussing. He said that most of his friends think Donna is the best companion so far. I find that interesting given the demographic. (males of about 18 yrs old.)

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

I suspect that those who complain about the guitar are simply looking for anything at all to complain about. Sniping for the sake of it. I do understand objections to the glasses but as my S/O was playing about with wearable technology and making his own computery sunglasses about ten years ago, before they were a “thing” I find the concept of sonic sunglasses rather quaint. I did not even really notice them in this episode so they certainly weren’t overtly featured.

@miapatrick I rather like the suggestion that Missy or even better, River visited Ashildr, discussed the foibles of the Doctor and mixed a few cocktails, and as a result Ashildr then popularised the concept some centuries later meaning that cocktails are yet another bootstrap paradox.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Umm. I seem to recall that X files was a U.S. production and despite being filmed in Ireland and Europe and casting almost entirely U.K and European actors Game of Thrones is a U.S. production.

(Not going to bother putting the name link up. I think the troll has enough to chew on.)

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

I am in the “not Clara’s Mum” camp though I am certain the costume likeness is no accident. While similar they two women are not the same. Clara’s Mum has a heavy fringe while Ashildr’s hair is drawn back. I also doubt that Clara is in any way descended from Mix/master. The question of how the Claricles come into being is for us fans to ponder. There are always going to be threads left hanging and it would be rather dull if there were not.

I have been intending to comment on the discussion a page or so back about the Doctor being too emotional now. In the past Doctor Who was written for kids and their Dads. (I guess Mum’s were expected to be in the kitchen preparing dinner at Who time. Urgh.) Emotional depth tended to be very much background to the stories however it does not meant that it wasn’t there. Troughton Doctor certainly showed ample sign of emotional attachment to his assistants. I don’t recall him hugging them but there was certainly the feel that he cared deeply for them. When Jo Grant leaves it is clear that PertweeDoc is deeply saddened. I always got the impression that he rather fancied her. Baker shows less emotion, but I agree with @bluesqueakpip that the trip to Paris was all about impressing the new girl on board. I had the sense that there was something between them long before I knew that the actors were in a relationship.

I am also unsure about the Tarot theory, mainly because I am a complete Tarot ignoramus but enjoying the discussion immensely. We have a pack of Tarot cards. I have never really paid much attention to them other than to put them up on a bookshelf as decoration. (On the shelf with all the fantasy books naturally.) Will have to pull them out now and study them.

Times have changed, culture has changed and AGWho changes to. AGWho is very much written with a wider audience in mind. It has to appeal to the old fans, their children and grandchildren and now the Mums are no longer trapped in the kitchen but taking up sofa space, in between the quaking children and the screen. Much though I love BGWho I certainly would never claim that it was above reproach and one of the flaws was a (some times only so please don’t pelt me with fish fingers dripping with lumpy custard) lack of emotional consistency.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@fatmaninabox ARgh. The art work alone is enough to make me desperately want to buy those Big Finish stories but The Tenth Doctor and Donna!! That decides it. (Funny how squiddy teethy monsters never look as good in CGI as they do on a book cover.)

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

My crazy bonkers theory for the week is that Clara is a Zygon. The Doctor knows hence the funny looks he keeps giving her. It would also explain the lying to Danny and her ability to ape the Doctor. As I said, crazy and bonkers. I don’t for a moment expect that it is going to be so. I do however fear that this two parter will be Clara’s final story.

I have a soft spot for Zygon’s. They were the first ever Doctor Who monsters I encountered. Terror of the Zygons being the first Doctor Who story I ever watched.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@Purofilion well said. We have lots of friends who are teachers and they too share the frustration of having to comfort distressed younger children without giving them the hug which they need and we are rearing a generation who cannot distinguish between a healthy hug and something sinister. I loved the hugging scene at the end, it was so clearly an expression of friendship and nice to see the crotchety Doctor is softening a little.

I really enjoyed the episode, (as usual) and the boys rated it higher than last weeks. The action was very much secondary to the human drama, what does immortality really mean? Both these two stories remind me a little of the film, “Man from Earth” which explores similar territory.

I am wondering if Clara will be replaced immediately because the Doctor is building up a network of friends across the time periods which can potentially fill in as temporary companions. It would be an interesting arrangement for a series for so. It was definitely being implied that Ashildr would be the Doctor’s companion through much of the episode. I wonder if an announcement re’ the next companion or lack of is pending now.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave K.9 as a kind of robot Gromit? Yes. I would expect if Gromit could talk he would have John Leeson’s voice. I was still at school when K.9 was introduced and though far from the age that I suspect he was aimed at I always had a soft spot for K.9.

Hopefully the film will no resemble the TV series which I think sunk without trace?

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Oh and I forgot to mention @bluesqueakpip and @scaryb who have both been doing sterling work over on the Guardian taking on the ARSE commenters.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Reading all the wonderful discussion here is every bit as good as watching the actual episode and certainly makes rewatching so much more rewarding.

I made notes, rather a lot of notes so here goes;

@lisa I agree re’ Ashildr and Arya from GoT being very similar, something that irritated me a little as the time though I also agree with @ichabod that Ashildr was a far deeper character. (I am not a fan of GoT either.)

I was going to comment on the helmets captured but @ozitenor was even more observant. ( I thought there were only two.)

@starla. That was a good theory. (unfortunately it was this afternoon when I noted that down and now I barely remember what your theory was but compliments are clearly deserved.)

@bendubz11 I like the idea of a Medusa link especially as the Medusa is very much topic of the moment in our household. R.2. (second son) has just made a 3d model of a Medusa head for yr 12 design.

Any mention of Oroborus always makes me think of Red Dwarf and Lister becoming his own father. Tempting to think that Clara might be her own mother but then that would make her father also her husband so I don’t think Doctor Who would go there.

@jimthefish. I would not want the show to dwell on past glories and nostalgia however occasionally referencing the past gives depth and continuity. As you might expect I disagree regarding Susan. I would not want her to return as a companion which is something that often seems to be suggested. I would however like to know what became of her, a Gallifreyan presumably with the ability to regenerate left on earth. As to Jenny, she has potential to be an interesting recurring character in the vein of River Song.

@mersey I am not sure that Clara would have been thinking about keeping the disk for herself. It can bring back the dead and I think that she still feels that the Doctor could have done something to revive Danny but didn’t.

After posting the other night I went to bed and realised just how silly my initial theory was. If Danny doesn’t die then Missy and her cyber army get to rule the earth. However I still suspect that Clara would revive Danny if she could find a way.

@phaseshift. Thank you thank you for posting that image. Something for all those who complained that BG Who would never have shown the Vikings wearing horned helmets..

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

Well that was fun and before I read through all the posts I have to comment because I now have a new Danny/Orson theory. It must be about the hundredth one. Orson is Danny. Ashildr does not use the other disk. She gives it to Clara. Clara manages to go back in time and give it to Danny. Very simple, not a patch on all my other theories so has an actual shred of probability to it. The Doctor knew that Orson was Danny and was pretending not to recognise him in The Caretaker for Clara’s benefit. He obviously works it out some time between Listen and The Caretaker. I think this time I have cracked it. Seems like a re watch of Listen is scheduled. I may have to give up on my pet time paradox toy soldier theory though.

Everything seems to indicate that Clara might die but Moffat being Moffat maybe instead she too will become immortal. This episode was very much about the anguish of outliving those whom we love. Perhaps that is the fate that the Doctor is trying to protect her from. Have to think a little more about that last one.

When Ashildr talked about her sense of belonging I was reminded of Susan talking about wanting to stay at Coal Hill in the first episode of Dr Who. There was a hint at that point that there might be something more to the character, a tease for viewers I suspect. Ashildr was a mere mortal girl after all.

All up a good episode which had the feel of an BG Who story. Nice to see ingenuity win out over might and I loved the wooden dragon. (Lots of lovely Viking wood carving which was a plus.) One negative for me was that the mountains looked very photoshopped in. It clearly wasn’t the Norwegian coast and there were some fancy dress shop horned helmets in evidence.

Sadly I won’t have time to read comments tonight and fear that by tomorrow catching up will be a daunting task. (Daunting but very enjoyable.)

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

Best luck to Boy Ilion @Purofilion. I hope he is less injury prone than our neighbour’s son who is still recovering from his last soccer injury. (He kneed a wall.) Enjoy Interstellar.

Our boy, (R2) is nearly to the end of yr 12. His extensions have stretched as far as they can, and Monday is the final deadline of deadlines. I think he is nearly done. It has been a grueling week involving more than one all nighter. For all the missed deadlines and anxiety I think he is heading for a reasonable result though I am sure it has given me a lot of grey hairs.

Cheers

Janette

 

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

@purofilion excellent steering of conversation back from Adelaide memories to Who memories. Though not as tough as your childhood my teenage years were rather grim and I certainly also found hope and optimism in Dr Who. I must have been 15 or 16 when I started watching. It was when my brother was at Uni. He claimed that we watched it as children on my grandmother’s TV but the only recollection I have of it is something that gave me nightmares for several years that may or may have been Dr Who. I am still trying to find the episode but it is probably one of the deleted ones. I am certain it was Dr Who.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

It was Destiny of the Daleks. That will teach me not to research before posting.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mirime and @ichabod I agree that “detachment” is a far better word than callousness because the Doctor isn’t and never could be callous. He is pragmatic and that sometimes appears callous to others. He focuses on what must be done because he cares and there are times when only a pragmatic approach will solve the problem and save the lives. Sometimes some die. It can’t be helped. He cares when he has time but all too often there isn’t time. Grieving will only cost more lives. His approach is not “human” in that he does not allow emotions to cloud his judgement. He can and will put emotion aside when required, accept, it seems, when it comes to Clara. Even timelords are susceptible to some form of emotional weakness it would seem.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mirime Indeed the dressing gown was very Arthur Dent whom I am quite sure the Doctor does mention. The cross referencing between the two shows goes waaay back. The fourth Doctor was reading a tome by Oolon Calluphid in The Creature of the Pit. (Don’t quote me as to the story. I may have that wrong.) The HItchhikers TV series is a favourite here too. The BBC produced some fine Sci fi back then as well as fine, well most things actually.

Cheers

Janette.

 

[janetteB @replies]

@Purofilion I know Hyde Park well. I lived in a decaying student share in Goodwood when I first moved to Adelaide and used to peddle from there to Glenelg every day and explore the surrounding “burbs”. I found some great fruit trees growing over fences but no derelict mansions sadly, perhaps because I was too old to be adventurous by then.

I really liked the last series. I find most of the episodes very re watchable. S.9 is shaping up well too.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@whofangirl, An Adelaidian? Welcome. I live north of you. Nice to hear that there are fans who liked Colin Baker. My view of him has softened considerably after watching The Five-ish Doctors. He really was rather likable in that, not least because he willingly made fun of his own supposed arrogance.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@Purofilion, Were those gloomy derelict mansions in the Eastern suburbs of Adelaide by any chance? My s/o for many years had an old key that he found in one such derelict mansion near to where he lived. We were delighted to find that it fits one of the doors of our current home. (I believe that there were only 50 variations of those old keys so the odds of it fitting were reasonable.)

Those are very enterprising students and also proof that BG Who is known and loved by fans of all ages.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

I never really had to deal with the shock of a favourite Doctor regenerating thanks to the timey wimey nature of ABC’s Dr Who screening back in the late 70s. When the new series finished they would re run old stories so for the first few years that I was watching a fourth Doctor series would be followed by a third Doctor series and then the regeneration from three to four was anticipated and not unwelcome, though I enjoyed the third Doctor too. By the time that the fifth Doctor came along I was moving out of home and heading off in search of my own adventures.

I have found the AG Who regenerations harder to adjust to. I was very disappointed when Ecclestone quit after one series, and remember there being some rather negative responses to Tennant when he first appeared in this household, though he won me over with the “new teeth”. By the end of Christmas Invasion he was fully established as The Doctor. It was the same with Matt. It took the better part of Eleventh Hour to convince us all. Even though I was looking forward to Capaldi’s installation in the Tardis it still took some time before I was fully convinced that he is the Doctor. That is no reflection on the ability of any of the actors. We have been remarkably blessed since the regeneration of the series with some of the best casting for the role but accepting that some one who looks totally different to someone else and even acts differently is the same person is not actually a natural thing to do. Trust Dr Who to do the impossible..

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark I am not sure if I have actually seen any images of Viking combs but I have seen Saxon ones turning up in digs. (obviously most designers of historical dramas don’t pay much attention to archaeology documentaries.) We visited the reconstructed long house in the Lofotons some years ago. The uncombed, tatted look tends to annoy me as does the lack of colour. They used berry based dyes which provided a wide range of lovely rich colours. I took note because on a now long gone forum there had been an ongoing argument about the colours favoured by Vikings.

I suspect that the anomalies in armour etc are due to the demands of the story. I hope so anyway as it does look as though some attention has been paid to getting some of the elements right. I hope that your visitors turn out to be fans after all so you won’t have to wait until the 27th to comment.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Cool pictures. The vikings have combs!! Very nice to see. I have been visiting a costume site recently where the tendency to depict ancient peoples with wild tangled hair is a constant niggle. The Maisie Williams’s character’s hair appears to be very nicely done. I also like the battered shields and of course the buildings.

The monster of the week monsters appear somewhat more threatening in those photos than in previous pictures which have focused only on the oversize head which make them look rather like rusty Marvins.

Really looking forward to the next episode. If I had a time machine then Viking Iceland would be high on my “places to go” list. A few years ago I became really interested in the Icelandic sagas. I still have a few to read though.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

I have been slowly catching up and as usual the posts come in faster than I can read.

I made a few notes as I read. So many excellent posts, really enjoyed reading the discussion as much as watching the actual episode. I would like to comment on more of the posts but would mostly be to say, “well said” or “hear hear” so to move on;

Nice to hear from you @jimthefish. I was concerned that you had gone AWOL. You certainly have a lot of reading to catch upon but worth it if you can spare the time.

@mudlark like you I was wondering why the monster of the week was called The Fisher King. He bore no resemblance to the mythical Fisher King to my knowledge. I was wondering if I had missed something.

@juniperfish, going way back to the Gallifrey discussion, I just wanted to point out that not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords. I would be quite happy to learn more about the thus far mostly neglected citizens of Gallifrey. I really loved the workshop scene and the prequel about the guard in training.

@pedant I really loved The Flipside of Dominic Hyde when I was a teenager. I have always loved a good time paradox.

@Purofilion. I had a new theory the other day on re watching Listen for the 100th time, (well not quite but must be almost), It might be Missy under the blanket. It clearly isn’t Missy who appears behind them but I am not going to let that spoil a bonkers theory. Also I would recommend watching Interstellar. I found it interesting though it certainly would benefit from more than one viewing.

I might leave comments about the episode until  I have watched it again, not that there will be anything new or original to say but have been up most of the night helping with Yr 12 stuff and right now I barely recall anything at all about it.

Cheers

Janette

 

 

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As this is the Cloven Hoof I need no excuse to say welcome back @rob. Hope life is treating you well and reenactments are still a thing.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

On the subject of Who related podcasts I have been intending to share a a link to this one, http://womentalkscifi.com/ . It is not specific to Who but there are plenty of interviews there of past actors etc. I believe they recently interviewed Matt Smith and Alex Kingston. Not sure if those are “up” on site yet or not. Lots of interesting stuff about other sci fi favourites too. (One of the women who runs it is a friend of mine.)

Cheers

Janette

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@mudlark. The history of archaeological studies in the UK might be off topic but still very interesting. When I first really became interested in archaeology I read a book by Mike Pitts about Stonehenge primarily but he covered the history of the archaeology of the area which was every bit as interesting as the main topic being discussed.

And just to try and steer this back to “on topic” umm, oh drat. I give up. Archaeology, evil corporations, military and mysterious buried objects are common Sci fi tropes. That is as close as I can get.

Cheers

Janette

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@lisa thanks for the link. That is lovely. I was in a lego shop on Saturday but no sign of any Lego Dr Who, yet. They have done a good job with that set.  I especially like the Dalek. Not bad, for Lego…

Cheers

Janette

 

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Thanks for putting up the image @craig. I have not yet had the chance to re watch the episode so was useful to study it in more detail. Those still like like Star Trek crew on the ship, a references to ship’s crew, be it space ship or sailing ship so fairly straight forward. @bluesqueakpip That looks more like a woman in the serpent’s mouth. “She” appears to be wearing a skirt so not the Doctor I think but Clara.

Serpent in lake= lake monster and not between the Arts and Sciences. (Sorry old Uni joke but I think of it every time I hear the words “Lake Monster.”)

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

@ichabod It may be a lighter wine but thus far it has been a fine vintage. I am certain however that there will be “heavier” wines to come. But it is a very long wait til Sunday. (Saturday for most.)

Cheers

Janette.

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It maybe that the Doctor is “faking” his death in some way in order to remind Clara that their “adventures” have serious, often tragic consequences.

Still have to re-watch but one of lovely things about this forum is that now I have so many more things to look out for.

@ichabod and @purofilion They have seen three episodes thus far and are proclaiming that series 9 is so much better than series 8. Fans can be so fickle I fear the positive comments will not last. They will condemn an entire series because they dislike one episode and cry “Moffat must go” etc etc. I read through the Guardian BTL the other day and most comments were positive and what was even nicer was the the positives had a lot of recommends while the usual trolls were only getting one if any. There is still hope.

Cheers

Janette

 

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@blenkinsopthebrave. You have good eyes. (Trust Dr Who to make an innocuous phrase sound ominous.) I had not spotted either the poster all the church. After much use of the pause button I must say the church does look more like a military building a hanger or something with the standard Russian Orthodox copulas on top, either something adapted to the purpose or as @bluesqueakpip suggests a military base adapted to resemble a Russian town for training purposes. Whichever it does have echoes of Curse of Fenric, especially as it is evident that there will be some form of Viking encounter in upcoming episodes. Curse of Fenric is the only former Dr Who story to have touched upon Viking mythology. (to my knowledge.) Monsters in lakes also occur in Viking lore. I suspect that what we might have is a mish mash of mythologies.

I don’t know much about the geography of Caithness not having travelled beyond Dunrobbin Castle in Sutherlandshire, but from what  I have read it is mostly flat and marshy. Is the valley below the reservoir wall a likely Caithness location?

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@ichabod The Fisher King first appears in the medieval Arthurian legends. He is impotent due to injury and because the vitality of the king was linked to the fertility of the land his impotence leads to crops failing and famine. I have to confess that it has been so many years since I read Le Morte d’Arthur that I had to do a quick refresher courtesy of Wikipedia. Interesting that one of the knights sent to assist the Fisher King in one version was Bors. Also it is theorised that the Fisher King has roots in older mythologies such as the Mabinogion and the character of Bran who has a cauldron which can resurrect the dead though the resurrected are unable to speak.

I don’t think the Fisher King was necessarily a “bad guy”, though in Malory at least almost none of the knights or kings encountered appear to be particularly nice but maybe that is a legacy of the passage of time and changing values of the reader.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@Purofilion. I thought there were Star Trek officers in the painting too. In fact that was all I saw of it. Must look at it again. That however will have to wait till tomorrow.

Cheers

Janette

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Just an amusing aside, this series is copying our D&D sessions. Last week with the snake man and this week with ghosts. (Last night the party were fighting ghosts after opening a sarcophagus which contained a snake entity skeleton that controlled the ghosts.)

Back to the story I am guessing that the oil found is in some way linked to the space ship also wondered why the first ghost appears to be wearing Victorian garb, especially if he is alien.

Just read some of the comments BTL. It seems that apart from the obvious dial in troll, they are mostly positive.

Cheers

Janette.

 

[janetteB @replies]

Have now read the comments. I really need to re watch and see that painting again that @bluesqueakpip pointed out. I had forgotten about that.

@phaseshift and @mudlark  I did not make the Quatermass connection until reading your posts but realised that was what the seemingly empty spaceship was reminding me of.

It occurs to me that the ghosts are some kind of hologram projection. Clara as the hologram being the Checkov’s duck/gun as it were.

I missed the sword in the lake suggestion. Must be overdue for a brush up on Arthurian legend. Lakes are also rather prone to harbouring the odd monster, certainly in both British and Scandinavian mythology, monster and sword maybe? Lakes can also be portals where different worlds/dimensions collide. Maybe something is leaking through from another reality. Lots to ponder.

One of the best things about reading all the comments is that the second watch is so much more rewarding.

Cheers

Janette

 

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