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    syzygy @replies


    Them other brains -the newbies!  And @mudlark too.

    I’m re- watching Who -the 3rd run now – as a desperate way to avoid comments on the thread to do with the… Dead One (I aint looking, no spoilers: I’m up to episode 3).

    Syzygy the Old

    syzygy @replies


    maybe I’ve been sleeping through some episodes,

    I think probably so. 😉


    It is perhaps significant that the Master’s words evoked a flash of visual memory for the Doctor, suggesting some kind of embedded, perhaps racial memory…

    Agreed. I think as @blenkinsopthebrave suggested that there’s a deep seated memory, hidden from successive regenerations, but embedded in a way no other alien/UNIT/person could ‘unlock.’ Even the memory causes a reactive pain, enough, perhaps, that the TL is ‘virtually’ forced to “not think about it.” Something the Doctor has caused others to do or strongly suggested others do -whether with the Face Huggers or the ‘thing in the corner of your eye.’

    @nerys and others. I’m seriously worried about this meme being chucked about the place -partly because I  disagree but also because it takes just one person (grant you a person seemingly well respected)to say “it leaves me cold.”

    To a friend, I spoke pretty honestly here. I said amongst many other things ‘why do people feel like this?’ We have Yaz filled with bounce & enthusiasm who then falls apart -in a subtle way. Her tears at the ‘hut’ & her conversation with others as well as her family spoke of a deep well of need, fear, longing -and love. I think Yaz grew the most in this 2 parter. Sure, it lacked the warmth we usually have at Christmas but I think it moved away from that, set its heart on the young things & speaking of someone with plenty of young things, they really loved it.

    Still, just an opinion, but I can see where you’re coming from. I think it was very different. But the Doctor? She blew me away. I felt she’d been given a very wide accumulation of emotions and intellect to demonstrate & not since Mat Smith, did I see that in 120 minutes.

    Syzygy the Old.

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    that’s @mensabrains above. Clearly @rob my morning beverage isn’t as strong by half



    syzygy @replies

    Good morning & welcome to the …brains! Holy schmeck, my ol’ brain is a hurting now. @rob I prepared my beverage before attempting to read the thoroughly wonderful posts. Happy NY to you & good to see you out back (or front, or transactionally eternal, no yesterdays, todays, tomorrows, all time pre-existent…!)

    @vervain @mensabrain.  Welcome to you! You might like to visit the Sofa & share how/why/when you stumbled onto the series as a child, or recently. We hope you have a wonderful time here.

    Yup, I thought the Kasaavin could be cloister apparitions. The drum sound from the Saxon era used a slightly different rhythmic pattern, I thought?


    The question remains, though, whether this is part of what the Time Lords have always believed about their origins, or whether it is part of a lie which undermines their very sense of identity, and I’m inclined to think the latter.

    Yes! I failed to test that element: sure, the Child could be harnessed in such a way but to what extent is that a known origin story for the TLs or is it part of a still larger Lie as you’ve stated.

    @mensabrain Indeed, that’s a convincing argument. I recall The Satan Pit where the so-called Big Evil claimed to be “before Time” & thus the Tardis interface couldn’t translate the language

    @vervain I love it!

    there are… three recognised consequences of (or a least reactions to) the ritual – inspiration, running … madness. Whatever their reaction it In effect galvanises the Timelord….

    Further, you’re suggesting the Schism effects the TL;  distils it, but like any distillation there’s chemical ‘junk’ or refuse/waste. The refuse must go somewhere or be ‘some-thing.

    …When Rassilon and the Timelords started out…

    The “when” and “started” is key. What came before? Indeed they used Time as play. After all, the TL Victorious as described by Adelaide in TennantDoc was unpleasant, sowing the seeds of his own psychic discord. This leads to the greatest quest of all, perhaps not ‘what’ or ‘why’ but ‘me?’ And the words “run, you clever boy & remember me” and “am I a good man?”

    @bluesqueakpip yes, where are the people? Gone? Hidden?

    @syzygy the Old (feeling old today, that’s for sure!)

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    I agree on the mind-wipe. My son, didn’t. However, Lovelace saw some truly shattering images & despite her obvious curiosity & later work with Babbage, I would think that exposing her to the Doctor’s world, though briefly, could change Lovelace’s time line. She’s made a considered decision to have Lovelace’s life play out without the Doctor’s assistance or involvement.

    Nonetheless, she is controlling another -the very thing the Doctor does not like occurring to her. Her answers to the ‘fam’s’ questions (fams tend to know a lot & love you anyway) come across as irritated: “OK, whaddaya want to know?”

    The Doctor also knows her travel companions sometimes have catastrophic experiences. Perhaps another reason why the Doctor wipes Lovelace’s mind: her very real concept of a world on fire;  Armageddon.

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    @blenkinsopthebrave @miapatrick

    Yes, this is going in a good direction…. An existential “shattering” which corrupts the very basis of what the Doctor has chosen to be: so that he/she is not really a Doctor... But as you say, something to do with the vortex & the child who is timeless, also empty, who is buried deep in nightmares?

    What if the Child is effectively physically harnessed to all Time Lords  -their very ability to be TLs contingent upon the role of the Child to exist across all dimensions & eternally?

    A slave, perhaps. The Doctor who saves the children of Gallifrey discovers her ability coexists only with the imprisonment of the Timeless Child.

    I also like a termination programme whereupon at a certain age TLs must deliver their remaining regenerations to the Child which causes the latter to re-breed uniquely intelligent, but possibly depraved TLs.

    Then:  the idea of the Dalek’s extermination code & how this fits with our history in Russia, with pogroms, in the Ukraine, Germany, the Khmer Rouge etc

    Syzygy the Old 🙂

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    as you were. No ‘r’ in Kasaavin.

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    so others have this I think but akrasia is Kasaarvin. No great help as it means to act against one’s will. Like incontinence.  Julian Jay Savarin (word find) was a sci-fi writer.


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    @galaxymage  I meant to add to your complex (and wonderful) theories that in my re-watch the Master says “before you die” or “in your last moments I want you to know that everything you think you know is a lie.”

    So, before killing her, he was ready to give her a hint and then “puff.” But being a TL he plans for the possibility he doesn’t survive. That shows a realistic approach even Missy didn’t have. She was confident when she stopped the planes;  even making a deal with the daleks in the Magician’s Apprentice 2 parter with Capaldi (his series 2).

    (Syzygy the younger).

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    @blenkinsopthebrave up there, apologies.

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    It’s the Doctor, on his own, with other humans (River). It’s Ashildr who is Mire and human. The dynamic of the Doctor with Clara is still complex, enough. However, you might be right  suggesting something deeper. That there’s a ‘thing’ (that’s my word, I’m sticking to it!) the Doctor is responsible for/doesn’t know about/a myth he fears and the Timeless Child ?  ?

    During the whole Rassilion era in the Tennant years, there was the ……something else ….child. Mum reckons it’s the Nightmare Child or/and the Empty Child... soooo…

    @Blenksinsopthebrave  @bluesqueakpip @galaxymage -welcome to you, the new person! Great theories and bonkerising.  I was very worried about that too: when the Master said: “stay dead this time.” There’s something right there, isn’t there? In the corner of your eye? It’s unpleasant. It’s like when Doctor 11 said to Amy “do you realise your life makes no sense?”

    So it’s buried deep, Mr Blenk?  So it could be the Nightmare Child/Empty Child* with its army of Neverweres.  So, they, the TLs,  never were what they said they were.

    I know it was the panadora’s box of nasty weapons.  The Nightmare Child and the Timeless Child is a similar sounding item: a self-destroying weapon. They made it and buried it. But the Master knows it***…and is stuck. Any chance that this new group of baddies in Spyfall, whilst exiling people/Ada or Yas/ into the neurones were actually chucking people into a prison not made by just these baddies but the Time Lord’s too.

    it’s doubtful -the last bit. I get that the Master was imprisoned and calling out for the Doctor, and the episode’s baddies had their revenge on him. But they were beyond “your universe” and we take this form to “mock you.”

    If it was Moffat I’d be prickled with excitement. I still am….but yep. Not sure.

    *A Timeless Child has ‘no’ time and is thus empty. If it’s buried deep then it’s a Nightmare (child). The Doctor has a history of nightmares in Listen. Also he asks: “What do you do if you’re a creature who is never ever seen or known because their gift is HIDING? Well, what do you DO?” He laughs. But on the blackboard he sees: LISTEN.

    You can connect the dots without needing more specific content. Also, the Tennant era had some Chibnall episodes. He saw some, wrote others and to bring up the Timeless Child again could be related to Tennant’s description of weapons such as the Army/the Empty Child etc etc.

    *** @galaxymage This is a complex Master. He wants her dead except he also wants to write down a sort of will, should he, the Master, die first. Something he knows the Doctor would find out…which is a lie of great magnitude. He also knows the Doctor could die finding out. He knows the Doctor is a fixer: a doctor. The Master likes to control everything but now he knows the TLs are worse. At least he’s honest about it!

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    @mudlark @bluesqueakpip

    Yes, excellent observations & critique. The Master’s “distress is almost palpable.” He isn’t a one stop- shop villain.  The wild & mad is evident the more you look, & Dahwan’s pacing is beautiful: “You got me.”  The camera waits, for a beat. And then another. The up close photography doesn’t seem showy. Neither is the plot diminished. It’s like time expands with the reveal.

    I’m with you on the “slightly out of focus.” At the same time, mum’s laptop skipped focus. I had to restart it & yup, it certainly seems like Dahwan was out of immediate sight line & out of focus in scenes. I haven’t re-watched it but I’m loving the bonkers theorising, everyone.

    @missrori I don’t follow the “cop out” of the hybrid? I think that was ‘sorted.’ Yeah, @nerys Mum was mentioning Listen. In that ep Orson is Danny’s descendent? When Dan says “family stuff,” yet he’s an orphan I think he’s lying. Moffat’s different to Chibnall. I preferred Moffat’s “pay attention” type of writing so the “family stuff” could be a lie? His next of kin; not at the funeral; not known to Clara, collects his toy soldier. However, I’m probably wrong!

    @missrori The impression I get is that the hybrid focuses our attention on the relationships between the Doctor, Clara & Ashildr, who outlives her family watching everyone die until she meets the Doctor at the end of the universe. The Doctor fled from the myth (the algorithm) which he created. Ashildr was demonstrably difficult. Mire and human. Clara too, was a ‘hybrid:’ dead yet living between her heart beats. The TL Doctor in that triangle (& triangles are everywhere in science, myth, worship, love, sex) has human reactions, a human wife in River,  human companions  -during the Tennant years there was a lot of snogging 🙂 Even 12 replies to Clara when she says “I didn’t think of you as my boyfriend,” something like “I never said it was your mistake.” Anyway, hat’s my take on the Hybrid 😉

    @bluesqueakpip I think what you’re saying here is great.

    I think this may well be a post Missy incarnation. When the Master talks about the buzz that killing gives him…the look in his eyes is completely haunted… He may also be referring to the Timeless Child reveal….Deliberately designed as a psychopathic killer…

    Outstanding. think that there’s been a lot of Time Swinging (TM) but we meet the Master chronologically? It’s good that way because in the Moffat era we had a lot of confusing time jumps as well as the Doctor stuck in a Timeless ‘apparition’ Machine (TAM)  for a billion years. Having one character chronologically ordered adds balance -at least to me! I need it to be less confusing, occasionally  😀

    Son of the Syzygy.

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    Yes, one could say that there’s a lack of emotional resonance with yet another “let’s go to Gallifrey.” But I don’t see it that way. The resonance was created by two ‘resonating’ out of time Time Lords. The recording by the Master & the look on the Doctor’s face was beautifully portrayed. I felt the Master’s pain. I felt the Doctor’s reaction. As if having smashed him way thru to Gallifrey, having saved it, she realises it’s happening again: not “fear me, I killed them all” but both “the Master’s killed them all & perhaps he’s right to. Unless, I, the Doctor, am the problem.”

    Is the Timeless Child the Big Bang of Gallifrey and Kasterborous?

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    @miapatrick. Once again: Loved what you wrote.

    How could he take a bunch of humans calling themselves a master race seriously?

    I found Whittaker’s performance here brilliant. When the Master makes her kneel. When she asks “what do you want?” Chills. Her pacing was superlative & the direction of both parts was beautifully done though a few edit problems were noticeable as @pedant suggested.

    And Yaz’ terror within the neural pathways at the beginning of Part 1 and her subsequent fears & tears in the “outback” were very real to me too @spider. Her concern that they could invade the Tardis tells me she might just say “enough’s enough.”

    @mudlark Well done you! I have to admit I had no idea who they were. Yes, I really wrote that. I knew Babbage (which gives me limited points!).

    The score was tip-top too.

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    @miapatrick. Amazing really. I agree: loads of clues -even the unhinged quality, combined with “it’s very interesting but inconsistencies…” was loud and clear! Didn’t even think that far in…or off….or when…! Love what you wrote here:

    And finally, he fooled her into a fake friendship because they were friends.


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    I’m not loving the new you, actually. Not at all. I thought, you know “friendly place.”

    What the heck’s happened?


    I think there was some genuine confusion about the Wicked West of the West-type of thing. From what I read?

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    Jolly awesome! Loved O. Had absolutely no idea O was He! Even with the flying building. And then “in the seconds  before you die, everything you think you know is a lie. Got you. Finally.”

    When we met Fake O I loved the slightly unhinged quality he had: mad scientist. Then the “lucky in love” to Yaz was slightly off.

    Rubbing hands with glee at part 2.

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    Oh mods. Triple apologies. I actually thought I was on The Sofa!

    I’ll  hobble t’way! ……

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    Golly & heck & up with it all! We have some mods back!

    I’m seeing in my Netflix in box what looks like Dracula with 2 nuns? Is this the great Dracula of which you speak?

    I ask only because of the blobs of blood which looked especially suspicious -in a 16th movie of the Twilight Saga-type of thing – during the credits. I really didn’t want any Twilight drama!

    Back from NSW. 20 kms from where we were it reached 51 degrees in the shade. Double plus golly.

    Aussies are amazing: “yeah, mate, we’re gonna lie on some blow up beds in the middle of another mate’s dam. We got raw sausages which will cook automatically. Hopefully we’ll see you tomorrow, if we make it. We probly will.”

    @blenkinsopthebrave @janetteb no doubt you’ll recall the lilting tones of a “slow down time” way of speaking. As dry as the cinders & kindling around them.

    Tough in the face of actual hell. Never have I ever seen anything so horrifying. I saw racing fire, horses running for their lives, cattle being shot, whole towns I used to visit since the age of 5 are just gone. Some in a night. 300 full on properties in under 24 hours. Klaxons driven by fire fighters down streets at 3 am saying “go, now. You have 15 minutes.” They might, during  the worst of seasons, serve for 7 days but haven’t stepped down for 3 solid weeks. And they’re volunteers.

    Anyway, back to the fun and games. I haven’t seen Who yet, even. I completely forgot about it!


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    But the other bit, it’s “and we can do it together.

    Lovely The Buff. So, good. We haven’t watched anything yet. After our evening meal on Christmas ‘eve (Czechs do this on the 24th so the 25th is a very lazy day) I went straight to bed. So hot & humid the jelly was melting.


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    I think we need to try, all of us, to be better people. This is a frustrating issue, not the least of which is that persons are debating on the same side, I think it’s the manner of communication as well as non-specific vocabulary. The latter tends to sharpen the viewpoints & possibly render division almost non-existent? I think it’s a matter of a better explanation, imo.


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    Ah yes Toby.

    But I think this luverly scene fits round about now. Don’t YOU??


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    Niice. Sounds a lot like Patrick Doyle’s thing even though this is 400 years old!

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    I’m really sorry if it sounded like I thought all uncomfortable feelings are racist. Above, in my post, I was trying to simplify things but I probably wasn’t using the right words. And you’re right, it’s not a game.

    when uncomfortable people come together they multiply into those who are angry & …don’t separate fact/fiction.

    Yes I was wrong there. I should’ve said that some uncomfortable people multiply into angry people and that some of those who mix with others say “I want to do something” like banning the burka etc.  I should’ve said this correctly: not all uncomfortable people become radicalised into conservatism which becomes xenophobia. But quite a few do?

    Thank you Whisht.

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    So, for some meditation. Someone said, here’s looking at you Mr @blenkinsopthebraveLeit motif?

    I will now admit for everyone this sad fact: I always thought The Man who Came to Dinner was actually (oh gawd) the same as “guess who’s coming to dinner.”

    So when people said “we’re watching The Man Who ….” ” I’d nod enthusiastically & be a little clueless. I have never seen The Man Who Came to Dinner.

    Oh boy. Years of my life passed by in ignorance. So, back to the other point. Look over here where I’m not blushing in embarrassment! Did someone (ahem) say Leitmotifssz?



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    @blenkinsopthebrave Orsom! (TM). Thank you.

    Loved it!! “drafty sewer you cahl the laarbry!”   Merry Christmas, everybody. And again!!

    Syzygy the Snr

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    Ah, bangs head 😉

    No, you’re right. Danny dies & yes, he’s in a children’s home but chatting with one who was also in a kid’s home -you have mates, brothers & others you don’t always tell things about. Some mad dudette arrives in your room with a great big grey stick insect & you’re not going to open up fully. So, I deduce the idea of who had it was always there. But Moffy, being him, says “pay bloomin’ attention” and therefore in Listen, you hear two words: Family Stuff.” Also, in other eps, “I know when you’re lying. I know the truth. I know when people or others [ie me, Danny] lie.”

    So yes maybe the Doctor puts it in the box first.

    Clara finds it by rummaging, and pulls it out.

    It’s in Danny’s home (back of a cupboard, as you do)

    After he dies, a person (who isn’t Clara) claims it, they have grand-kids and one of ’em, Orson, has it in his bag & Clara nicks it &

    gives it to the young Doctor who ……puts  it in Rupert’s box.

    We know this Doc is pretty old & can’t remember everything -Kill the Moon & Deep Breath.


    On all the bonkerising. In the end, Clara is talking to Danny about telling him the truth. No call from the ‘future.’ He himself wrote Listen because he laughed & chalk falls….He did say “I’ll be there in a …few minutes” so she knew  where to run.  No pregnancy though there was a lot of debate on that. Likely, she’s been with Danny for 3 months & also travelling with the Doctor. The whole “I can cope with this. I’m in control” set that up.  There was no mini- suction or miniaturisation either as @arbutus  listed the dialogue.

    But I read all 11 pages of the thread & it was orsome!  The complexity. Only after watching Buffy did I conclude that, for me, a lot of that doesn’t matter all the time? I’m not saying it’s not fun! It’s huuge fun & the Forum’s <i>traction</i>. For me, it’s relationships. The broad strokes of lives. As Whedon said “it’s not the monsters, it’s the love, folks.” Or the Doctor’s “you don’t really see me.”

    But it’s brilliant to watch great telly. In Listen there’s a section? Where the Doctor’s on Orson’s ship. Something like “they prey on the very young, the very old, or the very ill…” and it breaks my heart. Those words are what Moffat’s getting at too, and it’s Capaldi’s pleading which opens up the idea.

    Gosh, rambling post. typed by Thane {ahem mother, about time}

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    @bluesqueakpip @ Blenkinsopthebrave. You’d know Bernard Keane, Mr Blenk?

    A good book A Short History of Stupid is worth it.

    Also, as to good books, we know where this comes from & its relevance: “As goode almost kill a man as kill a goode booke; who kills a man, kills a reasonable creature [..] but he who destroys a good booke kills reason itself [ ].”


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    Thane here

    “Dis-ease” = uncomfortable. I then stated that when uncomfortable people come together they multiply into those who are angry & who, as Bonhoeffer stated (read the entire papers as its worth it) don’t separate fact/fiction. Arendt said it’s not the dedicated who are always the problem. The in-between groups are able to follow what other uncomfortable & some racist people do. Some of these people are also stupid.

    They have no self-engaged or formal education reading op. eds saying “we’re uncomfortable & we’re willing to do something. We’ll support laws so women don’t wear hijabs or burkas” (CM 16 September 2017).

    The uncomfortable become radicalised by conservatism.  Millions of dedicated social media followers sit with adrenaline pumping, ready to fight.  The angry talk with the foolish who birth into stupidity. Ignorance can stop through intense work. For some, it’s hard: 2-3 jobs or tired parents of 4.  Sure you call an ignorant or stupid or uncomfortable person racist, they’ll get angry & the talking stops.

    We have to BE better. We have to LISTEN. But I don’t know how to accept there’s stupid, ignorant people. So far they don’t change their opinions.

    Sorry, I didn’t wanna tag people in case of anger-management. OK, I was being silly about that: I can’t stand the concept. Anger is a necessity like fear.

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    OK. Don’t roll your eyes people. I’m re-doing the Peter Capaldi years.

    It’s like a Christmas gift.

    I’m pretty sure LISTEN is SILENT (s) so the monster’s an actual monster. The Doctor says: “don’t look in the reflection.” But, during the escapade to the end of the universe, it’s just the ship settling, & its pipes, dry & unused, start knocking. I think Gold’s music helps with this understanding -he’s using a sweeping Beethoven like motif (with a late Romantic style) reaching a climax during Clara’s speech to the young Doctor. So, the Doctor really has based his initial conjecture on experience, but being very clever, can hear his dreams too. The music is re-created, it sounds very much like several famous symphonies but it’s not, it’s Murray’s own,  which led me to think that the music, the romance if you like, is the back drop to reality. It’s ‘balanced out’ that way & co-joined.

    There’s no monster at the end of the universe unless it’s the Hybrid….

    My question, coming well after Danny’s death is “how did Orson have Pink relatives?”  Did Danny have a brother? But at what point did Dan (Rupert) pass on the toy soldier? Did Clara go back in the moments between her heart beats to find Danny?

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    @janetteb ah, see, I edited out the Little Dick.

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    @pedant @whisht  @arbutus

    Hey YOU! You’ve been gone a very. Long. Time 🙁

    I hope all is well in the Arbutus manor?

    And that reminds me of another manor!  The @idiotsavon castle!

    I spent, ooh, about 3 hours last night watching Listen & reading all the comments. I’m a-watching all of the Peter Capaldi years again. How beautiful. I was reading all ‘youse’ comments including the idiotsavon’s and SO many others. Can I mention some? @fivefaces @chickenelly? Where art thou?

    @janetteb Agreed over at the pub.  It’s burning whilst he’s surfin.’  So more Midnights… Yep, he did enter politics but his advisors were …unfortunate. There was scandal (serious) over ceiling batts, poor installation of insulation & his association with them. His political life was very short.

    So, Beds was released in response to John Howard’s (former Aus PM, of the Liberal Party -the Conservatives, here) behaviour towards the indigenous peoples. Unfortunately, whilst an apology has happened, their situation is more dire. Meanwhile we’re surrounded by cultural elites, drinking their champers, setting up their YT channels, with no care or respect for politics beyond: “I don’t like politics. And mum always said you can’t discuss religion either.”

    In my opinion, those two things should be spoken about. A great book by Maddox called God Under Howard. You might like my other copy @janetteb.


    • This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by  syzygy. Reason: I really didn't want to call the PM Little Dick. Not on the music forum
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    I think mum was muttering about “embarrassed xenophobia.” I had to look it up! It’s suggesting that if a group are uncomfortable, they’re feeling “dis-ease” or “ill at ease.” When one person thinks this way it might be fine. If a group is born from that feeling they might feel embarrassed about being xenophobic. Eventually if more people enter the frame then they’ll eventually say or do something which they’re not embarrassed about anymore. In fact, according to some book I’m really trying to read properly (it’s hard going & I don’t know where she finds these things) called The Enigma of Reason, its’ easy to go from “dis-ease” to anger. It’s 2 steps.

    Anywaay, it’s Christmas really soon.


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    @lisa Thank you, yes I’m doing well. Mum & I share our ‘handle’ as, if she’s a bit crap with Crohns (very literal!), I join in.

    I’ve finished school this year with an OP 8 which is hard to say in American or even other Aussie terms! I did all Humanities subjects all rated at ‘9’ or less where top Maths, physics, chemistry were rated at 2-5 & web design & design art were 6-7 ratings. I would love to love horses but I always sneeze a lot. Even 200 metres from them. I think it’s the hay etc & not the horses. Mum has a terrifying story when she turned 15 I’ll tell you at the bottom.

    It sounds like she is a campy camper, your daughter.  I never knew what that phrase meant when I was 7?  I’m permanently happy. It’s weird. Maybe I take after my dad? Mum’s the “old Czech grumpy one” with a frown forever on her forehead. That’s OK, because my grandad (he’d been 92 or something if he were still alive) was always like that & now my  uncle is sort of like that but he’s still optimistic. I think it’s because he’s doing more than OK financially, has been retired & self-pensioned, or self-superannuated (which is totally the wrong term), & never watches the TV or any newspapers in the last year or more which I think is pretty …..odd.

    We have no newspapers delivered. I think I last touched one when I was in grade 6 as it’s all on-line. We have ABC radio which has no advertisements & is fabulous to listen to from the cricket to ‘what to read for your Christmas bucket list’ as well as politics. But we’re really parochial here. I’ve heard next to nothing about UK politics & as America is our ally we hear a lot about you, but very little detail. Here it’s mainly fires or storms.

    As a surprise, grandma took mum & her best mate to a riding place. The people were weird. They put mum on ‘Thunder, a tall horse which started cantering down a hill & she could barely stop it. Then, they tried her on a gelding which was ‘Lightening’ & it galloped for 20 minutes with mum screaming & nearly falling off. Her helmet blew off, they caught up with it because it was heading for the troughs as it hadn’t had breakfast. Meanwhile her best friend had a great ol’ time. They stuck Mum on Red Ned 30 minutes later & he never moved at all! It wasn’t a good day!


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    @blenkinsopthebrave You did, you thought right the 1st time & you’re right the 2nd time (or is that the 3rd?). I was aiming for pithy. Instead you got the pith. 🙂  That was my first ever CD -$29.99.

    Thank you. We do need an uplift.

    @whisht @pedant

    Dixie Chicks


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    Yes, exactly Hannah Arendt.   What more to say. 🙁

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    Yes, the point was that people may not have time to read pamphlets. The balanced views written on pamphlets may’ve been ditched due to a busy schedule with commuters listening to talk-radio hosts -this just from Remainer friends in the UK & the husband’s family who don’t have time for reading (they’re working 2 or 3 jobs due to conservative austerity funding & thank you @whisht for reminding me it’s been 9 to 10 years of austerity “lets get back to surplus” causing exhaustion: emotionally, intellectually, physically) & who do listen to radio shows where there’s lots of call ins from “Alan from Brentwood” or “Little Joey from Romford” & where it’s very much about confirmation bias. “It’s OK folks, to want your paki bosses or Polish colleagues to disappear back to where they came from. Britain for the British.”

    Job done. They claim not to have any time to fully read the outcomes of potential decisions. They trust Johnson because he comes across as intelligent & a man of the people when he’s really not. And I can see you’re as frustrated by him as whisht or pedant or anyone else.

    As you say, it’s complicated. At least I think it is. I’m wondering though how complex it really is because the EU & the direction it went in the 70s has been forgotten. How many people can live in a country where most of their agrarian needs come from abroad? Where it’s a service economy, where industries existing in the 7os or 6os are abandoned & where major factory work exists abroad simply because of the size of it. The UK is SO small & so at a basic level if you leave the EU how exactly will this economically benefit the country.

    I think I’ve seen it as common sense to stay -in the past & my thinking hasn’t changed.

    syzygy @replies


    I totally sympathise with you & your orange headed twerp. Thing is, though, there are some who are equally twerpy, like Boris, and, like Trump, wouldn’t know the cost of milk unless their assistants gave ’em a heads up.

    All are welcome to comment, obviously, Lisa. My point was that you may’ve seen “ah, the CONS are back in, let’s go and congratulate them as this is a vote for Brexit.” You’ve spoken before about Brexit & disappeared when the arguments became a tad heated/factual. Recently, even a hasty look will’ve shown the implicit worry for their kids/grandkids. That’s what it is. When you live there. It’s a worry is all.

    But merry Christmas to you and your family. I hope they are well.

    syzygy @replies


    The “Australian model” your sister writes about is worthless, I’m afraid. It’s a difficult thing to manage, you see.

    There have been massive increases in pharmacological prescriptions and devices.

    How do they ‘get around it’ to make a profit? They remove certain items from the PDB (the Pharma Day Book -see listing under Legislation July, 2019, HR & Senate), place them under a ‘ban from prescription’ rule so consumers & patients pay more by 20%. In order to keep the items or ‘scripts cheaper, the GP rings Medicare, quotes a number & bravo it’s the same cost. Except it aint.

    You can only purchase it at the cheaper price if you buy FOUR times the quantity. Never mind that you don’t need it & by the time you’re a third of the way thru, the various side effects will’ve kicked in, or the patient has died, or there’s no place to store it because some poor granny lives in a top floor area where the meds must be stored in a non humid environment under 21 degrees Celsius & so the bloody lot goes in the bin.

    The following year pharma & the legislature puts the now-non prescription drugs BACK on the list but because it’s occurred within the one financial year it looks as though we’re doing brilliantly & the patients are very happy.

    The Doctors get annoyed, the pharmacy is running back & forth with “yes it’s available with a script. Oops, not any more, oh hang on, if you get 4 boxes of a 100 each you can get it for $89.00 instead of one box for $25”

    Then there’s the quantity itself. The problems that causes when patients who have 4 boxes of stuff, added to another 4 boxes of other stuff, added to 8 boxes of MORE stuff. They make a mistake, they die.

    Sometimes they don’t make a mistake. They take the whole goddam lot & die.

    Australia’s model is totally shit folks.

    Syzygy the Elder

    syzygy @replies

    @pedant @lisa

    Fair enough Lisa. You came back after 2 years away, knowing there’s a 1% “i’m a Leaver” on this Forum, by the regulars, to ‘rub it in.’

    Also “hope the next season of Who is better than last year!” comment. If you read many of the regular’s posts in the past year or more, the new season was welcomed by & large. Sure, like anything, there’s a few crumbs to be vacuumed & kinks to be ironed out.

    So, not cool, Lisa.

    The Old Puro & Thane.

    syzygy @replies


    Nope, I didn’t know that.  That’s me told!   Skittering off to do homework, whilst listening to this song live on YT. Thankyup, totally new to me.


    syzygy @replies


    Oh Fuck me you owe me a keyboard.

    You should tweet that flippin’ everywhere!

    syzygy @replies


    Absolutely! In fact, I be a tad envious [ahem] I didn’t put that up before.

    It’s his usual arpeggio & chordal treatment but one loves the …’s coming ….it’s coming…..chord 1  but not yet…not yet….pedal point it a bit more….& ……da. duuuuum.

    OK. I’m being very silly.  It’s terrific & I love it.

    @pedant  rough trade, eh? Is this an effort to have the pub in the music hall? 🙂


    syzygy @replies


    Man! I didn’t see your reply. Despite the ‘tick’ I’m not getting notifications from the music thread. Possibly because, I’ve been naughty & not nice so yes, a tad of a trigger but also because you know, Thane really liked him & then really despised him. The memes on the internet are pretty funny unless you’re …him. This is like He Who Should Never Be Named.

    I was thinking of d’other choon too? JD’s Shadowplay, I think. Can’t remember if it’s correct title ‘n’ all. I remember the harsh, liminal voice. I remember that f’sure.

    There’s pub action. A lot of action.

    syzygy @replies

    So because of Dracula I thought of the Bernard score which @blenkinsopthebrave might like. Also because of the Quatermass Xperiment & Torture Garden.  Mmm, Torture Garden sounds like ….the name of a band…. 🙂

    It’s short but has all the right “ooh, scary! Terrifying moments!!!”

    syzygy @replies


    Again, you see, I never said this. And others reading your response would assume I was ignorant of a political situation.


    would it be politic to ensure everyone understands the consequences. DO busy folk read the pamphlets? Or do they listen to hyped up talk show hosts on their way to Boots? Are they Guardian readers? And should that matter?


    our country may be run by politics nerds, but the politics nerds get elected by everyone. Part of that is admitting that the person who doesn’t have much time for politics should still have a say in how they’re governed. 

    Yes, of course people who don’t have time for politics should have a say in how they’re governed. To admit anything else is tyranny.

    My point was do people have time to read pamphlets? Do they prefer water cooler talk or listening to radio talk shows? Fox News Talk? BBC radio? Where Marr’s so-called ‘explosive rant’ against Johnson wasn’t explosive. Such magnification is worsening in a fear culture already made worse by austerity-chambered weaponry.  The exaggeration, the pit-bulling, the overt radicalised speech of so-called ‘conservatives’ occurs across vast echo chambers which existed less within dignified debates where a non-weasel word-usage- faraday cage focused the   suffrage debate.

    Excusing all of this with “this is democracy” is insufficient. On your point that the Constitution can cope with the election of an idiot is problematic when you peer beneath the surface & look at an amendment which allows people to keep & bear arms. The Founding Fathers weren’t thinking of 6 idiots with semi automatics in a Dodge Durango. Or walking into a church AA meeting with a weapon because most states have shall-issue laws with minimum criteria for what’s ‘good cause.’

    The Senior Syzygy.

    syzygy @replies

    @blenkinsopthebrave  Me too!  @pedant

    I didn’t know that. I knew about Tony Blair when was in my primary school years . The reason not because we studied any politics but because Hugh Grant took on the PM role in Love Actually. Everyone kept saying the character reminded people of Tony Blair

    I didn’t know about slavery connected to politics like that. I spent 12 weeks studying this. I bought (or mum did) 4 books & 1 poetry book on slavery & economics. Thank you for that


    syzygy @replies

    @pedant duly followed. Incredible. Spawn now has homework. He’s busy reading novels. But with a diet of NorthS***re & docos (the latter from me) he now needs MORE. An appetite for knowledge never to be fulfilled.

    The graphic seemed to indicate that Labour wasn’t followed because of Leadership but with Brexit, 2nd & further down.

    ** @bluesqueakpip Well, honestly, clearly I didn’t fact check with Google. Relying on my own knowledge. I think many people use Google before they post 🙂

    Rutherford Hayes won by one ECV. It was Andrew Jackson losing to John Quincy Adams who was behind in the popular vote & lost the electoral college. Admittedly I didn’t fact check. But I get a few points, I think, for remembering it was 48 ‘normal’ elections & 4 abnormals.  The whole thing is worse than actuarial study.

    Fractional electoral votes, low African American turnout, promising funds in exchange for electoral college votes, using emotional, undignified language in order to platitudinously repeat “national unity,” preparedness for aggression against minorities, using sexist, homophobic, anti-intellectual language, promoting domestic jingoism & school prayer,  promoting anti-choice for women, to the extent that earlier success for  pro-choice in the 1970s would be denounced & removed. I think that’s sufficient, when combined with loud voices & clever voices, to consider change to America’s EC  – an outdated & ill-equipped system for the modern day. Certainly, that’s all they have, at the moment, & until it changes (& referenda are notoriously anti-democratic according to various political analysts) nothing will change.

    Syzygy (typed by Thane today).

    syzygy @replies


    no, I didn’t make a mistake. I am fully aware of the electoral college having lived in the States for a while.

    It was an inversion. Inversions rarely happen. Even Rutherford Hayes lost the popular vote & the electoral college vote at the same time.  All the vote tallies, as aggregates, are frequently out of whack when elections are close.

    At times, electoral colleges seem a good thing. The current US Constitution  seems a good thing. Those who argued against it in the 90s, felt it was a dilapidated system, preventing ’emotion’ when emotion can’t be prevented. It’s very difficult to be unemotional. That was certainly the case when Bush was elected by ballots in Florida which were mostly incorrectly counted -however, that’s a separate issue.

    good grief. We’re not stupid, here, Blue, seriously.

    syzygy @replies

    I thought this would work or fit the times.

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