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18 January 2014 at 16:10 #24376
OOOH! Great discussion.
Nicely bonkers theory @barnable @fatmaninabox
However, I think it makes it just too complicated (yeah, I know!) to bring in the Moment like that, tho anything’s possible.
When the cracks first appeared, the Doctor explained them as being like (wrong) folds in the fabric of space and time, which meant that 2 places in space and time that should never actually touch, were touching. so does it not make sense that if there is a new crack in TotD that there are now 2 different “places” touching. ie in Eleventh Hour and series 5, people disappeared into non existence because it was a place of non-existence that was touching Doctor/Amy/Rory/our timeline. In TotD it’s the bit of the universe/another universe (which contains Gallifrey) which is touching “our” timeline. ie it’s a different fold from series 5.
I see the Moment as tech which is probably developed from the same tech concept that produced the TARDIS. And we know how bonkers the TARDIS’s concept of time/space and linear chronology is – “all of time and space happening at once”. So the Moment sees all of now, past and possible futures as “now”. And wants to steer the Doctor to choose the path that causes least devastation.
It’s also established, in show, that Time Lords can grant additional regenerations (the Master) so although the extra regenerations could be down to the Moment (who knows?) there is already a solution established within canon.
Re River giving additional regenerations in LKH, I agree with those above saying those regenerations were all needed to counteract the poison. We also have no idea how many regenerations River had in total. There’s no reason to presume it was a full standard issue 12. She’s not a typical Time Lord!
That phrase “regeneration is disabled” (LKH) takes on a whole new resonance in retrospect. I tend to agree with @bluesqueakpip that up till then he wasn’t thinking he was near the limit – WarDoctor was blocked in his mind, and he was probably the same as the rest of us, in thinking 10’s sneaky one didn’t count. “Disabled” also suggests something that can be enabled again, rather than something that’s a biological necessity.
15 January 2014 at 08:52 #24323Re Daleks – we’ve seen them developing throughout the 50 year run of the show. They are driven by hate and obsessed with being the only force in the universe. The Time Lords are what stands in their way. The Doctor has stopped them on several occasions; particularly in the T Baker story Genesis, when he was sent back to stop them before they got started. You can see why they might be a bit pissed off with TLs. We’ve seen them develop tech which rivals the Time Lords – The Chase (Hartnell, 65) saw them having developed time travel. That puts them in a position to challenge the Time Lords in a way very few species can. They’ve long since overcome the stairs limitation.
They are an extremely intelligent species, very cunning and with a flair for developing complex technology and weapons. All their energies – their whole reason for being (especially since they’ve dispensed with that whole messy biological reproduction thing) – are focused on universal domination. Their creative inspiration is from the nazis – look how far Hitler got with monomaniacal determination.
I’m not disagreeing that they sometimes seem to be overcome too easily, and I think it’s a mistake to put millions of flying Daleks onscreen at a time. They are at their scariest when there’s just 1 or 2 in a position of power (with the rest hovering in a nearby mothership!). The 2 or 3 we see exterminating their way thro Gallifrey are more effective for me than seeing masses of them in the sky. In the old days (ha!) they could be terrifying just by suggesting a glimpse or a shadow of a sink plunger; or the iconic Dalek surfacing from the Thames in (Dalek Invasion of Earth, 64). Even the distinctive look and shape of a Dalek designed corridor was enough to get the fear.
Oh, and congrats to @fiveroundsrapid on the blogging. Go you 🙂
12 January 2014 at 12:36 #24233Interesting post, though I thought
not to mention being far too young and unlined for a woman of 44 to find attractive
was a bit of a sweeping statement 😉 Fortunately different people find different things attractive.
I agree that Capaldi is a brilliant actor and I’m looking forward to seeing where he goes with the character. I’ve been wondering if they’ll maybe go into 6th Doctor territory – to make him an unsympathetic character who gradually warms up; the challenge being to do it properly this time. (And shades of Hartnell as well of course). No problem with a bit of conflict in the TARDIS (and there was plenty from previous companions eg Donna and Amy/Rory) so long as it doesn’t resort to boring bickering as in a lot of Davison’s stories.
I thought Matt did an amazing job though; turning on the head of a pin from manic whimsy to darkly thoughtful to outright troubled; he knocked it out the park in NotD, DotD and TotD in terms of developing the character and showing a very vulnerable, and at times quite alien, side to the Doctor.
I agree that sometimes the dead should stay dead, but that’s difficult in a show with time travel, and the target family audience. But at the same time the last 3 series in particular have taken us on an emotional journey that dealt with the fallout from grief and loss. eg knowing Amy and Rory had a good after(Doctor)life doesn’t stop us and the Doctor feeling their loss keenly; River and Matt’s final farewell scene isn’t less emotional (for me anyway) for knowing we could still see her again and that this River is only a projection. River’s biggest fear is that the Doctor will rewrite their history – don’t change anything, not one line – ie that she will be forgotten. The cracks take you out of time, like you never existed, no-one remembers you. Memories – no matter how painful – are how we keep the dead alive and stay “human”.
On the subject of memory, I suspect Capaldi’s Doctor’s apparent memory loss is temporary, to allow Clara to explain things and bring the casual viewers of the 8.1 up to date 😉
Actual deaths when they come are more shocking – Cass’s death in Night of the Doctor for example. Kahler-Jex in Town Called Mercy. Even nasty bad guy Solomon in Dinosaurs… the fact that he was exploded triggered a lot of debate about the morality of the Doctor taking his life.
12 January 2014 at 12:05 #24232Really interesting article from Den of Geek – Shark Jumping and the Casual Viewer – a voice of sanity on fandom, breaking the fourth wall and “9 million strong cliques”. Mainly about Sherlock but applies to Who as well http://www.denofgeek.us/tv/sherlock/231946/sherlock-shark-jumping-and-the-casual-viewer
11 January 2014 at 11:15 #24212Wedding photography Sherlock style….
10 January 2014 at 09:07 #24148As @blenkinsopthebrave said earlier
Have I missed much?
The real question should be: have we missed you? And the answer is a resounding YES! Welcome back from the fog of a pre-internet age.
Absolutely agree. Happy new year, and welcome back to the world of bonkers theorising 🙂
10 January 2014 at 08:55 #24147@Purofilion
That is such a moving parallel to the Doctor’s experience of being a “displaced person”. Thanks for posting
Hi and welcome to @brewski – I can see you’re going to fit in well around here 😀
@fatmaninabox I gave up on aurora-watching around 2am – too much low lying thick cloud
@purplecup re The question – the prophecy is:
“On the fields of Trenzalore, at the fall of the eleventh, when no living creature can speak falsely or fail to answer, a Question will be asked, a question that must never, ever be answered.”
So the prophecy is fulfilled, and in fact the question was answered (by Clara) (Note that the prophecy says the question “must never be answered” not that it “will” or “won’t” be answered). Or maybe it’s not – damn tricky things, prophecies 😉 (Not to mention their usually dubious sources – in this case a bodyless blue head in a box, with a reputation of being, in his former existence, shall we say, a bit shady?! )
9 January 2014 at 15:14 #24118@bluesqueakpip @blenkinsopthebrave (hope you and Mrs B are keeping safely snuggled up somewhere out of the polar vortex (near the time vortex via DVD is probably a good idea)
That’s a good point Bluesqueakpip, re Matt thinking he was going to to be the last so took River to the Singing Towers to be on the safe side. But technically Eleven is also a widower, as River died… er… before he married her!
But I don’t see any problem whatsoever about bringing River back for Capaldi, so long as it’s River pre Name of the Doctor. (Unless she gets an after-afterlife). She’s probably been chumming up with him in the future when Eleven was off on other adventures. Or maybe she was hanging out with Tasha Lem for a while, showing her how to work the TARDIS.
If it’s River pre Name otD, does that mean she will be less aware of spoilers…? ie she won’t know her avatar/projection had/will have that powerful farewell scene in NotD. But Capaldi will remember.
Interestingly the Dr Who Experience in Cardiff has the cot as an exhibit and has it labelled as “The Doctor’s cradle”
9 January 2014 at 11:53 #24109Good point about how much the actors age/grow doing DW. Not necessarily all bad, but it certainly shows in their faces.
Re the schedule – I believe the series 8 filming goes on till August
@fiveroundsrapid The first few years of BG* Doctor Who had 48 (25mins) episodes/year, filmed every week. 4 weeks off in the summer (was very grumpy for those 4 weeks, haha). But as Bluesqueakpip says the post-production is much more extensive these days. I’d guess at least 3 months intense work for each episode.
Quantity wouldn’t necessarily make it better. I’m happy so long as the creative team is firing on all cylinders (with a few deadlines to keep a little bit of motivational pressure on).
@devilishrobby Wouldn’t it be great if they could surprise us with the costume and keep it under wraps till screening? No, I know it ain’t gonna happen. Expect a photo release mid Jan.
@wolfweed My eyes!!! 😉
*BG = Before Gap
9 January 2014 at 01:18 #24096I’m sure the indigenous plantlife of Trenzalore is well adapted to short days! You can practically see it growing on front of your eyes in the minutes of daylight they have. Quite a tourist attraction. Well it was before the Church of the PF sealed it off.
The citizens of Christmas also clearly have access to artificial light so they could cultivate off-planet species also.
9 January 2014 at 00:54 #24095@phaseshift Agree re selective reading of the G below the line comments. it’s the only way to avoid @jimthefish‘s sneaky snakes 😉
Well, I suppose Sunday could see the Watsons settled into contented parental bliss with several kids and nanny Sherlock onhand to bribe them with suitably gruesome stuff… but somehow I doubt it. 😀 Agree with @jimthefish that there’s still some emotional fallout from TRF to be dealt with. I really liked that episode, esp the emotional layers, with Sherlock seeming quite vulnerable (suddenly aware that his actions, and the fact of having a reputation, have consequences, and not just to himself. He can dissociate himself from all the press hoo-ha and celeb status crap and claim he’s not playing, but that reaction in itself is engaging with “the game” and is a reaction to it. And it affects other people). Sign of Three was written by the same guy.
I really need to catch up on the early Sherlocks – can’t believe I missed them. Need to refresh my memory on the original stories too – been a long time since I read them. Agh! I need a TARDIS 😯
@whogirl – agreed re “you’ve only been gone 2 hours” – that was great. Especially coming straight after Sherlock’s carefully calculated and calibrated alcohol intake research. But then the powerful final scene where he’s again withdrawing, putting on his coat both metaphorically and literally. (As others have mentioned you can se the parallels at the end of the Green Death)
7 January 2014 at 11:19 #24024Haha @wolfweed – that’s brilliant. Nice to know that Tennant’s Richard II extensions have a continuing life 😉
Thanks also for the Timestream reveal warning when you originally posted the link to the Moffat interview.
7 January 2014 at 09:48 #24019thing that SM loves to do is give his monsters something that makes them sympathetic, when at first it seemed impossible that they could be anything but bad.
You’re right, and you could argue that thing of monsters/aliens not being what you first thought goes right back to #1 of BG (Before Gap) Dr Who. The Doctor isn’t as gruff as you think he is, the Cavemen aren’t all as uncivilised as you think, and the Thals who are initially described as “horribly mutated and evil” (OK, by the Daleks, but we don’t know the Daleks are evil at that point) turn out to be probably OK. Tho there’s another school of thought about that one too 😉
It’s very much a Doctor Who tradition that things aren’t as they first seem.
7 January 2014 at 01:35 #24014Harrumph!!
a disused yeti???!!!!!
Its very much IN use I’ll have you know. Been on the run since that pesky second Doctor… 😉
I’d say it was definitely intended that that was the original Rassilon – there’s not that many Time Lords who have that much power, megalomania etc. But it’s interesting to speculate on the timing of his return, following the events of Day of the Doctor.
7 January 2014 at 01:30 #240137 January 2014 at 00:58 #24009Greetings to all the new members, hope you’re all settling in OK. And it doesn’t matter how you watch Dr Who – whether it’s only the new series, only the old (BG) series, only ever/never watch Colin Baker episodes – so long as you enjoy it that’s what counts. Tho a tendency to bonkers theorising always helps around here 🙂
Speaking of which @bluesqueakpip @devilishrobby
Rassilon. So as far as we know he was “asleep” or yonks. When did he wake up? And why, and who woke him? Has he been participating in the Time War or was he brought back as a last resort by the High Council? Whose bright idea was that?
7 January 2014 at 00:29 #24008SPOILERS for Sherlock The Power of Three ! And for the Sign of Three too
LOL @juniperfish
Power of Three
It was a bit. (I’m assuming deliberate ref on your part). Power of Three is when the Doctor decides to try out life in the slow lane, and share his friends’ (normal) life for a while. Sign of Three shows Sherlock equally out of his depth as he tries to support his friend – and the friend’s partner 🙂 It was incredibly funny (the “time-speed devouring of the wedding feast” was brilliant – it was the accompanying sound effect that did it for me, made it slightly off-kilter) and yet, as you say, incredibly moving. You really feel for both Sherlock and John as he starts the speech – the embodiment of social ineptitude. You’re laughing at it, but at the same time I’m sure most people have been there; there’s a really warm heart to it. And a pregnancy. Yup, Power of Three. No Shakri tho… or was that the photographer?
It was written by Stephen Thompson who wrote Reichenback Fall, which I thought was great, also redolent with undercurrents of emotions (not seen any earlier ones tho so can’t compare) and directed by Colm (Bells of SJ) McCarthy. I thought he did a great job, quirky with panache, but subtle when required. Bullet time confetti indeed.
Online reaction is fearsome. While most of the critics gave it 4 or 5 stars, some of the below the line comments are vitriolic. Maybe 60-70% very positive but not much between that and ARSE. There’s a lot of serious Moff hating out there. The fact that Sherlock has a dysfunction that can’t be text book described is just another thing to batter the creators with. Sloppy research, lazy writing, it’s a soap, it’s not Daffy Duck blah blah….
But you’re right. All this fun stuff doesn’t bode well at all. Was that Charles Augustus Milverton at the end of Empty Hearse? Not to mention Sherlock – “I never make vows” – making a vow (his first and last) at the end, to always be there for (that’s approx – may have misremembered the exact words) both John and Mary.
Oh, and apparently there’s masses of v funny footage of Sherlock and Watson being drunk, that they didn’t have time or space to include
4 January 2014 at 17:54 #23927Just noticed the TARDIS cafe pic – nice one @wolfweed
@craig – @phaseshift mentioned a while back about suggestions re a way of reorganising the blog list…
Could the index page for the blogs be in a smaller font, with less of the actual blog visible? Then it would be easier to see what’s there. I’ve missed a few, but it’s hard to re-find them unless you remember the title or keywords
Or you could sort by category, but that probably involves a lot more work, and is probably less satisfying.
4 January 2014 at 13:47 #23917I still feel political debate is important… if only the participants adhere to the principles of logic and civil discourse, so they could provide an example for the civilians
Reasoned debate, as in proper communication, is the only way forward, IMHO. Unless you’re a Dalek fleet of course in which case you just wipe out the opposition… Although some of the sessions from the UK parliament (as seen on TV) leave me in despair at the levels of discourse – you get more reasoned debate from some daleks.
4 January 2014 at 13:27 #23916Ooh, lots of nice wibbly wobbly complicated speculation
River’s grave – as pointed out, wasn’t actually River’s grave, it was there to alert the Doctor to the fact it was actually a secret passage; But yes indeed, who made it? The doctor himself…? (he’s on Trenzalore for a good while – 300 years (no TARDIS), + unknown period of time when he does have access to it).
@purplecup When River first flies the TARDIS she says she was “taught by the best” – she never specifies who, and in fact implies that the Doctor was elsewhere that day. I like your idea that the TARDIS herself taught Tasha how to fly her, but it does seem like an unnecessary layer just to collect Clara.
The cracks – I think Trenzalore is a place of extreme paradoxical temporal activity – the Doctor dies there/doesn’t die there; the GI/Clara enter his timestream/don’t, the TARDIS itself dies there/doesn’t die there – so it’s not surprising the crack in the universe appears there – especially after the Doctor lands there in TotD. And the TLs are drawn to the place where the connection is strongest/”skin” is thinnest – increasing its inherent timey wimeyness.
The Doctor in TotD is as old as Eleven gets – he knows everything that has happened to him, that we have been shown so far (except for meeting the Caretaker). We’ve been told more than once that time travellers, and especially the Doctor, remember the different versions of what they’ve experienced, even when a particular timeline has been aborted. So Eleven in TotD is the one whose timestream has been messed about with by the GI and Clara (even if this will not now happen), and who has not pressed the Moment button with Hurt and Tennant.
I love that there are now almost endless possibilities re speculating what he might have got up to in the 300+ years on Trenzalore in addition to making anti-grav toys and barns that are bigger on the inside.
4 January 2014 at 12:38 #23914I was watching because I love the character of the doctor. And the ethos of the show
Can’t think of a better reason to watch the show or for you to be on here and commenting. (Unless it’s your cat’s regeneration, LOL (great avatar). And a 20′ purple scarf)
🙂
4 January 2014 at 12:31 #23913@blenkinsopthebrave Lots of harrumphing from me last night. Thank you for your calming words. It was a bit late but I opened a tasty bottle of Sauvignon anyway. And felt a lot better, as I raised a glass to your good self.
The posting format did not turn us into trolls, we consciously resisted that…
That’s true, but a lot of us, myself included, are more antagonistic on the G, because you feel more defensive (of your own opinions and of the show/subject matter in general). Venturing on to the Graun CiF as a DW fan sometimes feels like walking into a Cybership carrying a detached (but friendly) cyberhead. Or walking through the Papal Mainframe and suddenly realising that everyone’s foreheads are glowing blue.
We shall resist!
3 January 2014 at 23:05 #23893You are absolutely right in your comments about articles designed to increase the blood pressure. And the more squabbling they get below the line the more clicks they get. Does it matter when the subject is popular entertainment? Or is it a massive big warning sign about the pressure on media writers? I don’t believe any of the established newspaper heavyweights has found a way of making online publishing work financially – hence the reliance on fast turnaround, poorly researched, clickbait articles like the recent Lawson one, whose viewing stats presumably impress the advertisers. And sales of actual newspapers are plummeting faster than ever. So how is the next generation of journalists ever going to learn the trade properly when this sort of cr*p is what’s rewarded?
For some reason I am reminded of the thick greasy yellow fog that was spreading out from London at the beginning of Bleak House 🙁
(Not caught up with the rest of the Sherlock series yet, but presumably the writers write what they know about. An argument for developing a bigger pool of writers from diverse backgrounds perhaps?)
3 January 2014 at 22:41 #23892I am sure there are sound sociological reasons for it, to do with the nature of social media in a mass society, or…
More like unsocial media sometimes!
It is interesting though. And it’s easy to hit out at Twitter (make a coherent point in 140 characters or less) and the general anonymity of posting online. And the proliferation of supposedly witty cod-philosphy pictures that circulate on Facebook etc – increasingly with advertising embedded. (Embedded advertising is a particularly sore point at the moment – just managed to scrape something called Friends Tracker off the inner bits of my computer. It came in legitimately, except it didn’t ask my permission, with a Firefox update. Suddenly, including on this site, there were double underlined links everywhere, some more relevant than others. It seemed to struggle with words like Dalek, but it did try (not very successfully)).
perhaps we are just dealing with lots and lots of horrible mean-spirited gits who have “sh*t on the liver” as my old gran used to say.
Love your old gran – she sounds great. I come back to the example of this Forum. There is definitely something going right with it, in that it seems to encourage the opposite kind of behaviour, largely, I think, because the majority practise what we claim to represent ie tolerance for everyone’s opinion. If you go on the Graun these days, you expect to be challenged in a not particularly nice way. You become defensive, which is a small step from becoming offensive yourself. The smartass put-down rules, and comments are interpreted as being antagonistic when they may be at best ambiguous/misplaced humour.
People tend to conform to expectations.
Or your old gran may just have hit the nail on the head!
3 January 2014 at 21:45 #23888Haha – been there exactly with Hollyoaks, for the same reason! (Ditto XFactor (I can’t tell you how happy I am that it seems to have slipped in favour, at least with my teenager, the last couple of years)) The things you have to do, eh? I reckon I’ve more than earned my time with the Doctor – even if it’s sometimes seriously timeshifted to get peace and quiet to watch.
🙂
3 January 2014 at 21:41 #23887Agree completely with your “tall poppy” comment; I find it thoroughly depressing; especially as it tends to be contagious.
And with @thommck‘s comment re the “casual viewer” – see my comment above re starting off with The Empty Hearse. What IS a “casual viewer” anyway? How many of the 8-9m viewers are casuals, and how many are the “obsessive “minority” fans”?
Anyway, am looking forward to this Sunday’s The Sign of Three (Directed by Colm “Bells of St John” McCarthy)
3 January 2014 at 21:27 #23885Well, I finally managed to catch up on Sherlock. Not having watched any of the first 2 series, tho a long term fan of the original stories, I decided to experiment and jump straight into the most recent. I really enjoyed it, didn’t have any problem keeping up with what was going on and was very impressed with the acting – esp the leads, and Gatiss was paticularly impressive as Mycroft – and direction/production. (There’s a high quality look to everything coming out of BBC Cymru studios these days). I then watched Reichenbach Fall (this timey wimey thing is catching). Overall I preferred RF f0r its internet/smartphone storyline, but I like the way they’ve brought SH bang up to date. I’ve never thought of Holmes in any incarnation as being particularly gritty realism, so I don’t have a problem with him glossing over the lower orders. Doyle wasn’t trying to be Dickens – tho both were very popular writers (hence Holmes’ original unplanned resurrection).
The similarities with Who are quite striking if you look at the basic outlines and there is a danger of being too selfconsciously self-referential re fans etc, but for the moment I think both are managing to keep on the tightrope. The 50th was a particularly special year for DW and I can happily forgive it some indulgences. Ditto re the Xmas specials.
Re the Guardian link, there was a similar article in the Indie today. I agree with those above who say these articles are just clickbait. Below the line comments are becoming mindnumbingly predictable, with no real discussion being generated. Both DW and SH are SERIALS FFS!!! Surely the audience figures alone give the lie to the claim that both are being made for a “small” group of obsessives.
RIP Intelligent Journalism
1 January 2014 at 19:00 #23784Happy 2014 everyone
<moves very slowly on to the sofa>
Welcome @monochromedimension, fellow Hartnell/Troughton fan 🙂
@cathannabel – agree re your no 2 comment about coincidence. There will be a connection somewhere!
And yes, @nicelyuseless @arbutus Cats do indeed rule the universe… meow
1 January 2014 at 18:55 #23783Then, in a future anniversary, the Doctor could revisit these events, and people will moan that it all sounded so much better in their imaginations and blame whoevers writing the show at that time
haha, that made me chuckle.
I agree though, I like how it opens up possibilities for the Time Lords’ story. No saying which side would come out on top ie Rassilon’s group may be smaller (and less united) but I think they have most power/knowledge/megalomania on their side. If the War Council managed to come out on top, then it might very well be a less powerful group of Time Lords who eventually emerge, who either have to relearn some of their old skills, or turn to the Doctor for knowledge. In which case he could be back to being enemy no 1 for them. Lots of possibilities.
31 December 2013 at 20:09 #23743@arkleseizure – Capaldi is forever going to be Kidneys for me from now on (other than that I’m very confused, and tongue’s completely twisted after 1st go at @osakahatter‘s challenge!
😛
@bluesqueakpip – Also, if it didn’t look like he was starting to regenerate, then his enemies might want a closer look at the body, to make sure they’d actually got him this time.
31 December 2013 at 20:00 #23742@juniperfish – perfect choice for River
@arbutus Perfect bit of CSN&Y
@whisht Thanks for starting and keeping this thread going. Harrison was great and Altered Images always makes me smile. Reminded me of this –
Which looks like a great way to bring in the new year
A toast also to @htpbdet (will always think about you now, when looking at the stars)
31 December 2013 at 13:47 #23706to bonker
You just made me splutter all over my screen!
To boldly bonker…
@juniperfish – Big Dog is seriously creepy. That probic vent looks very vulnerable tho. (And don’t get me started on drones… )
@craig I (furrily) second the finny one’s request for a Smithy Retrospective thread
31 December 2013 at 13:42 #23705Pale Green Ghosts – very apt, thanks for posting 🙂
How about Talking Heads for a River tribute…? 😥
31 December 2013 at 13:02 #23700And this one’s especially for @juniperfish (Irish /French singer Camille singing Cave (tho she really needs to be seen live)). Happy hogmanay.
31 December 2013 at 13:00 #23699Happy birthday to us – IT’S TOO LATE TO STOP NOW!
(tenuous link to Van Morrison 😉 )
31 December 2013 at 12:52 #23697Everything has an end, Clara, even bonkers theories*
Oh, you think??!
Just cos there’s a few less dangling ends than usual, you think we’re gonna stop now?! @juniperfish, @bluesqueakpip and me are just getting started on the wealth of possibilities that is Tasha Lem, for starters 😉
(Feel free to join in!)
*We should maybe clear out the few dead ones in the cupboard behind the sofa tho… the rest perked up when they realised they could all happily coexist with the official series in their own little bubble universes/aborted timelines etc
31 December 2013 at 12:47 #23696I was looking thro the blogs for @phaseshift‘s brilliant rundown on the morals of the Time Lords – but I can’t find it now 🙁 But safe to say they’ve never been a particularly reputable or trustworthy bunch – and generally get worse every time we’ve seen them. All that (almost) absolute power n stuff.
But I agree – they’re now available if required, and can be a long term motivation. I like what Moffat has done in clearing the decks for Capaldi’s run, even if he went round the houses tpo do it, haha.
OTOH I did come across this blog (by the prophetic @bluesqueakpip) which is worth re-viewing, considering it was written way back in May! http://www.thedoctorwhoforum.com/sidrat/the-eleventh-hour/
31 December 2013 at 12:22 #23692@phaseshift – TV suggestions – seconding, thirding, fourthing…. SPACED!! (How could I forget 🙁 )
31 December 2013 at 12:21 #23691Greetings to @densire. Nice first post. Come and join us in the pub!
No problem about only catching up on Who since 2005 – we have a wide and varied selection of fans in here from all eras. (You wouldn’t believe the amount of collective knowledge! We’re a virtual PhD course!) All contributions welcome.
For more about the Doctor on audio, check out this blog
31 December 2013 at 12:13 #23690Oh… not been in here for a while.
We appear to have gone sleazy/casual ( 😯 @fatmaninabox (nice threads) @wolfweed (that fur coat looks familiar!))
@osakahatter – I see we have our own dedicated barista now. He volunteered, works all hours, never complains – says he’s here to serve, and has a reference from Winston Churchill. Says the sink plunger comes in handy too.
31 December 2013 at 12:06 #23688Cheers everyone.
We are 1 – woo-who!
Couldn’t put it better than @juniperfish (both red and blue fins, with extra sparkles 😉 ) and @phaseshift have already said… except – maybe we should head for the pub (before Emperor @craig gets grumpy about the spilled drinks all over the web!)
Thanks everyone, it’s been a great year. Coffee and alcohol on the house at the Rose and Crown
30 December 2013 at 09:39 #23652I should drop in here more often 😉
@miapatrick I used to love Lester Bangs when he had guest columns in NME, thanks for the reminder.
This is a couple of days old now, but it’s a lovely tribute in the Graun about some of the major writers who left us in 2013
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2013/dec/28/literary-giants-died-2013
Thank you and RIP to Chinua Achebe, Iain Banks, Seamus Heaney, Elmore Leonard and Doris Lessing – I could say a lot more, but they all say it so much better.
30 December 2013 at 09:23 #23651@Scatamonkey
The Doctor had already been to Trenzalore…….so how did he not recognise it when he arrived there the second time?
It was shielded, remember, by the Papal Mainframe – intergalactic security team (“keeping you safe in this world… and the next”) who arrived first. Presumably that shielding included its GPS co-ordinates. The Doctor obv had his suspicions when he insisted on knowing what it was called.
30 December 2013 at 09:18 #23650That’s a lovely idea that Lem is a tribute to Stanislaw Lem. I really hope we see more of Tasha (big fan of Orla Brady). Created by the TimeLords, huh? Interesting, but comes up against the same problem as my “she is a Time Lord” theory – if that’s the case then why couldn’t she call to the TLs thro the crack – her voice would carry as much weight as Clara’s you’d’ve thought. Or is it only Clara who would think to appeal directly to them? I also like @bluesqueakpip‘s idea that she might have been the model when the Kovarian Chapter were hatching their River plot.
Speaking of casting, one of those little Who coincidences – Clara’s gran is played by Sheila Reid, who also had a part in Vengeance on Varos.
@fatmaninabox – I’m even more impressed, but enjoy your penance 😉
@d12345 It’s OK, we understand that you didn’t like the last 2 shows. That’s fine, it’s your opinion, it’s respected on here; but please don’t disrespect others by saying everyone who disagrees with you is stupid.
@nicelyuseless – fell off the sofa (again!) at your Specials comment. They were tho 😉
And just to reiterate @juniperfish‘s point – speculation is FUN. Long may we continue to live up to our motto.
29 December 2013 at 16:07 #23599Welcome, and not stupid questions. I think we may have to agree a consensus on numbering/naming on here. It’s mighty confusing 😉 (As @jimthefish says Tennant is now 11 AND 12!))
Personally I like the idea of Capaldi as the new No 1 😉 but I’ll settle for 12.
My pref would probably be to stick with the original numbering for now, with Hurt as 8a, Tennant as 10 and Smith as 11. But that’s probably just cos I’m old, and set in my ways, hehe
@fatmaninabox – I am as always mightily impressed with your ability to identify bits of music
29 December 2013 at 16:02 #23598but what is a forum for if not idle speculation about what might occur in the future?
Absolutely. And I’m proud to say we’ve been living up to our strapline.
@devilishrobby The Tasha Lem actress has also said she’s extremely good at keeping secrets!
There’s obviously a lot we don’t know about her… her ability to fly the TARDIS is especially intriguing. She may have been a companion before she joined the Church of the PM for example, or a companion to another Time Lord. Or maybe she is herself a Time Lord – the not allowing herself to age thing for example. But then presumably she could have spoken to the TLs thro the crack, without having to go and get Clara. I’d be happy to see her back, with a connection to the Doctor, but preferably not a family one! Intriguing thought that she’s a River incarnation tho. Or a projection from the Library.
I wrongly suggested earlier that the Dr and Clara sent projections of themselves to the Papal Mainframe, but it was only their clothes which were holograms. So, am still wondering why that’s in there – just for the gag-value, to get Matt in the buff, or is there something else going on?
29 December 2013 at 00:40 #23571Matt being much more resigned, accepting and, well, happy to go and frankly being the better man for it.
That’s because he is now reconciled with his past self’s behaviour. Tennant was still in the middle of trying to deal with the consequences of what he remembered he’d done as Hurt Dr. Eleven acknowledges “Capt Grumpy” as a true incarnation of himself (his speech about remembering (and admitting to/forgiving) all the people we’ve been), he also acknowledges 10’s cheat (“I had vanity issues”), and admits he is no 13. He embraces old age as a life stage – he’s less manic but as you say, better for it at this point. Instead of keeping the little boy waiting as he did with Amy, this Doctor sticks around – or at least comes back before the boy has grown too much older.
29 December 2013 at 00:31 #23570I am completely in awe of you both!
And delighted that the Egyptian myths, dual timestreams and rebirth into a new cycle theories have made it through.(I’m also delighted that we (haha – royal “we” is great) continue to more than live up to our collective strapline. And yet… both of you hook your theories so strongly on in-episode evidence)
It’s the Doctor’s action in making Clara stay behind, to keep her safe, “for one last victory,” which initiates the events that ultimately lead to his being “saved”. I don’t think it’s coincidence, or just down to cost-saving that a lot of the war scenes on Trenzalore resemble similar scenes on Gallifrey (in TDotD). Although I’m rather more in @phaseshift‘s camp of being suspicious of the TimeLords’ motives.
Just thinking further about BSP’s timeloop theory – there is certainly a LOT of time unaccounted for onscreen. The TARDIS is on her own (with Clara as hitchhiker) for approx 300 years). But then there is also enough time for Matt to grow to (Hartnellish) white haired old age, when he does have access to the TARDIS. Who knows what he gets up to then. (Apart from it making space for Matt’s pension plan!)
@Purofilion The Doctor has been carrying a huge burden with him since the 2005 reboot. He’s questioned all his actions and motives. He’s used being hyper, and always running towards the next big thing, as an excuse not to settle or commit. Until finally, at Trenzalore he stops running and does both. He’s not embracing death or rushing towards it, but he’s not trying to escape it either. He allows himself to just grow old (and up), while making himself an integral and useful part of the community. He fixes things. And makes them better – the antigrav wheels and the barn which is bigger on the inside suggest he still has access to tech (thro the TARDIS?).
By the end of this episode we have a Doctor at the beginning of a new cycle (who paradoxically looks as old as the first one of the first cycle! (Brain of Morbius knocked out the park then?). Is this a Timelord “thing”? Who may or may not remember his first 13 incarnations. Who is the last of his race (but only in this universe), and is now the hope of his people, rather than their nemesis. He is very definitely The Doctor, not the Warrior.
Further question re Tasha Lem – why doesn’t she age? (I don’t believe in it either, but just thinking that isn’t having any effect!!)
28 December 2013 at 23:53 #23568@wolfweed – thanks a mill – it makes 100% sense now, and I shall be practicing in my bedroom 😉 (Is that one of yours or scavenged on t’interwebz?)
the silence ending up being the good guys
You did indeed call that, kudos to you. I agree that in some ways it would have been cool for Matt to change to Capaldi on the tower, but as I said earlier, it felt much better for Matt to have a proper goodbye scene. And what a scene! It would have been hard for Capaldi to come in cold on that one, and Matt earned it for all his work since the Eleventh Hour. There is a precedent for the “reset mode/delayed change” in Tennant’s regeneration (second time 😉 ) and at least Matt had a very short one.
I love the scenes with Clara’s nan, but I don’t think it’s meant to imply a family connection with the Doctor (tho you never know!). She’s dismissed by the rest of the family, yet she’s the one who connects instinctively with what Clara is feeling – she ignores her son’s pleas to tell the story of “the pigeon” and instead tells the story that Clara needs to hear. There’s a wealth of feeling and life experience in the moment when she touches her wedding ring as she thinks back to the first time she saw the man who gave it to her.
(Sorry, got grit in my eye again!! (or maybe @Junipefish’s space glitter!))
😥
28 December 2013 at 23:36 #23566I second @blenkinsopthebrave‘s vote for Strax as avatar of the month for January 😉 (1st birthday, pushing 1000 members and over 20k posts… whatever did we find to talk about?! Thanks everyone (and especially @craig for actually doing it), it’s been a blast!)
@cathannabel Glad you managed to get access to a TARDIS so you could complete your blog; jumping up and down with excitement 😀
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