[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent You have convinced me to watch the episode. I confused it with the previous Dalek New Year’s Special which wasn’t bad and so thought I had seen this one until I reread Craig’s intro.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent I did not think it would be but some people are very sensitive when it comes to spoilers. The question of what is or isn’t a spoiler has led to many a heated family argument in our household.

A Christmas Special written by Moffat is really more of a present than a spoiler.

As to meaning the opposite of what one says, we are currently doing driving lessons with son2 and constantly saying the opposite of what we mean, “left, no I mean right,” , “turn, no keep going.” (We have currently done about 20 hours out of 65. As people who rarely venture beyond the boundaries of our provincial town it is proving challenging.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent I should remember that because I have watched Survival but it was a long time ago.

Yes Moffat is doing the Christmas Special. (I hope that doesn’t count as a Spoiler.)

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@whohar I did not know that. They worked so well together and shared a birthday along with their favourite enemy. (Was the Master in the McCoy series? I have only watched the later ones.)  A now belated Happy Birthday to Sylvester and Sophie.

I know that several Doctors have birthdays in April but that is due to personal bias. My S/O shares a birthday with David Tennant.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@winston we watch the Christmas episodes every Christmas too in order. We usually start in early December but never seem to get through them all so our Christmas sounds a lot like yours only in our case it is usually hitting 40c and we are worrying about whether the garden will make it through another blasting summer and hoping there will not be too many bushfires.Doctor Who is a welcome relief from all that. I particularly like the episodes that feature snow.

I am really looking forward to this year’s special. Moffat and Christmas go together. He does whimsical well. (I am currently watching Douglas is Cancelled. Not whimsical but very Moffat.)

cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@winston I liked the cat people in Gridlock too. And kittens!! and Father Dougal though when I first watched Gridlock I had only seen him in My Hero. Not a great comedy series but the boys liked it when they were young.

Oxygen is depressing but very good.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. The only specials I am not keen on were those at the end of Tennant’s first run. Perhaps I should re watch the End of Time. It might be deserving of a second chance.

I am a fan of all the Christmas Specials though I didn’t mention them as they are mostly Moffat’s and I love Dickens so the Dickensian elements are fine with me. Last Christmas is probably the best of them. Husbands of River Song maybe the worst. It does not start of well but that scene on the spaceship when she realises that the Doctor is indeed standing there next to her gets me every time. It makes the episode worth watching.

RTD’s Christmas Specials were pretty good too. I disliked the giant stompy robot crushing half of London that nobody ever heard of in The Next Doctor. Liked the episode, except from some wacky costuming, up to that point. Why no mention of something that destructive in history? Moffat gets a pass for the dinosaur in the Thames because it is explained. Maybe not a particularly convincing explanation but at least Moffat tries.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. I looked back to see what I said previously about this episode and found that I did not. That is not a reflection of my view of the episode. I often fail to comment partly because I get overwhelmed by the discussion and feel I have nothing to add. I have only watched this episode once so going from memory, Really liked Ruth/doc. She had the authority that J.W. lacked. So like so many Chib era stories, there were good parts, there was potential but overall it just did not hold together. I think you hit the mark with “Throw everything at it”, and so the narrative ends up being incoherent. Plot lines are set up but never satisfyingly resolved. It felt like bits of a good episode mixed into narrative spaghetti.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent I like The Doctor, the Widow and the Wardrobe. Trees that grow baubles, Manny, and likeable kids, especially the Doctor. Matt Smith worked well with children. He played well to the childish side of the Doctor.

I would have voted Love and Monsters as RTD’s worst (avoiding rockets) however I think the first two episodes of this most recent series would be contenders for that award. I agree it started out well with the fan club. It just went downhill sharply. The rest of RTD’s are generally good. I did not like the specials, and really didn’t like the Tennant finals. (I don’t even remember the names of those because I have never re-watched. Tried and gave up.)

Cheers

Janette.

 

[janetteB @replies]

I do like making lists. Had to refresh my memory of every series and make notes. So series by series,

Series 1 Dalek with an honourary mention for Bad Wolf.

Series 2 School Reunion because Sarah Jane Smith. This is in my view one of the worst series. There just were no other decent episodes except the obvious. (Girl in the Fireplace)

Series 3 Some “bangers” in this series. Human Nature/Family of Blood are outstanding. Gridlock is a close runner up, and Shakespeare Code was fun.

Series 4 Turn Left. Lots of good episodes, Fires of Pompeii, Planet of the Ood, Midnight.

Series 5 Vincent. Vampires of Venice is not bad. This series has the worst episode penned by Moffat, the Beast Below. (Not as bad as RTD’s worst)

Series 6. I could not choose any one not written by Moffat, I have never really liked The Doctor’s Wife so maybe The Girl who Waited.

Series 7 Cold War.

Series 8 Another solid season with one notable exception. Hard to chose a “best” but will settle for Mummy on the Orient Express because Jelly Babies with Flatline a very close runner up. Into the Dalek and Time Heist also very good.

Series 9 Face the Raven, followed by Under the Lake two parter.

Series 10 Eaters of Light. then Oxygen and Thin Ice.

Series 11 It Takes You Away. Love a fiord. Demons of the Punjab wasn’t bad. Witchfinders was silly but fun.

Series 12 Villa Diadati was watchable and featured Mary Shelley. But by now the bar is low as @dentarthurdent observed.

Series 13. I’d given up so nill.

Series 14 Yay, there is competition again. 73 Yards probably but Rogue would be a contender and Dot and Bubble is also worthy of a mention. I have not yet rewatched so this might change.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

I just read @ps1l0v3y0u ‘s comment in the Website thread and now I get it. Innuendo. Yes. It goes with Captain Jack really. Captain Jack, talks in double entendre. (Most of which probably goes whooshing over my head too.)

Doctor Dances/Empty Child are classics. I think they are now old enough to have acquired that status. Nearly twenty years since Rose brought Who back to our screens. (I am keeping an eye on the date because the podcast I produce features tv from 20 years ago and before.)

I really should be using the quiet time to catch up on the most recent series threads, but RL has been hectic of late. If I am not busy then I am feeling guilty for not being busy. The weather is warming up too so I have been trying to do some gardening before it gets too hot. Possums have been wrecking havoc out there. it looks as though a Tardis has crash landed in one area. In fact overall our backyard resembles Amy’s overgrown garden.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@winston.

maybe they are watching the Olympics.

Not us. We have just finished re watching the first Matt Smith series and are now onto the second series, The Doctor’s Wife tonight. I always miss things on first watch too.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent Sacha Dhawan came to my attention first in An Adventure in Space and Time playing Waris Hussien and then again in Dracula episode 2. He also has a major role in The Great.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent Another interesting review. I always enjoy your episodes reviews, sometimes more than the episode covered. This may be one of those. I have only watched this episode once and recall that it was engaging enough at the time but left very little impression afterwards. It had enjoyable moments though, as I probably mentioned above, I was disappointed by the casting of The Master as Sscha Dhawan was top of my wish list for a future Doctor. He has the right kind of energy for the role. The script did have more plot holes than a local road after heavy rain but then, that is something I tend to overlook in Dr Who provided the story and characters compensate. Not sure they really do in this episode, though as I recall it is better than those that follow, (with a couple of exceptions)

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@devilishrobby Have not been keeping up with discussion but just saw your mention of B.5. Me too. In fact I am currently editing a podcast about B.5. We tried convincing the younger members of the podcast group of its brilliance but I am afraid we failed to impress them.

I agree that there is something quintessentially British about DR Who. The 90s movie failed to capture that which is why it bombed. There is certainly a market in the U.S for that but is it probably never going to be huge hence the changes to tv series that you mention.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

I hope that all our Canadian members are safe from the fires.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@whohar I was hoping that Gatwa would do at least three seasons. I guess it all comes down to the funding. Relying on streaming brings problems too. There are now so many competing services and most people can only afford one at a time. Most friends cycle between services now. Also unfortunately, those first two episodes will have lost viewers. We had to persuade second son to stick around for the third episode then he stayed for the rest of the series. With so much to choose from a lot of viewers are less forgiving.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@whohar maybe flying low in the Disney radar is a good thing, just as long as they don’t drop it altogether. They probably view it as a minor production and that means less high end interference.

cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@craig Just saying,, this forum is the best managed of any I have ever been a member of and is still going strong after ten years which is remarkable so the rules hold up well.

Thanks Craig for your amazing work

and cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

Best Wishes. I have fingers crossed for the outcome for you all in the U.K. The world currently needs some good news.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Finally got to watch the episode two nights ago and have not had time to even post let alone read all the comments, a treat in store.  I want to post my thoughts before the next episode blows them all to dust.

It is about Susan…. Finally. I have wanted Susan to be addressed for so long so wish come true and i hope to see some answers in the next episode. Loved that the Doctor has a granddaughter but no child. Timey wimey. What about Jenny though? Could Susan be Jenny’s daughter. RTD might decide, after having stayed the hand of execution, to make use of the character. I don’t think so though. Then there is River Song. could Susan be her grandchild? Another possible. Is Ruby connected? Is she the child he doesn’t know he has? So she would be Susan’s mother. Um.

Still convinced that RTD cast Susan Twist because of her name. How could he resist?

When did Sutek attach themselves to the Tardis, while he was at the end of the universe or earlier. Was it the salt that released Sutek? Is it the Doctor or the Tardis that the woman points to?

Congrats to @blenkinsopthebrave for suggesting Sutek as the big bad. I think that might have been mentioned in some show the “kids” were watching. If so the powers that be are watching.

Now back to work but looking forward to catching up on all the comments in the next few days.

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

@vickymallard. The new Tardis interior is very white and clean but it does at least look like a spaceship. After the last Tardis interior which was just ugly and weird I don’t mind it.

I think you will enjoy the next few episodes.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark That is a good point, re’ Mrs Flood and the police box/Tardis. She did not realise that the police box was a Tardis until it dematerialised there fore she knows what a Tardis is but does not recognise the police box. Given that the Tardis only took that form when Hartnell/Doc arrived in London, at least according to pre-Chib’ lore, she might have also known a previous incarnation of the Doctor. I would put my money, however on it being a different Time Lord she is familiar with. (And hopefully not the Master.) I would love to see a return of the Meddling Monk or the Mind Robber but think that unlikely.

Whatever the outcome, and seeing Craig’s comment in the new thread I fear it might well be Daleks and/or Davros who is the big bad, it will probably not be as much fun or as inspired our the bonkers theories that have been explored here. It has been so much fun, reading everyone’s posts since this series kicked off and seeing so many old faces again, as well as some new ones, always welcome. Just like old times.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@ps1l0v3y0u You’re right. Must be Feathers McGraw then. The ultimate baddie. (at least according to the Guardian)

I do like the idea of stroller Daleks though.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave thanks for sharing the link. Just because of the list on the Guardian of the most villainous villains in children’s tv on the Guardian today I thought, (and hope not) Davros. He isn’t really timeless but there have been no daleks this series, which has been refreshing hence hoping it isn’t Davros. Nice to have a change from the same old same old enemies.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Ah reading through @whohar‘s list it occurred to me that maybe the “other face” of the Doctor is an alternative Cartmell type Doctor who is the Boss referred to and the Doctor at the end has to over come themselves. The alt Doctor is the “big bad”. All the horrible things that have happened to them, finally cause a switch to flick, (touching on one of the kid’s theories which I hotly disputed at  the time) and the Doctor to turn. It won’t be the current regen however. And Susan will return to help, (There I drew her into the story) and the Susan Twist appearances are a clue from Susan. (al Badwolf)

Um.

Cheers

Janette.

[janetteB @replies]

@thane16 on echoes of the past the Doctor recalling promising to keep Ruby safe reminded me of the promise he made to Jackie to keep Rose safe.

I also think this is an alternative universe, and there is a “mastermind” pulling the strings. I am reminded of the Mind Robber but maybe just because it is one of the few Troughton/doc episodes I have seen. Son2 commented last night on all the familiar horror tropes in 73 yards. Maybe that is deliberate. the mockery of the people in the pub implies that they at least dismissed fairy rings as nonsense superstition.

I think that Ruby’s ability to summon snow is probably important. She is the daughter of the Snow Queen? Who is the Who Universe Snow Queen? Um. Think I should go off and do something useful and wait to Saturday.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@snocita Actually plenty of middle aged romantics love science fiction and many people watch both Bridgerton and Sci Fi.

@juniperfish I will tell the “kids”, (well into their twenties but always kids to me) that you approved of their theory. I have not seen them this excited about Dr Who for a long time and that is very pleasing.

@ps1l0v3y0u and @blenkinsopthebrave, Seeing more of the not time lord inhabitants of Gallifrey would be welcome indeed. I would like Dr Who to develop other, non human cultures more and Gallifrey seems like a good start which is why the second destruction was not only pointless but depleted future story potential.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

I did have one minor gripe with the episode, Ruby telling Bird/girl that she can be whatever she wants, go climb mountains etc. Very 21st century and wrong. A young woman in 1813 would have very limited choices. There were jobs for women of education who were skint, governess, computer, etc but they were not really considered “respectable”. Most careers were reserved for men, higher education was reserved for men, travel, alone, was not tolerated for a woman and there would be all sorts of obstacles for a single woman. Emma Thompson got it right in Sense and Sensibility with the line that women cannot even earn their living. Marriage for a woman in 1813 was career and that is what Pride and Prejudice is really about, not romance but hard nosed opportunism.

but this, as is remarked upon in the script, is more Bridgerton, a fantasy concoction of the past inspired by Jane Austen. It is a fantasy brought to us third hand.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@juniperfish. I wondered if 1813 was a J.A. reference. Well done.

I have finally caught up with the episode. Lots of fun, light but very enjoyable. I have been following the comments (Yes before watching, I cheat). A few things I noted. He promises to take Rogue to Gallifrey. Does that mean that Gallfirey still exists? Loved the “don’t call me Doc” line. Yes.

Liked the Dungeons and Dragons reference. The kids (son and his girlfriend) want to know if the new Boss is a Dungeon master; a story teller entity and they are wondering if Susan Twist is the dungeon master.  Son thinks the Rogue is not necessarily a “good guy” and the ring might be a tracking device.  also they pointed out that Rogue recognised the old Doctor faces. He certainly reacted to Tennant’s image. (they just raced out to talk to us about the episode as they watched it last night.)

My own thoughts re the recurring Susan Twist. I do hope she isn’t too much like Badwolf, an image spread through time as a warning to the Doctor or a call for help.

I did come up with a last desperate attempt to tie it all back to Susan. Maybe the big bad boss had captured Susan in and has her hostage in a bad to draw in the Doctor.

Back to being serious, I don’t think  I can add anything to all the wonderful theorising above. I do enjoy reading everyone’s posts.

Cheers

Janette.

 

 

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. I think it is worth a re watch but then I have always been a fan of Donna and that helps. It was lovely to see her and Tennant Doc again even if the circumstances were contrived.  I kind of saw these specials as not really cannon and so settled back and enjoyed them for what they were. The spaceship design was a notch up for Dr Who.

I don’t think RTD will immediately disavow the Flux but I think he will let the worst of it fade away and maybe retain the best elements. (Hard for me to say though I have avoided watching those episodes. I gave up at the end of the second WhitDoc series when Gallifrey was destroyed yet again for no good reason other than lets break things.)

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave Yes The entire household were shocked when I told them that Feathers McGraw is getting out of prison. Our boys grew up with Wallace and Gromit. We have Wallace and Gromit soft toys and numerous penguin toys so we are all quite excited by the news.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark I suspect you might be “one the money” with that theory. Having her repeated appearances is akin to Bad Wolf randomly showing up in every episode. It would be similar so in keeping with RTD’s writing “tropes”. I still think she was cast because of the name. It does mean that there is no Susan reference though so once again I am disappointed. Well one day…

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave. Susan Twist is a manifestation of the Tardis! I don’t think any of us thought of that but yes, it might well be.

She was cast because of her name though.  I am certain of it.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark The “no hugging” I thought, reflects the growing tendency to view all tactile signs of affection as suspect. Teachers for instance cannot do anything but talk to a distressed child. Hugs however are natural and release positive endorphins that we need. Fear of paedophilia is blurring the distinction between positive and harmful contact. The reaction to hugs reflects not only the lack of the physical in the digital reality they inhabit. RTD has reflected several layers of social breakdown in this. I also think that these young people are not reflective of all of their generation. They are a privileged subset that he is taking aim at. (And I loved it.)

Ricky September was the hero, and so the likeness to Luke is apt and no doubt deliberate. This is a world that has no sympathy for heroes and nobility is something to be used and abused. AT that point I really wanted to feed Lindy to the bugs.

Oh dear by the end I had no empathy at all for the “victims”.  I feel as though RTD was testing our own empathy too in this episode but the Doctor knows all we know and still has empathy, and still tries to save these utterly vile people showing just how superior he is. That is his/their superpower..

@blenkinsopthebrave. I think they may simply be using orange because it is not a “loaded” colour and has less attached meanings that most colours and it is flattering.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

Well finally got to watch the episode and I have to say I don’t think in all the time I have been watching Dr Who have I ever wanted to see a major character get fed to the bugs more. I just spent a good part of the episode wishing I could push Lindy into one of them. I just hope that there are a whole batch of bugs waiting on that river. They would only spoil that wilderness if they got out there. They did not deserve the Doctor’s compassion and hurting him like that made me hate them all the more.

Cheers

Janette

 

 

[janetteB @replies]

@scaryb Thank you for sharing that news. Very sad. I am glad he made one last appearance but I feel that he deserved a better episode for that.  Yes I agree with @blenkinsopthebrave He would have been a lovely teacher. It must have thrilled him though to see Dr Who still going strong after all these years and he certainly played his part in creating that enduring legacy.

cheers

Janette.

[janetteB @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave I had not noticed that Ruby is found in 2005. It does not seem that long ago. I think it is more RTD’s meta nod to the series reboot, the kind of thing a writer does, (I would totally do that if I was writing the scripts) and may not signify beyond that. Nice catch though and it is echoed by the Doctor re visiting London in 1963.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@brewski Hi. RTD is running with the calendar names isn’t he? Tuesday in Boom. I wonder if that signifies anything or is just because he really doesn’t like picking names for characters.

1963 is also featured so a Sunday in September 1963 maybe? The first episode began on a schoolday but I don’t think it is ever stated which day of the week it was. Umm. That might just be me with the Susan/bee in my bonnet again.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. I had the feeling that Moffat no longer knew which was which. Revelation or whatever it is called is one of the better Chib era episodes I thought.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@cathannabel Hi and nice to see you. I agree. Witchy ruby has a almost hypnotic effect on people. I don’t think there is anything she could say that would make Ruby’s mother run from her like that.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@wolvesarerunning. Welcome. glad you decided to post and it is never too late to join the party. Nice theory. I like it.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

Have not seen the episode yet, (I’m not afraid of spoilers) but.. is it just me or does that woman pictured above look like Susan?  ( I know I sound like a record caught in a groove but it really struck me on opening this page.)

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. The Icelandic Tv series Katla explores similar territory. And of course there is Osgood who may or may not be her Zygon twin. (I have forgotten if we ever do find out.)

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

I tend to think that @mudlark is right and Ruby cannot be her own Mum. However that does not discount the possibility that the woman who leaves baby Ruby on the church doorstep is not an older, alternative timeline Ruby who has gone back in time, rescued herself for some reason and left herself on the doorstop for the Doctor to find.

Having said that I don’t think the mystery woman is Ruby. I would not put money on it anyway, if I was of a gambolling inclination which I am not. I think Master/Missy, granddaughter Susan, Susan Twist or River Song would all be safer bets.

Cheers

Janette

 

[janetteB @replies]

@dentarthurdent. I too think that It Takes You Away is the best episode of the series, though it has more plot holes than a goth’s stockings. The setting and characters helped and I agree. The entire show would have been better if they had left Graham in the alternative reality with Grace.

if you ‘create’ a replica of a person, complete with all their thoughts and memories, how is it not the ‘real’ person?

Bill raises this question in Twice Upon a Time.

cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@winston. Glad to hear that you are well on the way to full recovery. It can be frustrating and makes one really appreciate being in good health.I hope you can enjoy the garden again soon. We finally got rain today, after a worryingly dry autumn and so finally I can start planting. Due to our dry climate we plant in late autumn/early winter to catch the winter rains and let plants establish before the onslaught of summer. Last year we had a large peppercorn tree removed and now we are starting afresh in that half of the garden. Have planted a lemon and hoping to put in a plum tree in the next week or so.

Onto Who news, you have some treats in store. Something to look forward to.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@mudlark is probably correct here. I had forgotten about the DNA scan but there might we ways around it, some kind of scriptwriting jiggery pokery. Ruby might be a granddaughter and possibly the Doctor already has some human DNA, given that he is not of Gallifreyan origin after all. Had the Doctor ever scanned their own DNA? (I really need to make time for a second watch. One viewing is never enough especially when that is with family members complaining about babies and music.)

Maybe Ruby is human and is a kind of gift for the Doctor knowing they will need a companion in the future. (the boring explanation) Then the big question is, “who was the mystery woman who left her at the church” and not, “who is Ruby”.

Hi @pufferfish. Nice to see you back here.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@ps1l0v3y0u Agree the Bechdele test would not apply to Dr Who. There have been some great companions, all those you mentioned and yes since the reboot in 05 they have all had something remarkable about them that often is heavily foreshadowed before it happens.. (I won’t talk about the “fam” either.) What makes Ruby remarkable would seem to be the mystery of her birth. I don’t feel that she is being set up to do something remarkable in the way that say, Donna was.  (recently the son and his girlfriend have been watching Sarah Jane Adventures and she thinks I have modelled myself on Sarah Jane. I don’t think I have but not a bad role model. I was flattered by the comparison.)

I think it is important to maintain some sense of mystery around the Doctor’s past and for that reason I like the suggestion that they have a hidden pre/timelord past. I am hoping that Ruby is in some way connected to Susan, who might have regenerated a few times by now. After all she is, presumably, part time lord and part whatever the Doctor is.

Cheers

Janette

[janetteB @replies]

@winston Hi. Have not seen any posts from you recently. Hope recovery is on track and you enjoying the enforced rest.

cheers

Janette

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