[Timeloop @replies]

@bluesqueakpip Well people who thought the screwdriver to be irreplaceable would treat it as a higher sacrifice of the Doctor, wouldn’t they?

[Timeloop @replies]

A BIG hello to everybody new who has recently signed up. I hope you feel free to join in our arguments and point out stuff. I hope more and more lurkers step out of the shadows, but lurking is fine as well 😉

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant  I didn’t mind that the Doctor could have a new one at will. River is still the first person he gave a screwdriver. So he has had a hard time parting with it.

That software bit did not make it much better for me. Could you explain how that changes things big time for you?

[Timeloop @replies]

@ahowe444 River explained in the second part of this two-parter. The Doctor gave it to her when they visited the Singing Towers (off-screen). He did it to save her. Because he knew she was going to her death.

[Timeloop @replies]

@fivefaces Good point. We should keep an eye out for that! Nice connection to Reichenbach as well.

@wolfweed Do you have a detailed, international analysis? Would love to get my hands on that. For example how many people per country, general reaction per country and so on.

@geoffers Yes, Clara and Bad Wolf are definitely part of it. But he might have tried to explain why he had to do it, just as he did with the Master, so why didn’t he?

@the-war-doctor Hi there! Trying to be gentle. Though I have to say I think David Tennant will have moved on by then.

Welcome to everyone new @elouise & @the-war-doctor ! Looking forward to your options on Doctor Who.

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant @juniperfish @bluesqueakpip

Yay! A discussion!

Reading your posts I realized it does not have to be black or white. It’s more of a gray-ish mixture.

My take on things after reading your thoughts has been this: There has been once a different decision made by the Hurt Doctor. A decision to burn Gallifrey. However in this time-stream there would always be a 10 and 11 to interfere. The two streams “survive” but in going forward only the one where Gallifrey is in tact would go on. So everyone after the Hurt Doctor does not remember what really happened. Which leaves 10 still thinking Gallifrey was burning in the end of time.

BUT

I just can’t do that. Fixed time cannot be altered, or it would disintegrate. Which leaves the Doctor only always thinking he has done it.
And even in the two stream theory: Who says we see the first version with 9? He would be left just as devastated if (and even in this theory it would always turn out that way) he thinks he remembers events that never took place.

I am happier to figure out something timey-wimey for the end of time than to have to break a big no-no so it works out.

Whichever way we choose, they create problems:

1. Closed loop causality: How is the Doctor going to deal with the people on Gallifrey? Will the High Council end time itself as they planned before they got frozen in time? Will the Doctor receive some kind of punishment? Or will he get some honor for his “solution”? Will they ever show his family? How did 11 change his opinion so radical in comparison to 10 in the end of time? Was it all Clara?
2. Two streams: The massive paradox you are creating with a rewritten fixed point. This version would change the personality of the Doctor a big deal the second time around. Would he make the same decisions? The same problem with the radical change in his behavior towards the TLs. Basically every problem the first version has + the massive paradox.

I really don’t think this makes the story less impressive & deep @juniperfish.
Re Gallifrey burns in end of time. The TLs know that they are about to burn, that Gallifrey will fall in some near future. Honestly how else can they still sit in this meeting and decide to end time? It has not yet burned in that point of time, although it is already locked. So how can the Gallifrey we see already burn (with them on it)?
Since you do remember my earlier post I already had doubts at the end. I tried to pitch the idea that we observed the creation of a new Gallifrey.

@pedant Love the idea that he (11) repeats lake Silencio.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@juniperfish !!!!!!! I just found this and see my theory fully intact. So happy right now.

 

“So that was the story – of course he never did that, he couldn’t. He’s the Doctor – he’s the man who doesn’t do that. He’s defined by the fact that he doesn’t do that, whatever the cost, he will find another way. So it had to be the story of what really happened, that he’s forgotten. Of course he didn’t – he’s Doctor Who! He doesn’t do things like that!”
-Steven Moffat

[Timeloop @replies]

Where are you @juniperfish ? Caught in RL? Looking forward to your answer!

[Timeloop @replies]

@janetteb @whohar @denvaldron

Moffat already said that he got one for Capaldi’s appearance in Doctor Who and Torchwood he will slowly play out.

[Timeloop @replies]

@wolfweed Your spoilers are so accurate I’m afraid to look!

[Timeloop @replies]

@juniperfish

Okay I watched it. And I have to agree with you. Looks like the two stream facility idea I settled for earlier. Gallifrey looks so different. Definitely after the time lock (and supposedly burning). So maybe in the version we have seen this weekend the Timelords have not yet decided that they will end time itself.

But that would create a paradox, don’t you think? I mean this moment is definitely fixed? And fixed points can’t be altered. River learned that the hard way.

The 10th Doctor has had so much hatred for the Timelords. At the mention they might escape he is immediately willing to take a gun. There were supposed to be so much more baddies in the final day of Gallifrey…
What changed his attitude?

Another thing I noticed: In the end of time Gallifrey is soooo quiet. It is supposed to be heavily attacked but there is nothing but silence.

Have you considered that Gallifrey is forming anew? That is the only other way it could look so burning red without anyone on it (and no battle(ships) going on/flying about). This form of escape from their pocket universe would exclude the paradox?

@scaryb “”Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.”

It’s a quote from Roman emperor and philosopher Marcus Aurelius – but the bits that jump out are “No more” and “a good man” (ref to AGMGTW title?)”

Also ‘good man’ is a direct link to the 11th Doctor (A good man goes to war)!

@bluesqueakpip @ardaraith

I do like the idea that they can only move within his own time stream and alter and visit things he did up to his first visit at Trenzalore.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@tennantmarsters2013 Report any missing posts here. The automated spam-checking software is glitching sometimes. Try to give some details about the time and the content as well because that makes it easier for the admins to find it  fast and fix it.

[Timeloop @replies]

@juniperfish I will have to re-watch this two-parter sometime soon before I can form an opinion and if the pictures of Gallifrey suggest a different past. I would like to give an informed answer.

Do you really feel it would take away the depth? He would be dealing with the same issue. The only thing he would have is a lucky escape. It is no false reality per se . Gallifrey is still lost up to this point. It is still his doing.

 

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant I agree. And to be …er… pedantic ….. ( 😀 ) wouldn’t ultimate destruction include the whole universe? You cannot top ultimate. That would include everything? ;D But I am willing to give into this one. It is just nitpicking. 😉

@pedant @jimthefish I think the software might be connected to the TARDIS and is always available to any new device. So the Doctor can’t lose it.

[Timeloop @replies]

You can always find something you don’t like when you stubbornly keep looking for it. It saddens me that so many in the interwebs feel entitled to so much ARSE. Telling them what they should have done. Moffat has packed so much in this one episode. I was afraid there would not be enough time to get through it all in time but he managed it stunningly.
I felt very content when I left the cinema. And I was not alone. My whole screening room was applauding when the credits were shown. How often do people actually applause a story they decided to watch in cinema.

They have done an amazing job IMO. They moved hundreds and thousands of people to interact with the story through applauding and laughing and taking part in the presented story.

@denvaldron Why can’t you see what so many others can? I agree with @bluesqueakpip . We (sorry @pedant feel yourself excluded. With we I am referring to the audience) don’t actually need to see how the ‘Moment’ works for example. The children who watch the episode don’t need to understand how exactly the ‘Moment'(a weapon of mass destruction) works. They don’t explain other weapons like laser guns or how memory filters in the black archive work. So why should Moffat feel compelled to explain a weapon he won’t even use and loose screening time on that? I see no reason whatsoever.

@bluesqueakpip I think in this case he is saved by the ‘Moment’, really. It decides to take him there, just as you said. The ‘Moment’ shows him the way out (though through Clara, I agree).

@juniperfish I don’t totally agree. It is time locked. I think we agree so far? That means the event cannot be altered or time WILL disintegrate. Time would die. Doctors 9-11 are left thinking they did it, since most Daleks and all TLs except the Master disappear.

@denvaldron @ardaraith I agree that preventing the return of the Timelords is a possible motivation/reason for the Silence. I had in fact the same idea but it slipped through my hands on my way back home. So kudos @ardaraith for coming up with it. Though I don’t think this has much more the potential to be the underlying theme for the next seven seasons.

@hudsey Yes, makes sense. So we will have 1-11, the Hurt/war Doctor and number 13. The number 12 spot is left blank.

@maudey56 This is how I see it: The Doctors up to 12 forget the Day of the Doctor due to timey-wimey distortions (they talk about that in the Tower of London). The 10th Doctor is left to believe that he did use the ‘Moment’ because that is the last thing he remembers. He therefore thinks there is no hope left and can never ever go looking for it, because it is time locked(expect for that one point in his time stream, which he doesn’t know).

@juniperfish “However, I am delighted the Time Lords are potentially back in play. There are lots of interesting directions the long narrative could go in from here. Eleven looked full of hope at the possibility of going “home”, but of course the First Doctor did run away in the first place because Time Lord society was stuffy, rule-bound and problematic. A long arc which explored nostalgia for an imagined home versus the far more conflicted and complicated reality once one returns could be fantastic.”
There will be problems and consequences for the Doctor when and if he returns home. I still would very much like to see more of where the Doctor came from. I don’t think they will into deep problems because it is meant to be a show for the whole family.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@soundworld I did modify what I said earlier. Amy denied herself to be rescued the first time around. She then allowed her younger self  to flee when she was in line to play the old Amy.

The Doctor never did it in the first place. He only thought he did. I therefore feel there is a difference in the story. He still has to live 400 years until he can find a different solution, but it is the same one. He already did it the first time around.

I think that creates an important difference.

[Timeloop @replies]

On a re-watch I must admit it is not the idea of the two streams facility. This event is time locked. Up until 11 the Doctor only thinks he has done it which brings along his change. In no reality did he ‘burn’ Gallifrey.

@juniperfish “The end of time” still makes sense. But instead of trying to escape the time lock they look for a way out of the bubble/pocket universe. And we have seen the war council and not the high council, right?

[Timeloop @replies]

Taking Craig’s offer

May I just say: Wow! LOVED IT

Just got back from the cinema. Same as @wolfweed. The hive mind was whooping and laughing and even applauding at two or three points in the cinema. Especially at the 1213 Doctors. Several cosplayers as well. I saw a TARDIS, a 7, a lot of 10s and 11s. And many screwdrivers. One came as a human Dalek like in the Asylum of the Daleks.
At the mention of the ‘Moment’ I actually went “Ha!”. Very loudly. Was worth it.

It was just a really amazing piece of art, pun intended. 3D was just stunning as well. Especially the picture(s)!

I can’t come up with any coherent thought yet. Looking very much forward to your thoughts!

Cheers,

Timeloop
P.S.: Where does that leave the Doctor and Clara?
Regeneration issue of thirteen? All of them knew how and why and therefore it wasn’t addressed?
The idea with the thinking was brilliant.
He used the same idea like the two stream facility. Very clever. Don’t you always say he uses test-runs before he uses the idea in something big?

_______________________

Is it okay to talk about the Christams teaser in here as well? @scaryb and @others Would you feel that is overstepping into ‘Spoilers’?

@abzorbaloff Most members here take pride in a sound analysis of the episode. I am sure once they came around analyzing it all there will be a vivid discussion about implications of the movie.

I do like how they used Rose. Very good acting on her part. And they positioned 10 as a player(a man who has lots and lots of superficial female relations) further AND qualified his “I don’t wanna go”

And again the two streams facility idea is brilliant. You have to live it one way first so you can then alter it in a different way. Just as brilliant as the calculations and 13 Doctors figuring out how to put Gallifrey into a painting. It also explains how 11 can not remember it since 10 is bound to forget it all.

Going to re-watch it now.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

May I just say: Wow! LOVED IT

Just got back from the cinema. Same as @wolfweed. The hive mind was whooping and laughing and even applauding at two or three points in the cinema. Especially at the 1213 Doctors. Several cosplayers as well. I saw a TARDIS, a 7, a lot of 10s and 11s. And many screwdrivers. One came as a human Dalek like in the Asylum of the Daleks.
At the mention of the ‘Moment’ I actually went “Ha!”. Very loudly. Was worth it. 😆

It was just a really amazing piece of art, pun intended. 3D was just stunning as well. Especially the picture(s)!

I can’t come up with any coherent thought yet. Looking very much forward to your thoughts!

Cheers,

Timeloop
P.S.: Where does that leave the Doctor and Clara?
Regeneration issue of thirteen? All of them knew how and why and therefore it wasn’t addressed?
The idea with the thinking was brilliant.
He used the same idea like the two stream facility. Very clever. Don’t you always say he uses test-runs before he uses the idea in something big?

 

[Timeloop @replies]

Hey guys,

 

just a quick hello from the cinema. Hope you enjoy the show! Really excited right now O_O

 

cheers

 

timeloop

[Timeloop @replies]

@tardisblue *waves back* My pleasure – simply one quick search away. I hope a lot use the opportunity! Haha, I just remembered Marta’s journey around earth to tell everyone to think of the word ‘Doctor’ when the countdown ends. Will be something like that for me personally.

I am doing something similar @tardisblue. I invited the only friend who knows Doctor Who (sad, right?) for a sleepover/ Doctor Who Marathon. Will try to sneak some of that Doctor Who BBC feed on Saturday. And then we will rush to the cinema to meet more follow-whovians. I can’t wait to see which kind of person in Germany filled all those screening rooms. Because I don’t see any of them ever on other occasions. My mate (yeah, using slang *hehe*coughs*) even wants to dress up in some Doctor-ish fashion which will be fun. There will be a lot of squeeing and giggling before the movie. There will be an instant discussion of the movie afterwards.

@janetteb and @everyone else who might have waited for an answer: Sorry I didn’t answer sooner. Ever since I was lured into that CIN trap I was just keeping taps on this forum and only very reluctantly watched video material. I felt this would make it easier to get away from spoiling the movie (in just little ways). I don’t even dare to go near ‘Spoilers’ now. There are things out there @wolfweed won’t even post in ‘Spoilers’ because they are too spoiler-ish!

I did however watch The Ultimate Guide and the Last Night of the Doctor. I liked all that recap in the guide. Although I would have classified one thing Moffat said as a spoiler but I won’t repeat it just in case. Moffats description of the Daleks was weirdly fitting: Robots with an anger problem 😆

@Shazzbot @scaryb @bluesqueakpip @juniperfish @craig @jimthefish @pedant @whisht @danmartinuk @arkleseizure @pufferfish @Airedales etc. @blenkinsopthebrave @fatmaninabox @magnetite @osakahatter @steve-thorp @tardisblue @thommck@janetteB @whohar @wolfweed @miapatrick @phaseshift @mini-htpbdets and @everyone else who wants to be included – my apologies to those forgotten.

Since someone (sorry, didn’t make a note) pointed it out in some thread that some of you won’t be near the Internet due to traveling or having/taking part in massive celebrations (looking forward to the pictures!) I felt compelled to address all of you now:
I hope all of you have a splendid weekend! Try to enjoy the movie wholeheartedly – we have to wait another month for the Christmas special and then there will be the long desert of nothingness. Looking forward to discussing bonkers theories with you!

@bluesqueakpip I hope you don’t mind I rounded up several topics in here. Otherwise it would have been all over the place. I made sure there is no spoiler of any kind in this post.

 

 

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@bluesqueakpip Welcome to the team! They had to double at some point … Only 79 to choose from.

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant Love it!

Depends on which name I would choose. You can now call me the Priest (which is quite like monk and as 11 stated: monks are not cool) by my real name, the Master by my nickname (meeeeh…) and the Chronomancer by my forum name.

I think I will stick with that last one =) Thanks!

[Timeloop @replies]

@Shazzbot Great! I think this might be a fun element to remember a guy many respected. Let’s include a toast to 50 years of Doctor Who as well.

Anybody who is interested: This would be your time to toast: http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=Synchronised+International+Doctor+Who+Forum+Toast&iso=20131122T21&p1=136

Everybody is welcome to join in. Might be a bit like Silvester 😆

[Timeloop @replies]

@Shazzbot How about we set up a time where everybody in this forum who wants to participate toasts to Chris? (On the evening of the meeting) And everybody in a different timezone just figures out their respective time. Everybody can join in, even lurkers.

And maybe one more general toast to Doctor Who and that it brought similar minds closer?

I think that might be appropriate and in the spirit of this forum? What do you think?

[Timeloop @replies]

@Shazzbot Weren’t you offline for weeks when you were waiting for a new one? 😉 Was just a spoof, don’t take it seriously ;D

[Timeloop @replies]

@Shazzbot @fatmaninabox You should stop that. 😀 Though it is always very funny with your wee and different beverages all over your screen, think of your poor laptops. How much more liquid can they take before your pictures cause a short circuit? 😀

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant I see you fixed it. Why German though?

And honestly the first thing I came up with were those badges you linked. I thought you wouldn’t know them.  But I don’t think “for those of us of a certain age” applies, since I am 23 and know them. They were quite popular in all shapes and forms after Fukushima and that kind of movement finally enabled a law to shut down every single atomic power plant in Germany by 2022.

According to Wikipedia you call it a “Nuclear power phase-out”.

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant Actually there is a typo. It should say fischige Sache. Why would that confuse me? Why do you want to confuse me? To which badges are you referring?

Cheers,

Timeloop

P.S: not confused.

[Timeloop @replies]

@Shazzbot I’d like for my avatar to be there as well. Might wanna take an aspirin before you go to bed ;D
I think River deserves a cocktail as well. Something with champagne since she conjured it “disgracefully”.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@wolfweed £6,301.00 ! How much are people willing to pay for that? Great stuff for children in need. Seven more days to go. I wonder where the bidding will stop?

[Timeloop @replies]

@miapatrick It shouldn’t! Try to keep it as long as possible ;D

[Timeloop @replies]

Hiya,

The thought that the humongous TARDIS is foreshadowing the day of the Doctor big time just crossed my mind.

Cheers,
Timeloop

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@wolfweed @craig

So it seems to be a button and no big gemstone. Apologies.

Rose does not quite look like herself, does she? Looks kinda shape-shifty-ish

[Timeloop @replies]

@scaryb @bluesqueakpip Well done you two! =)

I see what you mean. ARSE is really dangerous and contagious. Thanks. I will take a step back and watch it through unbiased eyes. Well, I will try.

And my theory is just one way to fill Moffats framework. It doesn’t work alone. I really get the point of you two =)

[Timeloop @replies]

@jimthefish RE continuity porn Good to know!

IF my theory turns out to be true I will be ecstatic for days, weeks or even months!

@scaryb Bonkers theorizing would be boring when you don’t really try to crack something before the episode is shown. Why would you want to forget something you spend weeks pondering about?

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@scaryb It takes a lot out of the guessing game though. It is very specific.

[Timeloop @replies]

Alright, I watched it. Will be spectacular in 3D

The thing that stands out most for me is Clara using a Vortex manipulater on her own??

The Moment on the other hand could mean anything.

[Timeloop @replies]

@scaryb There is more going on there. Pictures and stuff. But yes, leaked trailers as well. The official one is not out yet, is it?

[Timeloop @replies]

@craig The proper trailer?

[Timeloop @replies]

Haven’t watched any of the videos, waiting for the official one. BUT if there will be the Moment like @craig was convinced in #20322 I am going to faint and squeak and  hop up and down – basically to lose it. I would definitely be ecstatic for a few days. Can’t wait!

The picture in the first video (did stop it right at the beginning) of this page is probably the one we were musing about with the letter and “under gallery”.

Cheers, (nice to see you @chickenelly ! The videos/fate/chance don’t want you on the dark side then =D )

Timeloop
 

[Timeloop @replies]

@miapatrick Congrats! Well done and very impressive 😉

[Timeloop @replies]

@all Woah, we really got the whole bonkers theorizing started again, didn’t we?

So much input, I am delighted.

First of all: @jimthefish @nick @pedant @scaryb Thanks for reassuring me, felt all warm and fuzzy 😉

@jimthefish Thanks for that very detailed reply! But can you please explain to me what a continuity porn is to you? (As you said here: “A plot that hinged on decades-old continuity porn would go down like a lead balloon, I think…”)
It might be me… but is porn really the right word? Is there a context for that word I have missed out so far? My best guess right now would be that some fans would get off on continuity?…? Thanks for the laugh! And looking forward to your explanation.

RE: Knowledge that must never be spoken – Anyone has found something that could potentially fit the description?

@phaseshift “5. I will be wrong again. In the roulette wheel of plot points, the house (SM) always wins.„ Nice analogy

@wolfweed Nice hatstand indeed.

@pedant I agree that the Doctor came to terms with loneliness as his punishment. His desire to end his loneliness is there, but I don’t think it is desperate. He would go through more trouble finding people. I would imagine him acting like a hyper attentive dog.

@scaryb Yes, most of the things we came up with will be wrong.
But it would be SO great if we could hit something bulls-eye. I felt like that when I figured out that we are not discovering the secret but the grave a few hours before TNOTD was broadcasted and was actually right.
The more ideas we have the more probable it is that we dig out SOMEthing. I have tried “If I were Steven Moffat, what would I like to do?” – just a blank mind. What about you? If you were Steven Moffat, what would be a really important outcome for you?
Well now I can think of one thing: 11’s death. But that is not helpful.

I am with @bluesqueakpip on everything concerning River’s child. Especially the explanation why River would keep (presumably) her of of the way. River’s reaction doesn’t say anything as the Doctor taught her quite a bit. The Doctor lies. And so does River. Has to. Time-traveler 😉

“In the conference call scene, River’s obviously offended or in pain when Clara doesn’t know who she is. We’ll have to wait and see whether she was simply offended that the Doctor doesn’t even mention her, or couldn’t hide her pain that her own daughter had absolutely no idea who ‘River Song’ was – not even whether she was a man or a woman.” Rings very true and probable in my ears.

@scaryb Somehow I like that 12 is the father (in this very far-fetched theory – would change the story quite a bit and might move it away from a family program). I also like the idea in general that he reserves some days for his future self. For when he is sad, alone, desperate or really needs help. He did go back to Amy and Rory after he lost them in that cube story.
He might have gone to to the singing towers just before he had to regenerate himself.

@Shazzbot “Which kinda ties in with this current speculation on River-Doctor progeny. I’ve always imagined that in an actual partnership of the two, River would definitely be in charge. And the Doctor would be left holding the baby … ” I can so see that! But he would also enjoy that immensely.

@blenkinsopthebrave That makes so much sense to me. It would also explain that the Doctor said “but you and me” and made kissing noises and was quite contempt. He wouldn’t get that from her name on the cot, would he? Why else was it important how he looked? Looking amazing for the child of your friends? He’d “better be”?
Darn it, it will all turn out for nothing and just wishful thinking. But I am delighted that River snatched a prime spot in theorizing for now ;D

Cheers,

Timeloop

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@nick I was talking about ‘The Moment’.
Well thanks anyway for giving me some perspective then. Really wholeheartedly appreciated. Maybe because it is the first one I made up and I am overreacting…?

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant My first part was no fanfic. It was a transcript of the actual episodes.

I am quite astonished that the idea is attacked so much. It is just as likely as Omega being the Big Bad or Susan coming back.

@jimthefish In which way is it fanboy? My definition of fanboy is someone who likes everything from one certain source without ever challenging it. For example Apple fanboys and every Apple product ever produced. I do not think that is quite it, do you?
I do agree that it might turn out wrong and is highly unlikely. But so have been other theories in this forum.

I dare all of you to come up with something that fits “knowledge that must never be spoken”

[Timeloop @replies]

@pedant @scaryb

It is also explained by the Timelords in the same episode @whohar mentioned (copied from here)

RASSILON: What news of the Doctor?
CHANCELLOR: Disappeared, my Lord President.
PARTISAN: (a woman) But we know his intention. He still possesses the Moment, and he’ll use it to destroy Daleks and Time Lords alike.
CHANCELLOR: The Visionary confirms it.
(The Visionary is the woman at the end of the table. She has henna tattoos on her face and hands.)
VISIONARY: Ending, burning, falling. All of it falling. The black and pitch and screaming fire, so burning.
CHANCELLOR: All of her prophecies say the same. That this is the last day of the Time War. That Gallifrey falls. That we die, today.
VISIONARY: Ending. Ending. Ending. Ending!
PARTISAN: Perhaps it’s time. This is only the furthest edge of the Time War. But at its heart, millions die every second, lost in bloodlust and insanity. With time itself resurrecting them, to find new ways of dying over and over again. A travesty of life. Isn’t it better to end it, at last?
RASSILON: Thank you for your opinion.

AND in the Doctor’s Wife there is this:

HOUSE [OC]: We are in your universe now, Doctor. Why should it matter to me in which room you die? I can kill you just as easily here as anywhere. Fear me. I’ve killed hundreds of Time Lords.
DOCTOR: Fear me. I’ve killed all of them.

A Youtube comment of the video I posted in fan creativity expands on the idea: ” rmader989

He didn’t just let them die, he killed them all on purpose. Rassilon had convinced the Time Lords that the only way to win the Time War was to activate a weapon that would negate existence, turning the Time Lords into energy beings and destroying the rest of the universe, all of time and space. The Doctor came into possession of a thought-weapon called “The Moment” When he learned of Rassilon’s plan, he placed a time-lock on the time-war and used The Moment to kill everything inside. ”

 

[Timeloop @replies]

I’m not sure where to post videos – it is kind of creativity? But also sums up some part of Doctor Who or underlines a certain part?

Is this a good place to post them @craig ? Is there a better place? I don’t want to annoy people with videos where they do not expect them. But I do feel they are a special category. Should I hyperlink them so it dosen’t slow down browsers?

Does the rest of you spend more time on pictures?

Anyway here is the video I wanted to share. It is related to the Time War.

[Timeloop @replies]

@blenkinsopthebrave Okay, here are my thoughts for the 50th in no particular order:

I see in my crystal ball that:

• We will see Galifrey, the Time War and “The Moment”
• The Time Lock will stay in place
• Matt might be regenerating at the end as a cliffhanger. I somehow cannot believe that there will be a full regeneration in the Christmas episode. It is just not in the spirit of Christmas and if I remember correctly the last one was very much so. Although it would give Moffat more time to make it as painful as possible  which is what he promised…? He did even tease Matt at ComicCon about his death scene (yes I searched through the whole video to find that reference)
  Clearly I haven’t decided yet.
• The Zygons are in possession of ‘the Moment’ – the Doctor hid it there
• IF we do see the Silence they will be presented under different circumstances – maybe assisting a cause of the Doctor in the long run
• The Doctor has to relive and slightly change his own past to escape? Presuming all is flux because he is in his own time stream. Then again – that would be leaning on JTTCOTT
• My build up expectations will disappoint me.
• Clara will not be related to the Doctor – that thought is somehow revolting to me
• Clara is in some way connected to River – They use the same expressions for crying out loud. I hope do I get around making a list. I felt constantly reminded of River in the second half of season 7
• I think the regeneration limit is a given
• I agree that the Zygons themselves will not be super improtant

I do understand that I am alone in thinking of “The moment” as important for the 50th. But since this website is all for bonkers theorizing, I will stick with it. I might add more to the list later on.

@whohar

Doesn’t it often start as namedropping and then becomes something more? The fall of the 11th, or Jim the Fish, hidden in plain side in the Medusa cascade… I’m fine with mentioning things and explaining them later, planting ideas so they can be picked up as loose ends later. It was kind of necessary for the dialog you refer to though. He had to provide evidence why the Time War was so devastating.
But I see your point of view. I hope we agree that it is nice not to think uni-solo because there would be nothing left to discuss in this fabulous place.
It is just that there is no other thing I would put in the category of “knowledge that must never be spoken”.

I know that quite a lot of you didn’t like ROA because Clara saved the day. Well, now we know why, don’t we? I do love 11s speech and this video is a salute to 50 years of Doctor Who (including old Who). Just don’t watch it if you don’t like ROA.

 

[Timeloop @replies]

@adlerinthelibrary Thanks for that! I find it fascinating to see just how far  Doctor Who fans are spread around the world. The globally demand is way bigger than I expected it to be.
And welcome to the active side of this forum! Feel free to join in and give all of us a little more to consider 😉

[Timeloop @replies]

@whohar Did you watch it on a computer? What are you thoughts on the Moment?

@blenkinsopthebrave I agree that it is not on that poster by mistkae. But I cannot make anything of it. Any ideas to get us started?

[Author]

Posts